If a ship knocks a asteroid is it consider as overlap?

Technically there's no such thing as "knocking" in X-Wing.

Your ship lands with a piece of the ship on top of the obstacle, or it doesn't. If there was a minor fumble (which happens to everyone, all the time) then it's up to the two players at the table to determine where the asteroid was and what the result of the maneuver would have been, in the fairest way they can conceive.

Sigh... Again, this is in the wrong place...

https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/forum/293-x-wing-rules-questions/

Sigh, subforum nazis...

lol, I don't know how many times we've said something like "I think that's in range 2" and then bumped it while trying to measure it, and now it's DEFINITELY in range 2, and we just have to guess whether it was range 1 or 2 before the bump!

I find a 50/50 roll is the best way to determine outcome during a fumble... Though I do think the player who bumped should fairly acknowledge if the only reason it's in doubt is because they fudged it (by accident, of course), and own up to it.

But it does happen when, while trying to precisely and carefully move things... stuff happens.

Now, if you're saying that a ship sliding into position caused the obstacle to move a tiny bit, YES, that WAS an overlap, but the tiny margin by which it was a bump wasn't enough to support the weight of the model (or you thought you were safe and dropped the ship into place a little hot). You should consider yourself on it.

BUT! If you're saying that you fit your ship into place and it, without budging the obstacle in any way, they appear to be touching, I believe that's not an overlap. In Vassal, you can be extremely precise with those kinds of things. IRL, it's a little fuzzier, unfortunately.

If a ship knocks a asteroid is it consider as overlap?

NO!

Now I don't know what "knocks an asteroid" actually means but having a maneuver template cross an asteroid even a little bit has consequences and having a ship end it's maneuver parked on an asteroid has even bigger consequences.

Run over one with the template or land on it you roll for damage and give up your Perform Action Step.

Land on one and the ship generally loses it's ability to make ANY attacks at all. An overlap would only result in touching and no attacks between the touching ships.

If a ship knocks a asteroid is it consider as overlap?

What is "knocks a asteroid"? I am actually trying to understand the question.

If a ship lands to where it's touching an asteriod without actually overlapping (which is rare but it's happened to me twice) you are perfectly fine. Only on overlaps do you suffer the effects.

Hold the rocks down whenever someone moves near them.

Also, subforum nazis.

If the ships base final position, or any part of the template touches the rock, it is an overlap. If you slide the mini down the template and it nudges the rock it is an overlap. If the rock moves due to the mini it is an overlap. Now, you may not want to enforce the rule correctly, and that's fine and dandy and up to you.

To Megasilver - Your scenario doesn't exist. it either touches or it doesn't. Touching = overlapping.

To the OP, did you know that there is a rules sub-forum? It's clears up space in the main forum for more "fix ship x" spam that you are about 12 hours from posting

To Megasilver - Your scenario doesn't exist. it either touches or it doesn't. Touching = overlapping.

Archie

To Megasilver - Your scenario doesn't exist. it either touches or it doesn't. Touching = overlapping.

This is not correct. Overlapping causes touching. But two ships that perform a zero maneuver are still touching but not overlapping.

Archie

You are 100% correct - about ships. The round after first overlapping, if two ships that perform a maneuver of the same speed and direction (and they have to be facing the same direction to start with, otherwise it'll be another bump), they aren't overlapping. You have to meet both of those conditions first. However, it is 100% impossible to achieve that state without overlapping first. If you come close and touch (bump/knock/your choice) a ship, it is overlapping. Calling your example a corner case is pretty generous.

But, we were talking about overlapping rocks, and I stand by my statement. You touch a rock, you hit the rock. Period.

Also, before it comes up, if you are overlapping an obstacle, and are forced to stay stationary or choose a '0' maneuver, you are still overlapping said obstacle.

So yeah, touching = overlapping

There's nothing in the rule book to support your statement either, as there's nothing in the rule book about touching obstacles. We don't know what happens when you touch an obstacle. The only information we have about how overlapping becomes and then equals touching is when you overlap ships, something that does not happen with obstacles.

I have emailed the designers to get it cleared up.

If the ships base final position, or any part of the template touches the rock, it is an overlap. If you slide the mini down the template and it nudges the rock it is an overlap. If the rock moves due to the mini it is an overlap. Now, you may not want to enforce the rule correctly, and that's fine and dandy and up to you.

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So very WRONG!

Landing on an asteroid or having the template go over it is something COMPLETELY DIFFERENT from what an "overlap" is in the game. You can only "overlap" on a ship and that leads to the ship failing to complete its maneuver and doing the backslide until it is no longer overlapping and is now touching the last ship it overlapped instead. THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN WITH ROCKS!

Now maybe you need to be a LOT clearer about what you mean when you say "slide the mini down the template" because when it comes to manuevers and rocks there is no sliding what so ever. Rocks do NOTHING to prevent you from taking any given maneuver provided you are willing to suffer the consequences for landing on one or having the template cross one.

But, we were talking about overlapping rocks, and I stand by my statement. You touch a rock, you hit the rock. Period

But just to ask, my defenitely ion of overlapping is if you either drop the template or ship and it is not even on the play surface. If it scrapes against it but still goes to the play surface we play that is is an OK move. Also, in this I mean that nothing moves when placing the templates and ships, we hold down the asteroid firmly. Did you mean that my example would also be overlap since it touches?

Also, we are only talking movement hear right? Since I can barrel roll toward and asteroid and move up to it so that that ship and asteroid are physically touching, without it being an overlap.

Archie

If the ships base final position, or any part of the template touches the rock, it is an overlap. If you slide the mini down the template and it nudges the rock it is an overlap. If the rock moves due to the mini it is an overlap. Now, you may not want to enforce the rule correctly, and that's fine and dandy and up to you.

...

So very WRONG!

Landing on an asteroid or having the template go over it is something COMPLETELY DIFFERENT from what an "overlap" is in the game. You can only "overlap" on a ship and that leads to the ship failing to complete its maneuver and doing the backslide until it is no longer overlapping and is now touching the last ship it overlapped instead. THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN WITH ROCKS!

Also, when it comes to obstacles, it is the only way of starting your movement as overlapping something (if you landed on it the previous round).

Archie

no idea if everyone's over interpreting it or not, by I read "knocking" as someone done goofing with their ship placement and moving the rock out of allignment

easiest solution i is, if the outcome was too close to call, whoever ****** up gives the decision to their opponent

because their opponent didn't **** up

Touching asteroid is overlapping and ship needs to roll for damage and lose attack.

lol, I don't know how many times we've said something like "I think that's in range 2" and then bumped it while trying to measure it, and now it's DEFINITELY in range 2, and we just have to guess whether it was range 1 or 2 before the bump!

Then I think the decision should be in favour of the guy who didn't bump

I'm not sure why so many find this so difficult to do. If you are able to place your ship FLAT on the table, it is NOT considered to be an overlap, regardless of whether or not it's in actual contact with the obstacle. The same applies to ships.

If you CANNOT place your ship FLAT on the table because part of it's base is OVER the obstacle, then you have overlapped it.

The term "touching" ONLY applies to ships that have overlapped other ships, as in "ships that are touching cannot attack each other". The same term has never applied to ships and obstacles. You're either on the obstacle because of an overlap, or you're on the table. You can never be FLAT on the table and suffer the effects of an obstacle just because you happen to be in contact with it.

If the ships base final position, or any part of the template touches the rock, it is an overlap. If you slide the mini down the template and it nudges the rock it is an overlap. If the rock moves due to the mini it is an overlap. Now, you may not want to enforce the rule correctly, and that's fine and dandy and up to you.

...

So very WRONG!

Landing on an asteroid or having the template go over it is something COMPLETELY DIFFERENT from what an "overlap" is in the game. You can only "overlap" on a ship and that leads to the ship failing to complete its maneuver and doing the backslide until it is no longer overlapping and is now touching the last ship it overlapped instead. THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN WITH ROCKS!

Now maybe you need to be a LOT clearer about what you mean when you say "slide the mini down the template" because when it comes to manuevers and rocks there is no sliding what so ever. Rocks do NOTHING to prevent you from taking any given maneuver provided you are willing to suffer the consequences for landing on one or having the template cross one.

Kinda looks like you misread my post. If you want to get hung up on 'overlapping' that's fine. If you prefer, you could say 'contact' I suppose. "Sliding down the template" is just that. Sometimes when some folks want to squeeze in, they'll hold the template in place, put the mini near the edge of the template and slide the mini into place. Don't they do this in your neck of the woods? I never said rocks affect your maneuvering either. But thanks for being part of the discussion

tl;dr - not wrong, read better

I'm not sure why so many find this so difficult to do. If you are able to place your ship FLAT on the table, it is NOT considered to be an overlap, regardless of whether or not it's in actual contact with the obstacle. The same applies to ships.

If you CANNOT place your ship FLAT on the table because part of it's base is OVER the obstacle, then you have overlapped it.

The term "touching" ONLY applies to ships that have overlapped other ships, as in "ships that are touching cannot attack each other". The same term has never applied to ships and obstacles. You're either on the obstacle because of an overlap, or you're on the table. You can never be FLAT on the table and suffer the effects of an obstacle just because you happen to be in contact with it.

Contact of any sort (with template or final resting position) with an obstacle is considered to be overlapping.

If the ships base final position, or any part of the template touches the rock, it is an overlap. If you slide the mini down the template and it nudges the rock it is an overlap. If the rock moves due to the mini it is an overlap. Now, you may not want to enforce the rule correctly, and that's fine and dandy and up to you.

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So very WRONG!

Landing on an asteroid or having the template go over it is something COMPLETELY DIFFERENT from what an "overlap" is in the game. You can only "overlap" on a ship and that leads to the ship failing to complete its maneuver and doing the backslide until it is no longer overlapping and is now touching the last ship it overlapped instead. THIS DOES NOT HAPPEN WITH ROCKS!

I am sorry, you are wrong here. The rules clearly state that you can overlap an obstacle as a result of you move (that is when you actally land on the obstacle). See the rules reference under the "Obstacles" section.

Also, when it comes to obstacles, it is the only way of starting your movement as overlapping something (if you landed on it the previous round).

Archie

Are we talking about overlapping or "Overlapping" here? As Futant420 seems to realize the issue here is more about what is meant by an Overlap. Change the word to "contact" and it does change how the whole thing can be preceived. I'm looking at Overlap as the game definition and NOT what could be a real world definition. It may some difference in interpretation of the post I first quoted.

If you are looking for other words that can trip people up just consider "hit" and "touching" which have various real world meaning which may be problematic when used in the game.

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Contact of any sort (with template or final resting position) with an obstacle is considered to be interacting with the obstacle .

Fixed that just so we can take out the word overlapping.