PS: Obviously Poe is terrible, he's in an X-Wing. He's about as close to playable as a T70 can get, but he's still garbage in the modern meta. Maybe Heroes of the Resistance will help fix this, but from what's been spoiled so far I think Poe is staying in the Plano with the rest of the X-Wings for a long time.

With prices so darn similar, Corran seems to me like he'll always be a smarter choice than Poe. He's a bit less survivable, but with FCS and his double-tap Corran actually has a chance of killing some of the ships that define the meta right now. The offensive output of X-Wings has always been hot garbage, but with so many tanky super jousters and turtled defensive ships these days, rolling ~2 Hits per attack with 25-35 point ships with arcs and minimal repositioning is a surefire way to lose every game.

You were expecting better from a Wedge rehash to justify a new character? Oh, you meant the card.

I don't understand this. Wedge and Poe are nothing alike in the films outside of filling an "ace pilot" role.

Wedge has, quite literally, no personality. He is a name and a face attached to a few piloting feats during the three films. Even his "Wow-ee, that got him" line when he trips the AT-AT is delivered with so little human emotion and enthusiasm you'd have to think Wedge might actually be a robot....expect we've seen droids in Star Wars and they have a ton of personality (e.g. Threepio).

Poe , while also an "ace pilot" at least has some personality. He's cocky and confident with a sense of humor. I couldn't describe Wedge's personality with any characteristics other than "stoic."

You probably are ignoring the vast amount of books and video games where Wedge is exactly as you described Poe.

You were expecting better from a Wedge rehash to justify a new character? Oh, you meant the card.

I don't understand this. Wedge and Poe are nothing alike in the films outside of filling an "ace pilot" role.

Wedge has, quite literally, no personality. He is a name and a face attached to a few piloting feats during the three films. Even his "Wow-ee, that got him" line when he trips the AT-AT is delivered with so little human emotion and enthusiasm you'd have to think Wedge might actually be a robot....expect we've seen droids in Star Wars and they have a ton of personality (e.g. Threepio).

Poe , while also an "ace pilot" at least has some personality. He's cocky and confident with a sense of humor. I couldn't describe Wedge's personality with any characteristics other than "stoic."

You probably are ignoring the vast amount of books and video games where Wedge is exactly as you described Poe.

Of course I am, because most of them are awful.

I read the entirety of the X-Wing series way back when, and Poe, Tycho, Wes, and Corran all struck me as having the exact same cookie-cutter personality: sarcastic and sardonic and flat. If you jumbled up all of their dialogue and attributed it to those characters at random, it wouldn't change the story of the personalities at all.

So...hes got PS advantage and 2 re positioning abilities to 1...and repeatedly jousts?

So...hes got PS advantage and 2 re positioning abilities to 1...and repeatedly jousts?

If you've played much of these two ships, my sense is Poe was probably using his moves to arc dodge but not getting shots himself while doing so. Since the X7 can simply K-Turn add naseum to ensure shots, after a joust Poe has to do some bank or turn maneuver (though if Poe wants to use BB8's BR he has to Bank or go straight, so either Hard Turns or BR are out of the equation). This means Poe will not have a shot, but can probably BR/Boost out of the Defender's shot. Poe has to continue banking + barrel rolling or hard-turning to get back around to get the defender in arc. When Poe can accomplish this, it'll almost certainly be the case that the Defender has Poe in arc too.

So Poe can either keep positioning such that neither ship can shoot, or can in an effort to roll red dice settle for a situation where both ships are shooting. Because against a K-Turning Focus+Evade x7, it's not very likely Poe can manufacture many turns with a quality shot and no return fire.

I mean, I'm getting sick of these "Armchair Pilots" and their unnerving commitment to the idea that the game is balanced. Sure, on paper Poe has better PS and potential access to two repositions a turn (if he forgoes hard turns, red maneuvers, and his pilot ability on those turns he repositions). But on the table things are different and this situation is heavily stacked against this Poe.. He's not f'in Soontir Fel, who can BR+Boost every turn in any order after he moves, and he doesn't get a free Focus when he does it, he has to BR first before he moves and only if he's gone green and if he boosts he gets no mods to his dice. While that's pretty good for an X-Wing, it's pretty janky for any other sort of playable ace.

Even a Regen version of Poe can't really hope to kill this Defender if the clock has mostly run out, all a Regen Poe could do is hope to turtle up and beat the thing on time by virtue of costing more points.

Its poorly built Poe what sucks

I've been in an x7 end game scenario with a proper Regen Poe

What happens is pascist-wing,ie the perfect rendition of the utter futility of violence BECAUSE NO ONE EVER TAKES DAMAGE

It's a goddamn nightmare but its balanced (except Poe wins on points)

Also, because ARCs, I've been in the same exact endgame scenario with r2d2 norra and it is

The

Exact

Same

Thing

Just yesterday I had a riveting game of 3 x7s versus 3 ARCs (Biggs is an honorary ARC)

ONE HOUR AND 15 MINUTES later, the first x7 died

And then Biggs

Turns out fully modified offense v fully modified defense is as much a wash as barely modified offense v barely modified defense

How did 3 x7 defenders fail to kill biggs for an hour and 15 minutes? What build?

if Biggs lasted that long against 3 3die ships then either that defender player sucks major balls and kept losing shots, or his dice reaaaaally hated him.

Ive never had Biggs last more than 2 rounds once i start hitting him. I dont ever try to dodge his ability, it never works it always forces atleast 1 of your ships to splitfire on him which only plays into your opponents hands.

Poe had two main builds -

BB8 he's an arc-dodger, give him , autothrusters and PtL. Unfortunately his PS is high enough to beat other aces at this game. This should change when we get the new Poe in the black ship.

With an astromech droid that can regen shields he is the last surviving Jouster. Regen Poe should take Preditor (or something like it) and he is going to be spending his 1 and only action on focus and go in for the kill. When he takes a shot or two he runs away and recharges. This is the Poe that I have seen be effective.

However if you are fighting Delta Squadrons you should be able to make the arc-dodger Poe work, but remember, if you go down that arc-dodging road and you fail to arc-dodge you dead.

I agree with most of the other posters. The problem in this scenario isn't that poe sucks. the problem is the defender is a better jouster and poe was built here to arc dodge, and didn't. I mean what did you guys expect?

This is a situation where two players didn't understand the strategies of the game, and wanna blame balance, or weakness of the cards. Thats not the case at all here.

Well that's just not taking certain factors into consideration, first defenders are not knife fighters they don't want to be at range one which is why it only happened once after that I used speed 5 straight and k turns to keep my distance.

You can't arc dodge easily when your at range 3.

And suggesting me of all people doesn't know how defenders work is funny.

Miranda is the primo Rebel Regen ship of choice.

fixed

Miranda is a goddamn boss monster no matter what she does

seriously, the most underrated pilot in the game even after she made a showing at worlds !

(could've placed higher, but my god dem red dice v nathan...)

Arent we less than a year from Poe winning the World flipping Championship? Being in both top two lists? I know some stuff has changed but now he's garbage? Hard to believe.

Do you know what's amazing. About the tie defender fix? It actually does what it says they're supposed to do in fluff: they're the superiority fighter. The super fighter. Against older material and the same size ships they're very hard to beat. Xwings have one of the worst times with defenders. What they don't do well against is large ships.

Poes problem is hat he doesn't hit hard enough to really spike through the defender. He also pays for 8 points of PS that is largely ignored by the delta and one more usually for VI. The ps 9 Poe in contrast may become a strong contender because it can take predator and PTL at ps9, drastically upping it's firepower.

Poe was a good ace in the turret and TLT meta cuz he had auto and ps10. The meta has changed now and needs more firepower to get past defenders and Dengaroo

Ummm...why is Poe flying with BB-8 and jousting a TIE Defender?! Good grief, the whole POINT of BB-8 is that he dodges out of your arc after you've moved, so you never get to shoot him...

Also this. If BB-8 Poe does ever make the jump, it will be because of high level flying making up for the loss of regen. Sounds like the scenario you pointed out was piloting error.

Do you work for the US military? Do you do investigations into why planes crash?

Wah, Wah, Wah, Did I miss anything?

Miranda is the primo Rebel Regen ship of choice. No arc restrictions, no blind spots, can regen even when she bumps, can use Bombs, Alpha Strike Torpedoes, or any number of crew tricks...she's versatile as bananas. Trouble is, if you load her up with any tricks she ends up being 40pts at least, and then it's hard to match the efficiency of a 31pt Inquisitor or a 35pt Soontir, or a TIE Defender, who have the added benefit or probably having Palpatine somewhere in the list.

Plus, then all the other ships in your list are Rebels too, and nobody wants that.

in wave 10 when we can take 4 ties with Miranda, that'll be entertaining

The efficiency of Soontir and the Inquisitor (with or without Palpatine) and now the D/x7 show how much the aces of both the rebels and scum are at a disadvantage. The empire can easily field 3 strong high PS ships (or 2 with Palp) and they are all dangerous and hard to hit. For scum or rebels, the equivalent ships will cost at least 5 points more or are nonexistent. (I haven't really explored the protectorate yet, does it change things?)

While it sucks at times, I really do like this as a feature of xwing, all the factions play differently, with the occasional crossover. The rebels can't really arc dodge without building around it, and with shields, they don't need to most of the time.

The efficiency of Soontir and the Inquisitor (with or without Palpatine) and now the D/x7 show how much the aces of both the rebels and scum are at a disadvantage. The empire can easily field 3 strong high PS ships (or 2 with Palp) and they are all dangerous and hard to hit. For scum or rebels, the equivalent ships will cost at least 5 points more or are nonexistent. (I haven't really explored the protectorate yet, does it change things?)

eh, that's not really the case

for costing more points, the rebel regenerators are at least effectively immortal 1v1 while imp ships without palp are always at the mercy of dice (to some extent)

and costing more means a 1v1 is an auto-win (mod wins don't exist anymore!)

that real problem is the sustained damage mitigation of imperial aces tends to be more useful v all the gobs AND gobs of damage you're likely to find on the table nowadays

flying Poe against a newer player (he had x7s, I thought it'd be easy mode for them!) and then Norra in general, I also thought they were just less good than their imperial counterparts

turns out it's not the case at all, they just excel in different scenarios ("different scenarios" here meaning "with Biggs")

I never do any good with the Ghost but I hear of others who like it. This game is easy to learn and hard to master. Ask what can I do to improve will go a lot further than this sucks will.

for costing more points, the rebel regenerators are at least effectively immortal 1v1 while imp ships without palp are always at the mercy of dice (to some extent)

That really depends on the 1v1. I'll bet on an Aggressor obliterating Miranda every time. Soontir is a much less certain proposition.

Let's see what happens when you compare Poe with a Starviper.

PS9 Poe = 33 points

PS9 Xizor + Virago + VI = 33 points

- Both can take auto-thrusters

- Both have boost

- Starviper arguably has a slightly better dial (1-turns)

- Starviper has more agility

- Starviper has barrel roll

Sure Poe has things going for him too, but there is nothing that makes him drastically better than Xizor. This is a bad sign.

Let's see what happens when you compare Poe with a Starviper.

PS9 Poe = 33 points

PS9 Xizor + Virago + VI = 33 points

- Both can take auto-thrusters

- Both have boost

- Starviper arguably has a slightly better dial (1-turns)

- Starviper has more agility

- Starviper has barrel roll

Sure Poe has things going for him too, but there is nothing that makes him drastically better than Xizor. This is a bad sign.

Poe has an open elite slot (slightly important no?)

You listed what was equal or better for xizor and ignored what poe had better, some strong analysis on your part that's for sure.

Let's see what happens when you compare Poe with a Starviper.

PS9 Poe = 33 points

PS9 Xizor + Virago + VI = 33 points

- Both can take auto-thrusters

- Both have boost

- Starviper arguably has a slightly better dial (1-turns)

- Starviper has more agility

- Starviper has barrel roll

Sure Poe has things going for him too, but there is nothing that makes him drastically better than Xizor. This is a bad sign.

- PS9 Poe can take an EPT.

- T70 gets an astromech slot (regen or bb8 for instance)

- Poe can take Black One once it releases

Let's see what happens when you compare Poe with a Starviper.

PS9 Poe = 33 points

PS9 Xizor + Virago + VI = 33 points

- Both can take auto-thrusters

- Both have boost

- Starviper arguably has a slightly better dial (1-turns)

- Starviper has more agility

- Starviper has barrel roll

Sure Poe has things going for him too, but there is nothing that makes him drastically better than Xizor. This is a bad sign.

Poe has more health and that health is behind shields and not hull.

Poe has an open elite slot (slightly important no?)

You listed what was equal or better for xizor and ignored what poe had better, some strong analysis on your part that's for sure.

Dengar is usually extremely bias about any of this analysis. Dont read to much into it.

Poe does just fine. He isn't great against scouts, but in most other situations he will usually win out. This last wave hasn't been kind to him, but I think a lot of people tend to forget he was the dominant ship for a full year for rebels.

Why wouldn't you use something efficient on Poe? With the same point cost you can have BB-8 and PTL, which should quite easily outmaneuver the defender and also do modified damage. That's the build I play on Poe.

Ummm...why is Poe flying with BB-8 and jousting a TIE Defender?! Good grief, the whole POINT of BB-8 is that he dodges out of your arc after you've moved, so you never get to shoot him...

actually nope, it's there to give you a 3-action combo with ability to never lose arc at a sngle foe.

and utilize the new title.

now that evens the chances already, with no TL for the x7