What is also extremely noticeable is that not a single Biggs shows up, it almost as no one did bring Wes and Biggs to stop imperial aces and scouts to place highly.

Or perhaps Wes and Biggs aren't as effective as people are convinced they are and those using the combo just didn't place.

Maybe, which is another reason this is so noticeable after GenCon. Another good reason to be curious of how many Biggs and Wes lists were present at the event.

What is also extremely noticeable is that not a single Biggs shows up, it almost as no one did bring Wes and Biggs to stop imperial aces and scouts to place highly.

Or perhaps Wes and Biggs aren't as effective as people are convinced they are and those using the combo just didn't place.

Maybe, which is another reason this is so noticeable after GenCon. Another good reason to be curious of how many Biggs and Wes lists were present at the event.

Biggs and Wedge are an effective counter, but they're also a punishingly unforgiving one: You have to pick your move right, and hope like hell you got it right. If the opponent surprises you, and you end up out of position, you've got nothing to save your skins. I'm no fan of boostwing, but given it is what it is, the lack of Biggs and Wes to have any repositional capability at all is pretty painful.

Wow. A complete bore fest of mainly jumpmasters and imp aces. Long live Epic/HotAC.

And a final with that list:

"Whisper" (32)

Veteran Instincts (1)

Fire-Control System (2)

Agent Kallus (2)

Advanced Cloaking Device (4)

Captain Oicunn (42)

Predator (3)

Gunner (5)

Rebel Captive (3)

Engine Upgrade (4)

Total: 98

What is also extremely noticeable is that not a single Biggs shows up, it almost as no one did bring Wes and Biggs to stop imperial aces and scouts to place highly.

I met that list in the third or fourth round. I have never rolled so few evade results in my life, and I've had some legendarily bad times with green dice. Gunner didn't even get a chance to trigger once on Oicunn.

Frankly I'm surprised there weren't more Crack-swarms and lists featuring the Ghost. Those lists have a much higher skill entry level than triple U-boat or Palp-aces, but when played well they can outperform them quite easily.

Perhaps people would rather a more forgiving list over these big 2 day events than one that outperforms when played optimally, but crashes when mistakes are made.

The problem with Wes is that all manaroo had to do is equip recon specialist and then he's worthless in that matchup. Still useful v aces,but that's why God invented yorr. He does make scouts very unhappy, though.

Frankly I'm surprised there weren't more Crack-swarms and lists featuring the Ghost. Those lists have a much higher skill entry level than triple U-boat or Palp-aces, but when played well they can outperform them quite easily.

Perhaps people would rather a more forgiving list over these big 2 day events than one that outperforms when played optimally, but crashes when mistakes are made.

There were swarms present but Dengaroo played well will decimate them.

I think it's telling that the three TIE Swarms to make day two (including mine) all played Omega Leader and weren't classic 'all the Cracks' swarms.

Hats off to guy who figured out Dengaroo list - it is pure poetry in terms of list building. I have never seen so well thought out and lethal composition.

Unfortunately this list, at least when Manaroo takes Recon Specialist, got no hard counters at the moment (at least i didn't figure out any). Also, from my experience it is easiest competitive list to fly - just run away Manaroo and joust with Dengar. You can do no wrong.

My attempt at countering this is to field Dengar (PtL, EU, Unhinged Astro, K4, Title) and Bossk (Mangler, Adaptability, 4lom, Zuckuss, K4). I will try this composition during the next local tournament.

eh, it's not that difficult to counter dengaroo if you run torp scouts

you just ruin his **** in the joust; don't even need to bother with manny

also not relevant atm, but tailgunner ARCs with biggs also have a hilarious match-up advantage against him and can just joust him to death as well. Which is good, because good luck catching manny with those clunkers

everyone else? chase manny, you fools!

everyone else? chase manny, you fools!

I played against Dengaroo twice in tournaments, using my Aces (Inquisitor, Fel and Yorr), won once and lost once - and chasing Manaroo, at least in my experience, is not an optimum strategy - a lot depends on asteroid and debris placement but chasing Manaroo is playing exactly into hands of Dengaroo player. Also R5-P8 on Manaroo is a pain to deal with and with PtL and Engine Upgrade good luck with catching up this ship. In my opinion Dengar must be eliminated first, then and only then you are free to hunt for Manaroo.

everyone else? chase manny, you fools!

I played against Dengaroo twice in tournaments, using my Aces (Inquisitor, Fel and Yorr), won once and lost once - and chasing Manaroo, at least in my experience, is not an optimum strategy - a lot depends on asteroid and debris placement but chasing Manaroo is playing exactly into hands of Dengaroo player. Also R5-P8 on Manaroo is a pain to deal with and with PtL and Engine Upgrade good luck with catching up this ship. In my opinion Dengar must be eliminated first, then and only then you are free to hunt for Manaroo.

You're playing the list that Dengaroo was created to beat (Palp Aces) but there are plenty of other lists that cause it no end of trouble. In general Dengar eats most small ship lists but struggles against most big ship lists. Scouts, Dash/Ghost, the YV, Decimators... it's not happy in any of those matches.

But yeah, in general chasing Manaroo is pretty futile. Far better than chasing Manaroo is taking on Dengar but blocking the sloop - that needs plenty of ships to capitalise on the block, though, wouldn't work for Palp Aces.

chasing manaroo isn't that hard, if you have the right ships for it. The shadowcaster especially has it easy, and will need to do so because it can't trade dice with even aggressors nevermind dengar

and if you have ventress, oh boy (note: not my game; a local ventured abroad and is enjoying the local apparently VERY dengaroo heavy meta)

I know it's been a dog's age since we've last seen the guy, but if you can catch Dash (esp kanan dash) you can more than easily catch manaroo

better yet, dengar doesn't get his ability while you're busy not giving a **** about him. At half damage output, the entire list really becomes a lot less impressive

which is why, if you do joust him, blocking the sloop gives you a massive advantage

Ian has been flying that for like two years, and usually seems to place very highly. in fact, I'm not sure I've never seen him use anything else.

Really? Wow, well good for that guy. He must have the same problem I do when list building. You know the one, where you go to make a nice TLT spam list and wind up with Whisper and Echo... again! Lol

I flew that list yesterday, well I forgot my TIE dial and so it was just Whisper and Echo, but... I actually liked Rec Spec Echo a lot. Sure I missed Gunner when I'd roll out one hit and three focus, but it's a different beast. I'd normally let that roll sit and try for Gunner/FCS, but with Rec Spec, well there is no Gunner/FCS shenanigans and so you either save the tokens for defense or you spend one and hope for the clear.

I can understand completely why Mr. Holmes would fly this list. It's a real killer.