Maybe the sky is falling, maybe not, and I'm not sure if this has been mentioned yet, but something I've noticed is the Coordinate action possibly being brought into standard play. For those who aren't familiar with epic, Coordinate lets you choose a friendly ship at range 1-2 and let's it perform a free action, so here's something to consider:

Kylo Ren + Palpatine clocks in at 42 points, which is pretty expensive and already limits list building for Palp Aces, in which you can run KyloPalpmobile + Standard Soontir (35) + Omegae w/Juke (23) and no Comm. Relay at 100 points flat. However, whatever the generic Upsilon pilot is will probably cost less, maybe even 3 points less, which means you can fit the fully kitted Omega Leader in your list.

Palp Aces would most likely be restricted to Kylo-Palp + Omega Leader + Soontir/Vader/Inquisitor, but the list gains a sturdier carriage for Palp to ride in that also has more firepower AND grants the coordinate action to the list, which means, on top of the dice modifiers from Palp.

I wouldn't doubt that a skilled pilot would be able to keep the Upsilon within coordination range of its aces for most of the game, which means that because of the lower PS, the coordinate action will allow ace ships to boost/barrel pre-maneuver, and any PtL ace can take the second action off of the coordinate action and clear its stress with a green maneuver and then take another action. So now we have triple action Soomtirs and Inquisitors, possible quadruple action PtL Vaders, and Omega Leader can setup an action faster to lockdown enemies.

The new shuttle gives Palp Aces way more options in-game because of the coordinate action. After many Epic games, I've realized how powerful the coordinate action is. However, the ramifications of introducing it into Standard play might warp the meta in even more favor of Imperial Aces with Palp.

I hope I don't sound like I'm whining, I'm not trying to, it just kinda hit me when I realized how crazy it'll be when the shuttle moves into range of Soontir, Coordinates him, Soontir Barrel Rolls, PtLs into a focus + evade, then hard 2s the stress away and boosts into range 1 of an enemy ship out of its arc with Palp mods on top of all of it. On one hand, I'm excited for the extra dynamic, but on the other I can feel the real complaint threads looming in the horizon.

(Disclaimer: I could also be totally wrong on the actions thing so please correct me if I am! )

BMST is going to be a thing. We are going to have PTSD from BMST.

BMST is going to be a thing. We are going to have PTSD from BMST.

Coordinate goes around that quite nicely, since for aces that will do Coordinate>PTL off Coordinate action>green move>3rd action, your only window to use BMST will be between the PS of the Upsilon and the PS of the Ace, so no PS1 Z95s with BMST.

It's like they knew BMST might harm the viability of Imperial aces, so put something in to mitigate that...

The idea of Coordinate is that Soontir triggers PTL off of that, leaving him unstressed (and thus safe from BMST) after he clears with a green move. He's also psuedo-unblockable as it'd cost him only one of his effectively four actions a turn if you count his ability.

However, that also means Soontir repositions at PS6 (or PS8 with VI), not at PS9. That's quite the hit to take to his ability to arc-dodge high PS aces. Palpatine is a lifeline for an ace that gets caught out, but not for an ace that's repeatedly caught out. He can hold one reposition action back for his actual action, but single reposition doesn't reliably let you both dodge and keep your shot.

If you run the cheapest PS2 Upsilon you both reposition at PS2 and create a PS2 to PS9 window in which BMST is still effective. You've pretty much got to take Kylo to make this work properly.

And if you do, as you said you're tying up a lot of points in a shuttle that

1. has to stay in the fight at Range 1-2. Half the reason Yorr isn't a mainstay is because he'd have to stay in the fray which means he's an easy target for focus fire.
2. is eating up points that aren't going into your aces. The previous appeal of Omega Leader and Wampa is they let you turn PalpAces into a four ship list. As you demonstrated, if you're bring Fel to the party then you can't even run a full Omega Leader. It's hardly going to be on the power level of the Fel and Vader tag teams that can accompany a Lambda.

Short version: Coordinate is a useful ability but it'll cost you probably too much elsewhere to use it as a shield against BMST.

The new shuttle gives Palp Aces way more options in-game because of the coordinate action. After many Epic games, I've realized how powerful the coordinate action is.

Remember in Epic games the Coordinate Action occurs at effectively Pilot Skill 14 (GR-75) or 15 (Raider and CR-90).

Yeah but you doesn't just have to use co ordinate action to arc dodge, you can use the lower ps action to reposition into a block, then still get your move and normal action, or even evade your opponents blocks, it actually makes aces like soontir harder to pin down as they don't need to PTL all the time and can get a move earlier in the game turn.

I'm thinking of all the fun different positions echo or whisper can get into with de cloak then pre move boost/barrel roll (with engine upgrade if you take it) and still get your normal action and still have FCS to get the target lock

Edit, de cloak before actions, been a while since I had to deal with phantoms

Yeah but you doesn't just have to use co ordinate action to arc dodge, you can use the lower ps action to reposition into a block, then still get your move and normal action, or even evade your opponents blocks, it actually makes aces like soontir harder to pin down as they don't need to PTL all the time and can get a move earlier in the game turn.

Soontir needs to stress himself somehow to trigger his ability, so he does need PTL.

Moving earlier in the turn isn't advantageous for an arc-dodger as it prevents it from repositioning reactively. This is why arc dodgers tend to go for maximum PS. If early movement competed in any way, shape or form we'd see more of the cheaper interceptors.

As for Coordinate blocking:

If you Coordinate out of an opposing block they've attempted to block you in full knowledge that you can Coordinate out of it. The effect this has is that ships at lower PS than your shuttle are unlikely to try to block you. They'll block the shuttle instead, which is probably their primary target anyway given it can't stay back from the fighting.

Blocking a ship with a single reposition and Coordinate would be difficult. Firstly, your victim must be between your pilot skill and the pilot skill of the shuttle, and the bigger that gap is the more limited Coordinate's ability to help you avoid stress and still arc-dodge is. Secondly, to block a ship with a single reposition they have to move to very close range in full knowledge you can and will block them, something they don't really want to do anyway as they're trying to anticipate your maneuver. If you double reposition then you have no ability to reposition after you move at PS9 and lose the reactive ability that keeps you alive.

It's very powerful, no doubt about it. It's partiularly strong at mitigating the effects of blocking, by either allowing Fel to sidestep the block, or to head straight into it anyway, while sitting pretty on focus/focus/evade.

If it becomes a thing, stress control will be needed to counter, as coordinate does nada for a stressed ship...

If the PS2 generic upsilon pilot is around 24 points than it'll completely replace the lambda in transporting the emperor. Soontir(35)+Vader(33)+palpamobil(32) would be a dream list.

the UPS is also projected to cost as much as the lambda does with palp already on it

you get what you pay for (which is "less aces")

I have a feeling that the upsilon will also have a worse dial than the shuttle. Judging by the costing and statline, unless they consider the basic shuttle over priced, it may lack the 0-stop or possibly even 1-maneuvers, forcing a different playstyle with that ship(see the 2-green bank on the reveal).

It's very powerful, no doubt about it. It's partiularly strong at mitigating the effects of blocking, by either allowing Fel to sidestep the block, or to head straight into it anyway, while sitting pretty on focus/focus/evade.

If it becomes a thing, stress control will be needed to counter, as coordinate does nada for a stressed ship...

I don't think it's any more powerful. Coordinate gives some potent additional options but comes at a steep cost in points, reduced maneuvering options and the pilot skill at which your aces act.

Using the Upsilon over the Lambda makes your PalpAces more versatile but have less raw power.

Using the Upsilon over the Lambda makes your PalpAces more versatile but have less raw power.

And if you do that it's in the fray trying to stay in Coordinate range and at the mercy of any ship with a K-turn.

Eesh, you're right. That is going to be scary. Those people trying to downplay the effectiveness of coordinate aren't thinking it through. The shuttle can also take Enhanced Scopes (remember that little card? If you're like me, you've probably never used it, but it lets you activate at PS0). That means that the shuttle can go first, give Soontir (or whoever) a free action, PtL blah blah blah and Soontir never has to worry about losing his actions if he gets blocked. But that's not all, if your opponent doesn't have QuickDraw, or isn't in a position to block you, then you DON'T HAVE TO coordinate. Skilled players are going to know when to coordinate and when not to.

I'm with the OP- I'm not complaining or predicting that the sky is going to fall, but still, buckle up. Coordinating Palp Aces IS going to be a thing.

EDIT: Activating at PS0 doesn't help against BMST. Fixed that.

The shuttle can also take Enhanced Scopes (remember that little card? If you're like me, you've probably never used it, but it lets you activate at PS0). That means that the shuttle can go first, give Soontir (or whoever) a free action, PtL blah blah blah and Soontir never has to worry about losing his actions if he gets blocked.

Fairly sure Damaged Cockpit is Soontir's nightmare, not his dream.

You would fly this ship very similar to Yorr. For Soontir you could coordinate, give him an evade, PTL to focus, gets another focus, and then do a green move to clear stress, and then barrel roll for normal action. That's a tokened up Soontir with no stress and maneuverability.

Eesh, you're right. That is going to be scary. Those people trying to downplay the effectiveness of coordinate aren't thinking it through. The shuttle can also take Enhanced Scopes (remember that little card? If you're like me, you've probably never used it, but it lets you activate at PS0). That means that the shuttle can go first, give Soontir (or whoever) a free action, PtL blah blah blah and Soontir never has to worry about losing his actions if he gets blocked. But that's not all, if your opponent doesn't have QuickDraw, or isn't in a position to block you, then you DON'T HAVE TO coordinate. Skilled players are going to know when to coordinate and when not to.

I'm with the OP- I'm not complaining or predicting that the sky is going to fall, but still, buckle up. Coordinating Palp Aces IS going to be a thing.

EDIT: Activating at PS0 doesn't help against BMST. Fixed that.

Soontir repositioning at PS0 is not something I am worried about.

Fel is pretty bad example, as is PtL in general, yes it is true if you always Coordinate Fel, then he can PtL off the coordinate action and clear the stress with a green move. However if you don't do it every turn and Fel needs to PtL after his normal action (highly likely) then he will be stressed and unable to be Coordinated (essentially until he doesn't PtL for a turn).

It works, but it is better with Vader, or Omega Leader or other non-stressing ships.

...and with a 4 dice primary on a ship that will have to get more involved in the fight, do you really, really, want to be coordinating every turn?

the UPS is also projected to cost as much as the lambda does with palp already on it

you get what you pay for (which is "less aces")

QFT. You want *more* ace with Palp, which is probably why the Tie Shuttle upgrade doesn't allow Palp on it. The shuttle will be good I think, but probably not that good for Palp. Its just too expensive because you're limiting yourself to budget aces or a 2-ship build. If its to be 2 ship with Palp... RAC is calling!

Upsilon being the new Palpmobile seems like a waste, or overkill. I predict Palpy will see less use as imp ace lists try to be more self sufficient. Or not, because X-wingers hate to try new things that might keep them from going to day two.

Or not, because X-wingers hate to try new things that might keep them from going to day two.

you got it

the UPS shuttle has a ton of cool new synergy options, especially with the SF (PS 2 coordinate to have Quickdraw fire before basically everyone, ie free rage + baffle, then QD out a green maneuver for 0 stress and either PS 9 roll out of arcs or take a focus for the combat phase attack)

I would suspect that palpatine on the Upsilon is a temporary thing - I believe that the First Order, Empire, Rebel, and Resistance factions will become seperate at some point. The reason they aren't now, is because there are currently two ships. One for each faction. As we get more ships to fill out these current sub-factions, they become more likely to stand on their own.

I expect a FAQ update that states they are seperate factions in a couple years time.

I would suspect that palpatine on the Upsilon is a temporary thing - I believe that the First Order, Empire, Rebel, and Resistance factions will become seperate at some point. The reason they aren't now, is because there are currently two ships. One for each faction. As we get more ships to fill out these current sub-factions, they become more likely to stand on their own.

I expect a FAQ update that states they are seperate factions in a couple years time.

It's likely IMO too. There was no point in introducing subfactions if they weren't going to matter at some point.

I dont think theyll completelh split the factions, but it could open up timeline specific evengs, or subfaction specific upgrades (resisitance only or rebel alliance only xwing upgrades for instance)