And what's so bad about large ships?

Large ships that are more maneuverable than small fighters is a bit silly.

Silly is subjective. This is a game with space ships that fly like WW2 fighter planes. On a 2d mat. With no altitude indicators.

Side note, are inertial dampers (or what ever they are called) canon? How much inertia is cancelled by high tech stuff on these ships? 50%? 90%? 100%? Is stress a measurement of the strain on the system that cancels inertia? Should the CR90 be the fastest ship since it's got HUGE engines?

And what's so bad about large ships?

Large ships that are more maneuverable than small fighters is a bit silly.

Silly is subjective. This is a game with space ships that fly like WW2 fighter planes. On a 2d mat. With no altitude indicators.

Side note, are inertial dampers (or what ever they are called) canon? How much inertia is cancelled by high tech stuff on these ships? 50%? 90%? 100%? Is stress a measurement of the strain on the system that cancels inertia? Should the CR90 be the fastest ship since it's got HUGE engines?

It's Lucas Trademark DENSE VACUUM.

That's why when engines are blown, the ship stops, instead of staying on course at same speed, and engines WORK ALL THE TIME,

The Kihrazx Fighter could use a better dial

The HWK is the one I can see that needs a HUGE improvement on the dial.

All large ships with PWT. These are too fast, so they shouldn't have 3-speed manoeuvers, except for maybe K-turn and forward.

Most of them are either fast patrol crafts or space V-12 flying engines of doom.

go check YT-2400, it's a corvett-size engine with a tiny crew compartment and a turret slapped onto it.

Or JM5k, a ship that has an engine fast enough for scout duty and powerful enough to make it swirl on a spot when full-powered.

So what? The TIE-Interceptor is basically a cockpit strapped to an engine. Still it is slower than the YT-1300. Any large ship with a 4 can move 10 small-ship lengths in one turn, while the interceptor caps out at 8. 20% difference. You would not have a chase of TIE-Fighters against the Falcon if the falcon would have been that much faster.

All large ships with PWT. These are too fast, so they shouldn't have 3-speed manoeuvers, except for maybe K-turn and forward.

Most of them are either fast patrol crafts or space V-12 flying engines of doom.go check YT-2400, it's a corvett-size engine with a tiny crew compartment and a turret slapped onto it.Or JM5k, a ship that has an engine fast enough for scout duty and powerful enough to make it swirl on a spot when full-powered.

So what? The TIE-Interceptor is basically a cockpit strapped to an engine. Still it is slower than the YT-1300. Any large ship with a 4 can move 10 small-ship lengths in one turn, while the interceptor caps out at 8. 20% difference. You would not have a chase of TIE-Fighters against the Falcon if the falcon would have been that much faster.

In ROTJ the Falcon was chasing down Squints. In Empire the Falcon was in pieces right before taking off and wasn't 100%. And they were flying through asteroids so that would have slowed them more. In ANH Han was confident he could catch the lone sentry TIE so even then the falcon was faster than even starndard TIEs.

Give the E-wing green 2 turns and 4fwd. It absolutely has to be played like an arcdodger to go anywhere, and doesnt have the green economy to do it.

Dont care if it buffs corran. Corran isnt a powerhouse like people make him out to be, hes just "good"

Lambda Shuttle needs a freakin' overhaul. Dont care if almost its entire dial is red that thing should have full 1-3 access, its suppose to be able to maneuver in tight spaces in order to dock yet it cant turn for gak for some reason. Actually, hell, play into that mentality. Give it the ability to rotate 90 degrees when it does a 0speed lol

Firespray could use some more greens too.

LAMBDA.

Needs more red.

Nooooooooooooooooooo

And I agree that the Starviper, HWK and the TIE Advanced need a bit of upward tweeking....same as the Jumpmaster needs to be (half) tweeked-down so it is off-ballanced.

I'd like it if the T-65 K-turn was white.

My suggestion would be to give the Starviper a K turn of some kind. The S turns are nice, but I think having the utility of a K-turn (3 or 4) would help out this lackluster/high pointed ship...

All large ships with PWT. These are too fast, so they shouldn't have 3-speed manoeuvers, except for maybe K-turn and forward.

Most of them are either fast patrol crafts or space V-12 flying engines of doom.go check YT-2400, it's a corvett-size engine with a tiny crew compartment and a turret slapped onto it.Or JM5k, a ship that has an engine fast enough for scout duty and powerful enough to make it swirl on a spot when full-powered.

So what? The TIE-Interceptor is basically a cockpit strapped to an engine. Still it is slower than the YT-1300. Any large ship with a 4 can move 10 small-ship lengths in one turn, while the interceptor caps out at 8. 20% difference. You would not have a chase of TIE-Fighters against the Falcon if the falcon would have been that much faster.

In ROTJ the Falcon was chasing down Squints. In Empire the Falcon was in pieces right before taking off and wasn't 100%. And they were flying through asteroids so that would have slowed them more. In ANH Han was confident he could catch the lone sentry TIE so even then the falcon was faster than even starndard TIEs.

I'd introduce new templates for the large ships, similar to the Epic ones, so the 1 forward would cover the same distance for small and large ships, and then cut down the insane dials.

Echoing what others have said. There are just too many maneuvers on the large base ships. These zippy fighters should be able to outmaneuver them with ease. Also it would be nice to see less maneuver options in general for most ships, as it would give you more of a reason to choose lighter armored, more maneuverable ships such as Interceptors, A-Wings and Tie Fighters.

Echoing what others have said. There are just too many maneuvers on the large base ships. These zippy fighters should be able to outmaneuver them with ease. Also it would be nice to see less maneuver options in general for most ships, as it would give you more of a reason to choose lighter armored, more maneuverable ships such as Interceptors, A-Wings and Tie Fighters.

With ease? Nah. But they should not be unable to even close the distance unless you reach the end of the map. Large ships are simply too fast.

Large ships as a whole should never have had faster than 3fwd on their dials. No 3 banks, no 3 turns, no 4/5fwds (4k i'd be fine with).

Large ships as a whole should never have had faster than 3fwd on their dials. No 3 banks, no 3 turns, no 4/5fwds (4k i'd be fine with).

Originally they had in playtesting the standard barrel roll as well, which moves them 3 small based to the left or right. The devs soon noticed how silly that was on a large base ship.^-^

Faster isn't the issue, maneuverability is.

If the X-Wing game mat was a 20 foot long narrow strip, then that would make more sense. Of course the Falcon would win a drag race... but the game takes place on a small square for dogfighting where ships are continuously twisting and turning.

That's not what freighters, patrol craft, and large mass objects are designed for, as that requires tons of momentum and inertia to maneuver.

Or the fact that it escaped the asteroid belt where TIEs also had a problem?

Or dash flying the final mission in the game, also small tight corridors that needed good manuevers.

Starting to look at it... TIE dials need to be almost all red...

Momentum and inertia are completely alien mechanics to starwars as a whole.

Starwars consistently makes the stupid fast and agile ships (fighters/interceptors) capable of slow sharp turns, when in reality they shouldnt ever be able to do that without applying huge g-forces on the pilot. People seem to think that stuff only applies in the atmosphere...no thats airflow (which affects HOW you turn, doesnt affect the effects of turning).

The super blazing fast ships shouldnt even have 1speeds technically, and a 2hard should be red if its there at all, but they have access to a 4bank/turn. Flipside, the freighters should be complete 1-2 speed access with ease, but they are outran in the blink of an eye. If you are moving slow, you can do a sharp turn, anybody that drives a CAR knows that. If you are whizzing at top speed, if you try to do anything more than a wide turn youre going to spin out of control (or in the air/space, flatspin and suffer huge g-forces).

Momentum and inertia are completely alien mechanics to starwars as a whole.

Starwars consistently makes the stupid fast and agile ships (fighters/interceptors) capable of slow sharp turns, when in reality they shouldnt ever be able to do that without applying huge g-forces on the pilot. People seem to think that stuff only applies in the atmosphere...no thats airflow (which affects HOW you turn, doesnt affect the effects of turning).

The super blazing fast ships shouldnt even have 1speeds technically, and a 2hard should be red if its there at all, but they have access to a 4bank/turn. Flipside, the freighters should be complete 1-2 speed access with ease, but they are outran in the blink of an eye. If you are moving slow, you can do a sharp turn, anybody that drives a CAR knows that. If you are whizzing at top speed, if you try to do anything more than a wide turn youre going to spin out of control (or in the air/space, flatspin and suffer huge g-forces).

This would be an interesting change to all the ships.

Momentum and inertia are completely alien mechanics to starwars as a whole.

Starwars consistently makes the stupid fast and agile ships (fighters/interceptors) capable of slow sharp turns, when in reality they shouldnt ever be able to do that without applying huge g-forces on the pilot. People seem to think that stuff only applies in the atmosphere...no thats airflow (which affects HOW you turn, doesnt affect the effects of turning).

The super blazing fast ships shouldnt even have 1speeds technically, and a 2hard should be red if its there at all, but they have access to a 4bank/turn. Flipside, the freighters should be complete 1-2 speed access with ease, but they are outran in the blink of an eye. If you are moving slow, you can do a sharp turn, anybody that drives a CAR knows that. If you are whizzing at top speed, if you try to do anything more than a wide turn youre going to spin out of control (or in the air/space, flatspin and suffer huge g-forces).

This right here. Don't apply real world logic to star wars. It doesnt work. But we also have the X-wing and tie fighter games that show that the MF and firespray could keep up with the smaller ships just fine. So no reason to change large ships just cause of the real world thing.

Faster isn't the issue, maneuverability is.

If the X-Wing game mat was a 20 foot long narrow strip, then that would make more sense. Of course the Falcon would win a drag race... but the game takes place on a small square for dogfighting where ships are continuously twisting and turning.

That's not what freighters, patrol craft, and large mass objects are designed for, as that requires tons of momentum and inertia to maneuver.

You mean like how that space freighter maneuvered tight death star corridors the smaller ties had a hard time in? Yep, they don't deserve those low speed turns.

Or the fact that it escaped the asteroid belt where TIEs also had a problem?

Or dash flying the final mission in the game, also small tight corridors that needed good manuevers.

Starting to look at it... TIE dials need to be almost all red...

Is every large ship the Millennium Falcon or the Outrider?

By your logic, I think a more reasonable solution would be to make grant better dials to legendary ship titles and high pilot-skill aces.

Momentum and inertia are completely alien mechanics to starwars as a whole.

Starwars consistently makes the stupid fast and agile ships (fighters/interceptors) capable of slow sharp turns, when in reality they shouldnt ever be able to do that without applying huge g-forces on the pilot. People seem to think that stuff only applies in the atmosphere...no thats airflow (which affects HOW you turn, doesnt affect the effects of turning).

The super blazing fast ships shouldnt even have 1speeds technically, and a 2hard should be red if its there at all, but they have access to a 4bank/turn. Flipside, the freighters should be complete 1-2 speed access with ease, but they are outran in the blink of an eye. If you are moving slow, you can do a sharp turn, anybody that drives a CAR knows that. If you are whizzing at top speed, if you try to do anything more than a wide turn youre going to spin out of control (or in the air/space, flatspin and suffer huge g-forces).

This right here. Don't apply real world logic to star wars. It doesnt work. But we also have the X-wing and tie fighter games that show that the MF and firespray could keep up with the smaller ships just fine. So no reason to change large ships just cause of the real world thing.

Nah, not really. The X-Wing games portrait even X-Wings as slugfest and YT-1300 and YT-2000 are an exercise in patience. They have a max speed of iirc 75MGL (or 100 with all energy to the thrusters) while interceptors have a default max speed of 110 MGL and go up to iirc something around 140 to 160 mgl. Turn-rates are leaps away from each other too. And some of the Advanced experimental fighters even reach over 200 mgl. The Freighters are sluggish and can not just outrun TIE-Fighters. Superior flying at the other hand, having pilots who actually still navigate better in the dense superstructures of the Death Star or through asteroids while TIE-Academy pilots just crash into stuff. Now that is totally based on pilot skill. Lando flies successful into the Death Star despite being in a YT-1300 and not because he is in such a heavy ship. Though those two quad-laser cannon turrets should do plenty of extra damage too, like being able to fire your pwt 3 dice attack twice per turn. ,-)

Faster isn't the issue, maneuverability is.

If the X-Wing game mat was a 20 foot long narrow strip, then that would make more sense. Of course the Falcon would win a drag race... but the game takes place on a small square for dogfighting where ships are continuously twisting and turning.

That's not what freighters, patrol craft, and large mass objects are designed for, as that requires tons of momentum and inertia to maneuver.

You mean like how that space freighter maneuvered tight death star corridors the smaller ties had a hard time in? Yep, they don't deserve those low speed turns.

Or the fact that it escaped the asteroid belt where TIEs also had a problem?

Or dash flying the final mission in the game, also small tight corridors that needed good manuevers.

Starting to look at it... TIE dials need to be almost all red...

Is every large ship the Millennium Falcon or the Outrider?

By your logic, I think a more reasonable solution would be to make grant better dials to legendary ship titles and high pilot-skill aces.

Dash Rendar ignores obstacles during activation for exactly that reason. The new Falcon Title gives you an S-loop iirc. But for complexitiy reasons it would be a bad idea to freely change the dials based on pilot skill. We have tons of pilot abilities which allow extra post-manveur movements to represent this difference in skill. If you can boost and barrel roll afterwards, your dial improves indirectly already a ton.

Faster isn't the issue, maneuverability is.

If the X-Wing game mat was a 20 foot long narrow strip, then that would make more sense. Of course the Falcon would win a drag race... but the game takes place on a small square for dogfighting where ships are continuously twisting and turning.

That's not what freighters, patrol craft, and large mass objects are designed for, as that requires tons of momentum and inertia to maneuver.

You mean like how that space freighter maneuvered tight death star corridors the smaller ties had a hard time in? Yep, they don't deserve those low speed turns.

Or the fact that it escaped the asteroid belt where TIEs also had a problem?

Or dash flying the final mission in the game, also small tight corridors that needed good manuevers.

Starting to look at it... TIE dials need to be almost all red...

Is every large ship the Millennium Falcon or the Outrider?

By your logic, I think a more reasonable solution would be to make grant better dials to legendary ship titles and high pilot-skill aces.

Dash Rendar ignores obstacles during activation for exactly that reason. The new Falcon Title gives you an S-loop iirc. But for complexitiy reasons it would be a bad idea to freely change the dials based on pilot skill. We have tons of pilot abilities which allow extra post-manveur movements to represent this difference in skill. If you can boost and barrel roll afterwards, your dial improves indirectly already a ton.

I wasn't being serious with my suggestion. I was just following through with the logic of someone using scenes of aces in legendary ships flying better than average-joe pilots, as if it were only depictions of the stock ships' capabilities and not the modifications done to them and the pilots controlling them.

the original Falcon title should have just been "After performing a non-turn maneuver, if you did not bump or overlap an obstacle, you may perform another 1FWD maneuver" and its dial be stupid slow and clunky. The FALCON is fast because its engines are augmented to hell and back, the YT1300 is not fast.

Being able to double-basehop at speed2 would make the Falcon specifically pretty fast, but only in a straight line or slight turn. iirc the Falcon has never been super nimble, just high top speed.

Faster isn't the issue, maneuverability is.

If the X-Wing game mat was a 20 foot long narrow strip, then that would make more sense. Of course the Falcon would win a drag race... but the game takes place on a small square for dogfighting where ships are continuously twisting and turning.

That's not what freighters, patrol craft, and large mass objects are designed for, as that requires tons of momentum and inertia to maneuver.

You mean like how that space freighter maneuvered tight death star corridors the smaller ties had a hard time in? Yep, they don't deserve those low speed turns.

Or the fact that it escaped the asteroid belt where TIEs also had a problem?

Or dash flying the final mission in the game, also small tight corridors that needed good manuevers.

Starting to look at it... TIE dials need to be almost all red...

Is every large ship the Millennium Falcon or the Outrider?

By your logic, I think a more reasonable solution would be to make grant better dials to legendary ship titles and high pilot-skill aces.

Dash Rendar ignores obstacles during activation for exactly that reason. The new Falcon Title gives you an S-loop iirc. But for complexitiy reasons it would be a bad idea to freely change the dials based on pilot skill. We have tons of pilot abilities which allow extra post-manveur movements to represent this difference in skill. If you can boost and barrel roll afterwards, your dial improves indirectly already a ton.

I wasn't being serious with my suggestion. I was just following through with the logic of someone using scenes of aces in legendary ships flying better than average-joe pilots, as if it were only depictions of the stock ships' capabilities and not the modifications done to them and the pilots controlling them.

Thing is, thanks to engine upgrade even a large ship doing a straight 2 can be as faster as a stock TIE-Fighter anyway. So I would say we have those upgrades anyway, engine boost is in that Falcon Box for a reason, why the ship has a straight 4 as well is beyond me ^-^

That whole "fasted ship in the galaxy" was referring to its hyperspace engines and nav computer, not its sublights. ^-^

pretty sure the races the Falcon won werent done at light speed