Advanced Gunnery

Hyperspace Assault

Dangerous Territory

MC80 Assault Cruiser

General Madine

Defiance

Intel Officer

Engine Techs

Electronic Countermeasures

Redundant Shields

MC80 Battle Cruiser

Endeavour

Intel Officer

Gunnery Team

Engine Techs

X17 Turbo Lasers

GR-75 Medium Transports

Bright Hope

Coms Net

4x YT-2400

Bang on 400

Generally though just wondering how useful two fairly manuverable capital ships would be backed up by squadrons that don't need to be supported. Transport can be feeding whatever tokens I need to my big 2. Will I need the other title option for the Transports to keep up with the captial ships thanks to Engine Techs?

Anyone?

1. Defiance title works best with high activation fleets.

2. three activations in the whole fleet is very risky. you have 3 activations, so you cant delay your important activations, 0 bid, and just 5 deployments(=3 ships + 2 x 2 squadrons), so not very tacticaly flexible.

(note: always keep the golden 3 in mind; initiative bid, activations, deployments. while maxing them isn't necessarily ideal, flunking ALL of them imho is dangerous)

in order for it to be feasible with 3 activations, 5 deployments and 0 bid, ok MAYBE it could work but you gotta have some ENORMOUS trick up your sleeve. some weird shenanigan or huge RAW FORCE. I just don't see it. large capital ships can be destroyed like all others. like... its just 20 total hullpoints, dude. sure, awesome shields, crazy spinning maneuverability, but nothing special in terms of raw force(since, like I said, you HAVE lost on tactical flexibility)

3. there IS a way this can work; 2 CHEAPER capital ships(just less upgrades), + flotilla with bomber command center + garm bel iblis to fill your big ships with tokens. that should be about 300 points (125 approx. per ship plus garm + bomber command). so you have approx. 100 points for bombers- example, Jan Ors + 5 x-wings + 2 y-wings= 104 points. you'll have 3 activations but 7 deployments. LOTS more deployment shenanigans and threats on the table.

but multiple rogue(=expensive) squadrons and very few ships IMHO cannot work. not in this meta.

You have to ask yourself two questions.

One is already mentioned by Kikaze. What are you doing against a fleet with more ship activations. You will have no choice of initative with exact 400 points. And if your opponent has more ships, he can double tap you, and just fly in, give you a broadside, and fly away without any chance of you to fire back.

The second question is: what are you doing against a lot of squadrons.

4 YT2400 are nice. But not really much against a heavy squadron list. And a good Rhymerball will blow away your nice MC80 without much chance of you to do something against it.

Sadly you have no answer to either question. So, as Kikaze said, you have few ships and few squadrons. And this way problem with most fleets.

You put quite a lot of upgrades on each MC80. But 30% on upgrades, based on the basic price of the ship, is really a bit to much.

So my suggestion as well. Reduce the upgrades on each MC80 to the most necessary ones. And either increase the squadrons, or add 1-2 more ships.

Is Hyperspace assault just a throw away objective for you? Putting the GR75 in reserve hardly seems like an advantage. It has no guns and splitting your fighters that way wont be sensible.

I would downgrade to a Star cruiser and command cruiser to save a good chunk of points while only trading some red dice for blue. With engine techs and the extra yaws from the admiral you are fast enough to get to medium range easily. Move Xi7s to the Defiance and swap out Endeavour for Mon Karren.

Generally though just wondering how useful two fairly manuverable capital ships would be backed up by squadrons that don't need to be supported. Transport can be feeding whatever tokens I need to my big 2. Will I need the other title option for the Transports to keep up with the captial ships thanks to Engine Techs?

Others have already pointed out some of the shortcomings of the list. But to address Jaime's original questions: The capital ship idea is viable (see final battles at Gen Con), but why not support your squadrons a bit? You have the squadron command values necessary so don't feel like you can only take YT's - they're expensive and get you fewer deployments for the buck.

As far as needing Quantum Storm? Not necessarily as your Assault Cruiser is only speed 3 even with ET's.

However, if you really want this list to work I think you need different objectives. As you'll often be going second, you want objectives that will help dictate the opponent's actions as much as possible, since you'll likely be out-deployed and out-activated. Adv. Gunnery is ok, but is a double edged sword. If the opponent focuses on your target ship and takes it down (not hard with bombers, etc) he'll have just earned a huge bundle of points. Instead, try Most Wanted. You can choose your opponent's most powerful ship, which you now get an extra dice for shooting at. In return you assign your puny little transport and make it run. Your opponent must now choose between exposing his biggest ship to your firepower, vs hiding it safely and dropping his fleet effectiveness.

HA doesn't offer you any benefits. Try Fire Lanes or Contested Outpost. Both tie your ships down to a specific area of space (which means you probably won't be using your Engine Techs) but really force the enemy to move into your fire arcs. Of the two Fire Lanes offers more potential points and the greater urgency for your opponent to come to you. Contested Outpost allows you to use your transport to "hold" the station temporarily and frees your cap ships up a bit to do more maneuvering.

For blue objectives Intel Sweep probably offers the most control of where your opponent must move. Here equipping Quantum Storm instead of Bright Hope might be better as speed 4 equivalent really helps the transport snag objectives, and the scatter token does a decent job at keeping the ship alive. Just remember to keep it at long range as much as possible. Minefields may also work but gives your opponent less incentive to come out toward you.

Some brilliant advice here. Thank you all will take it on board and come back with a revised version.

Ok, how about this:

Most Wanted

Contested Outpost

Dangerous Territory

MC80 Command Cruiser

General Madine

Engine Techs

Boosted Comms

Electronic Counter Measures

MC80 Star Cruiser

Mon Karren

Gunnery Team

Engine Techs

GR-75 Transports

Bright Hope

Comms Net

Jan Ors

4x X-Wings

2x Y-Wings

387 total

I guess my main question now is how much do I need Bomber Command on the GR-75? There is also Flight Controllers to consider. If I have a strong first turn bid do I still need the GR-75 at all?

Thanks all again.

bomber command is great, I'd find the points for it. This fleet is a run fast and ram tons of damage down your throat fleet, and bomber command will help maximize that moreso than passing a few conc fire tokens will

I agree. Drop engine techs from the star cruiser as it can already reach speed 3 with plenty of yaws. Upgrade comms net to BCC. Depending on how much bid you like possibly take XI7 on the command cruiser or upgrade a Y Wing to Dutch.

Ok, now I'm pondering X-17s vs the Engine Techs on the Star Cruiser. Hmm... Got a really strong first turn bid though:

Most Wanted

Contested Outpost

Dangerous Territory

MC80 Command Cruiser

Garm Bel Iblis

X17 Turbo Lasers

Engine Techs

Boosted Comms

Electronic Countermeasures

MC80 Star Cruiser

Mon Karren

Gunnery Team

GR-75 Transports

Bright Hope

Bomber Command Centre

Jan Ors

Dutch Vander

Wedge Antillies

3x X-Wing

388

Edited*

ditch the star cruiser engine techs so both capital ships have same speed. buy xi7s for the COMMAND CRUISER.

at that point, I think your list seems real good. 6 deployments, 3 activations, preposterous bid for a non-blackdice-based list, mon karren firepower, xi7s command cruiser firepower... and 5 bombers with jan ors and bomber command center.

sounds scary even if someone brings truly massed bombers to take down your large ships, you have an antisquadron specialist(dutch) + 4 x-wings... should put some real hurt on him.

Edited my last post.