How is everyone finding the Liberty? The 2 shields on the side are really starting to bother me.. too many things in the game are fast enough to put consistent fire down onto side hulls.

The guys running these were doing well by building them slippery. Basically Engine Techs and or Madine, and Nav Commands.

But I think the match-ups are going to start getting like AllWingsStandingBy commenting. Sometimes you're going to get really advantageous games and others will be an uphill battle the whole way.

Re: the Interdictor/AllWingsStandingBy

I think your analysis is fair provided you're only concerned about an Interdictor with the G8 Experimental Projector. Once those Nebs/Liberties get to short range and you're rerolling dice with a Target Scrambler, I think you'll see it helps you in the fisticuffs stage of a fight even it wasn't as helpful in the "mess with movement" task. Beyond that there's the deployment screwage options (Grav Shift Reroute/G7s). It still merits much testing, mind you, but I'm curious to see how it pans out. So far I've found mine to be exemplary with support abilities and durability (Engineering Team + Wulff = so many consistent Engineering points) but mediocre with its damage output. Merits further testing methinks.

Unless you are me, made my Friend re-roll four red dice that was a hit, hit ,crit,crit... Ended up with double hit, double hit,double hit,crit.... used that card twice in that match with both times should have just left the dice alone lol

Regarding the Interdictor, I ran one at a tournament yesterday and I absolutely love it. For reference, here was my list:

Faction: Galactic Empire

Points: 391/400

Commander: Admiral Motti

Assault Objective: Most Wanted
Defense Objective: Contested Outpost
Navigation Objective: Dangerous Territory

[ flagship ] Imperial II-Class Star Destroyer (120 points)
- Admiral Motti ( 24 points)
- Devastator ( 10 points)
- Intel Officer ( 7 points)
- Gunnery Team ( 7 points)
- Phylon Q7 Tractor Beams ( 6 points)
- Electronic Countermeasures ( 7 points)
- X17 Turbolasers ( 6 points)
- Leading Shots ( 4 points)
= 191 total ship cost

Interdictor-class Suppression Refit (90 points)
- Interdictor ( 3 points)
- Captain Needa ( 2 points)
- Projection Experts ( 6 points)
- Phylon Q7 Tractor Beams ( 6 points)
- MS-1 Ion Cannons ( 2 points)
- G-8 Experiemental Projector ( 8 points)
- Targeting Scrambler ( 5 points)
= 122 total ship cost

Gozanti-class Cruisers (23 points)
- Admiral Titus ( 2 points)
- Repair Crews ( 4 points)
= 29 total ship cost

3 TIE Interceptor Squadrons ( 33 points)
1 "Howlrunner" ( 16 points)

Without the interdictor, I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have won first place.

First of all, the experimental retrofits are incredibly good. In some of my games, G-8 didn't get a ton of use, but in others it helped me immensely. In all three games, targeting scrambler was very useful. Besides the experimental retrofits, the fact that it's a viable platform for Projection Experts is also very exciting. With an engineering of 5 you can move 2 shields and then regain one of the ones you lost.

In my second game yesterday I played someone who had 2 Victory SDs and an Interdictor. As the objective was contested outpost, they were all in a line right on the station. My ISD was able to maneuver so he crashed into one of the star destroyers and stayed there for 3 turns, absolutely wrecking both Victory SDs. The ability to reroll 4 dice twice a round, and get 2 shields from the Interdictor on top of the 2 from the engineering commands allowed my ISD to get out of there with 4 hull. Then later on G-8 saved the ISD from dying when my opponent tried to ram it on round 6.

The interdictor doesn't have a lot of firepower. I don't think I would ever run two of them in a tournament list, but running one of them gives you a massive amount of support for your other ships and an unprecedented level of control over the battlefield.

So im slowly loving the Interdicter but its been quite the learning curve for an imperial only player. We like pointing straight and charging. Lol.

First, no it doesnt want to go up agaisnt liberties and isd's. However its not completely dead in the water. This ship is really reliant on getting double arc shots on bigger ships. With engine techs this becomes easier. Im pretty sure this is Needa's favorite ship.

Im currently leaning towards it being in the lower percentile in competitive fleets for now.

My key notes

- The new objectives and wave 5 will increase its value.

- how does it joust with wulff and engineering team.

-nothing should be above average-great vs everything. Im glad it has weakness.

Interdictor with Konstatine brought a Liberty to it's knees by grounding it on an debris field. It's serious if you build for it.

Man, if only you could move terrain around and get 2 or 3 pieces under the same ship and then lock it down to temporary speed 0. I wonder if this is something that only works once because you didn't see it coming or if it is something that you could repeat? Fleet ambush would probably make it such that you could get 2 pieces of terrain under a ship and lock it down.

For the most part though I am feeling that Konstantine just doesn't just doesn't have a great range of ships. ISD's are quite expensive and would probably see you somewhat limited, the VSD and Interdictor are the choice of medium ships. I can't help but think Konstantine would be great in a Rebel fleet.

Takes half a second to pop to the Fleet List forum where there is a fleet with that name...

Ly could have added a link to it too.

Takes half a second to pop to the Fleet List forum where there is a fleet with that name...

Ly could have added a link to it too.

Yes he could. I won't deny that... And although its not aimed at you, I feel you can't call someone out as Lazy when you're just as Lazy, after all Pot and Kettle and all...

I mean, I'm lazy as all hell when I havn't had my Coffee.... And thus, I'm not really able to call out anyone as Lazy...

Had my first 3 games with the new Interdictor and Gozanti today. Have to say I was worried that the Interdictor's dice were going to be less then stellar for the ships size. However, seems that what dice it does have are reliable for 3 damage and an accuracy in most rolls. Not devastating, just effecient. My opponent learned quickly to have navigate commands to spare much of the game. Although it seemed like I was wasting my time constantly slowing his ships down just so they could command to regain that speed, it kept them from doing other commands they may rather have had in most cases.

Animal: I didn't get to witness what happened to the Liberty getting grounded, but my friend was recapping the experience.

4x Interdictor Combat refits and Motti - Good luck even killing 1 of my ships.

Granted I'm probably not buying 4x Interdictors, but if I did it would be sick.

How is everyone finding the Liberty? The 2 shields on the side are really starting to bother me.. too many things in the game are fast enough to put consistent fire down onto side hulls.

The guys running these were doing well by building them slippery. Basically Engine Techs and or Madine, and Nav Commands.

But I think the match-ups are going to start getting like AllWingsStandingBy commenting. Sometimes you're going to get really advantageous games and others will be an uphill battle the whole way.

Yea, unfortunately I think this will be true. X-Wing has very much devolved into something similar. With so many options in X-Wings now, lists can be pretty divergent and there's a pretty influential Rock-Paper-Scissors sort of dynamic, where some games are largely determined when lists are revealed.

Armada has always had a something like this (e.g. back in Wave 2: No Fighters > Dogfighters > Bombers > No Fighters). This will become a greater factor in Armada with things like the Interdictor, which nerfs MC30s/Demolishers hard but has a much more minimal impact in a game against Triple Victory Super Carriers.

The MC30 is my favorite ship, but I'm sad I can no longer run it past Wave 4, because there is always the chance that I might play against an Interdictor kitted out to keep a ship's speed at 0. You can't afford to waste 90 points on a ship that might not get to roll any dice in a certain match-up...

Went to a local tournament today and ended up winning with 2-1. A few thoughts:

Had a blast with the Liberty. I think it definitely needs Madine, who so kindly comes in the box, but him and a nav command does wonders. For once I actually agreed with taking Tactical expert. It let me key in nothing but navigates or engineering, then take the concentrate fire when I knew it could count.

Madine is way better than I thought he would be. Going to have to try him with an MC80. He makes the AF work wonders.

The two black AS dice are really deadly. I ripped up a X-wing, Y-wing, and B-wing swarm with my Liberty and a transport over two turns. Ended up killing four x-wings, two b-wings, and three y-wings for the loss of only one X.

Veteran gunners are surprisingly good. Ran them on an AF and did not regret the points spent in the slightest.

My one loss was to an interdictor which kept my flanking AF out of the game. With G-8 and tractor beam it did a great job, even with my keying in nav commands every turn.

Medical team is a fun little card. Opponent attempted to give me injured crew with Dodonna, nope.

Everyone was pretty much running X-wings and bomber commander center, including myself. It did well. Other people took fairly loaded out transports, but I still think two upgrades maximum is best. They still easily go pop. Speaking of..

The standout combo to me was H9 and QTC. Holy crap what an amazing combo. It gives you all the **** accuracy, and makes popping flotillas a breeze.

Only question that arose: does Motti affect flotillas? We ruled yes, but was curious what people thought.

Only question that arose: does Motti affect flotillas? We ruled yes, but was curious what people thought.

As has been discussed to death in the Rules Forum. Yes.

Flotillas use all ship Rules, with one Exception.

Ship Size, is one of those Rules it uses.

Ergo, the current Transport Flotillas are Small Ships with the Flotilla Rule added.

How is everyone finding the Liberty? The 2 shields on the side are really starting to bother me.. too many things in the game are fast enough to put consistent fire down onto side hulls.

The guys running these were doing well by building them slippery. Basically Engine Techs and or Madine, and Nav Commands.

But I think the match-ups are going to start getting like AllWingsStandingBy commenting. Sometimes you're going to get really advantageous games and others will be an uphill battle the whole way.

Yea, unfortunately I think this will be true. X-Wing has very much devolved into something similar. With so many options in X-Wings now, lists can be pretty divergent and there's a pretty influential Rock-Paper-Scissors sort of dynamic, where some games are largely determined when lists are revealed.

Armada has always had a something like this (e.g. back in Wave 2: No Fighters > Dogfighters > Bombers > No Fighters). This will become a greater factor in Armada with things like the Interdictor, which nerfs MC30s/Demolishers hard but has a much more minimal impact in a game against Triple Victory Super Carriers.

The MC30 is my favorite ship, but I'm sad I can no longer run it past Wave 4, because there is always the chance that I might play against an Interdictor kitted out to keep a ship's speed at 0. You can't afford to waste 90 points on a ship that might not get to roll any dice in a certain match-up...

This weekend was an epic one for me due to my wife giving me a pass. I played 9 games across Friday-Sun and faced a variety of fleets and opponents. Consistently, the same thing kept coming up; that things will turn very Rocks-Paper-Scissors. For example, the game that spurred this thread was a twin Interdictor w VSD vs my Cracken list. I got crushed. Again and again this played out, lists can definitely be competitive, but chances are you're going to run into something that you just aren't set up to handle.

My take away, so far, is that this is healthy. I think tournaments are going to be more competitive as a result. Demo lists are going to struggle with Interdictors, but will be fine against others.... And so on.

I might spend time trying to build an all-comers, but I think this will just get more and more difficult, and be ultimately pointless. For now I'm going to focus on a couple of basic list designs and just try to get really proficient with them.

Also, re: the Liberty.

Bombers can chew it to pieces.

How is everyone finding the Liberty? The 2 shields on the side are really starting to bother me.. too many things in the game are fast enough to put consistent fire down onto side hulls.

The guys running these were doing well by building them slippery. Basically Engine Techs and or Madine, and Nav Commands.

But I think the match-ups are going to start getting like AllWingsStandingBy commenting. Sometimes you're going to get really advantageous games and others will be an uphill battle the whole way.

Yea, unfortunately I think this will be true. X-Wing has very much devolved into something similar. With so many options in X-Wings now, lists can be pretty divergent and there's a pretty influential Rock-Paper-Scissors sort of dynamic, where some games are largely determined when lists are revealed.

Armada has always had a something like this (e.g. back in Wave 2: No Fighters > Dogfighters > Bombers > No Fighters). This will become a greater factor in Armada with things like the Interdictor, which nerfs MC30s/Demolishers hard but has a much more minimal impact in a game against Triple Victory Super Carriers.

The MC30 is my favorite ship, but I'm sad I can no longer run it past Wave 4, because there is always the chance that I might play against an Interdictor kitted out to keep a ship's speed at 0. You can't afford to waste 90 points on a ship that might not get to roll any dice in a certain match-up...

This weekend was an epic one for me due to my wife giving me a pass. I played 9 games across Friday-Sun and faced a variety of fleets and opponents. Consistently, the same thing kept coming up; that things will turn very Rocks-Paper-Scissors. For example, the game that spurred this thread was a twin Interdictor w VSD vs my Cracken list. I got crushed. Again and again this played out, lists can definitely be competitive, but chances are you're going to run into something that you just aren't set up to handle.

My take away, so far, is that this is healthy. I think tournaments are going to be more competitive as a result. Demo lists are going to struggle with Interdictors, but will be fine against others.... And so on.

I might spend time trying to build an all-comers, but I think this will just get more and more difficult, and be ultimately pointless. For now I'm going to focus on a couple of basic list designs and just try to get really proficient with them.

This is the only miniatures game I've played, so maybe that's my inexperience.

I guess, I take some comfort in the fact that while I may get tromped in a match, it's likely that my opponent might get tromped in the next. I'm speaking in terms of a tourney.

How is everyone finding the Liberty? The 2 shields on the side are really starting to bother me.. too many things in the game are fast enough to put consistent fire down onto side hulls.

The guys running these were doing well by building them slippery. Basically Engine Techs and or Madine, and Nav Commands.

But I think the match-ups are going to start getting like AllWingsStandingBy commenting. Sometimes you're going to get really advantageous games and others will be an uphill battle the whole way.

Yea, unfortunately I think this will be true. X-Wing has very much devolved into something similar. With so many options in X-Wings now, lists can be pretty divergent and there's a pretty influential Rock-Paper-Scissors sort of dynamic, where some games are largely determined when lists are revealed.

Armada has always had a something like this (e.g. back in Wave 2: No Fighters > Dogfighters > Bombers > No Fighters). This will become a greater factor in Armada with things like the Interdictor, which nerfs MC30s/Demolishers hard but has a much more minimal impact in a game against Triple Victory Super Carriers.

The MC30 is my favorite ship, but I'm sad I can no longer run it past Wave 4, because there is always the chance that I might play against an Interdictor kitted out to keep a ship's speed at 0. You can't afford to waste 90 points on a ship that might not get to roll any dice in a certain match-up...

This weekend was an epic one for me due to my wife giving me a pass. I played 9 games across Friday-Sun and faced a variety of fleets and opponents. Consistently, the same thing kept coming up; that things will turn very Rocks-Paper-Scissors. For example, the game that spurred this thread was a twin Interdictor w VSD vs my Cracken list. I got crushed. Again and again this played out, lists can definitely be competitive, but chances are you're going to run into something that you just aren't set up to handle.

My take away, so far, is that this is healthy. I think tournaments are going to be more competitive as a result. Demo lists are going to struggle with Interdictors, but will be fine against others.... And so on.

I might spend time trying to build an all-comers, but I think this will just get more and more difficult, and be ultimately pointless. For now I'm going to focus on a couple of basic list designs and just try to get really proficient with them.

From my point of view, a Rock-Paper-Scissors metagame is the opposite of being healthy for a tournament. Ultimately, the winner should not be determined by the luck of the draw (having good match-ups or not) or the list he brought, but by the skills he have playing the game. Bad match-up will happen, but you should always be able to at least handle it with skills. There is nothing worst in a game than having lost before it even began; that's the opposite of a balanced game.

This is the only miniatures game I've played, so maybe that's my inexperience.

I guess, I take some comfort in the fact that while I may get tromped in a match, it's likely that my opponent might get tromped in the next. I'm speaking in terms of a tourney.

OR I'm and old curmudgeon and you kids need to get off my lawn.

Hmm. I suppose the way I was thinking about it was that if a) I know what my list is 'best' at, I can maximize its strengths and take advantage of mismatches and b) in friendlies, I'd want to practice, practice, practice against lists that I'm not strong against and figure out a way to either tweek my list, or just figure out how to make it work when I'm at a disadvantage.

So that, off the bat, steers me away from one trick ponies where lists are say, Admiral dependent. Rieekan and Dodonna come to mind as Rebel commanders who do okay whether they die or not.

How is everyone finding the Liberty? The 2 shields on the side are really starting to bother me.. too many things in the game are fast enough to put consistent fire down onto side hulls.

The guys running these were doing well by building them slippery. Basically Engine Techs and or Madine, and Nav Commands.

But I think the match-ups are going to start getting like AllWingsStandingBy commenting. Sometimes you're going to get really advantageous games and others will be an uphill battle the whole way.

Yea, unfortunately I think this will be true. X-Wing has very much devolved into something similar. With so many options in X-Wings now, lists can be pretty divergent and there's a pretty influential Rock-Paper-Scissors sort of dynamic, where some games are largely determined when lists are revealed.

Armada has always had a something like this (e.g. back in Wave 2: No Fighters > Dogfighters > Bombers > No Fighters). This will become a greater factor in Armada with things like the Interdictor, which nerfs MC30s/Demolishers hard but has a much more minimal impact in a game against Triple Victory Super Carriers.

The MC30 is my favorite ship, but I'm sad I can no longer run it past Wave 4, because there is always the chance that I might play against an Interdictor kitted out to keep a ship's speed at 0. You can't afford to waste 90 points on a ship that might not get to roll any dice in a certain match-up...

This weekend was an epic one for me due to my wife giving me a pass. I played 9 games across Friday-Sun and faced a variety of fleets and opponents. Consistently, the same thing kept coming up; that things will turn very Rocks-Paper-Scissors. For example, the game that spurred this thread was a twin Interdictor w VSD vs my Cracken list. I got crushed. Again and again this played out, lists can definitely be competitive, but chances are you're going to run into something that you just aren't set up to handle.

My take away, so far, is that this is healthy. I think tournaments are going to be more competitive as a result. Demo lists are going to struggle with Interdictors, but will be fine against others.... And so on.

I might spend time trying to build an all-comers, but I think this will just get more and more difficult, and be ultimately pointless. For now I'm going to focus on a couple of basic list designs and just try to get really proficient with them.

From my point of view, a Rock-Paper-Scissors metagame is the opposite of being healthy for a tournament. Ultimately, the winner should not be determined by the luck of the draw (having good match-ups or not) or the list he brought, but by the skills he have playing the game. Bad match-up will happen, but you should always be able to at least handle it with skills. There is nothing worst in a game than having lost before it even began; that's the opposite of a balanced game.

I agree with your concept here, in that if it ever becomes a completely Rock-Paper-Scissor list situation then that would be bad for the game. But honestly, I'm not that worried about it. It's fine for there to be checks/counters to different fleet elements. But you can always still win. I beat a six ship Rieekan Swarm with a 5 ship DeMSU at regionals. That list should have hard countered me, right? But I was, quite frankly, the better admiral and so I won. (The fellow I played was super awesome at being a people though, which is by far the more important skill.) That's one quick example, but I'm sure we've all won games where we looked across the table at the onset and said "Well...<Insert favorite four letter word here>". Just as I'm sure we've all looked across the table at a list, snickered to ourselves, and then found ourselves humbled 2 hours later. There is such a high skill cap in this game, and I think sometimes that gets lost when we sit here and theory-craft on the forums, because when we do we have to assume equal skill on both sides of the table. In practice though, even when you have two players who are relatively equal in skill, one might be having an off day, or one might catch a spark of real inspiration and pull a miracle out of his aft.

So, for example, today after a string of defeats across the weekend, I had probably the best game in my year of playing. It was a variant of Mothma's Angels ©.

It was a blue vs blue, white-knuckle affair. After the game, we were both exhausted, and we just talked. My opponent was the more experienced player and I asked several questions, including what he thought the hard counters were. Demolisher in general and Clonisher in particular came up.

So, in the future, I'll encourage my opponents in friendlies to throw those at me, because I want to figure out how to beat them. If they don't run those, that's ok, because that'll give me a chance to play my lists strengths more effectively.

Maybe I'm being myopic, but if I focus on a few different builds and try to become proficient with them, I'm not going to get overly excited about what I bring to the table, whether I go first or second, or any number of other considerations. I had a blast with this last list today and I want to get really good with it. And, if I manage to beat a 'superior' list, all the better.

So, for example, today after a string of defeats across the weekend, I had probably the best game in my year of playing. It was a variant of Mothma's Angels ©.

It was a blue vs blue, white-knuckle affair. After the game, we were both exhausted, and we just talked. My opponent was the more experienced player and I asked several questions, including what he thought the hard counters were. Demolisher in general and Clonisher in particular came up.

So, in the future, I'll encourage my opponents in friendlies to throw those at me, because I want to figure out how to beat them. If they don't run those, that's ok, because that'll give me a chance to play my lists strengths more effectively.

Maybe I'm being myopic, but if I focus on a few different builds and try to become proficient with them, I'm not going to get overly excited about what I bring to the table, whether I go first or second, or any number of other considerations. I had a blast with this last list today and I want to get really good with it. And, if I manage to beat a 'superior' list, all the better.

How is everyone finding the Liberty? The 2 shields on the side are really starting to bother me.. too many things in the game are fast enough to put consistent fire down onto side hulls.

The guys running these were doing well by building them slippery. Basically Engine Techs and or Madine, and Nav Commands.

But I think the match-ups are going to start getting like AllWingsStandingBy commenting. Sometimes you're going to get really advantageous games and others will be an uphill battle the whole way.

Yea, unfortunately I think this will be true. X-Wing has very much devolved into something similar. With so many options in X-Wings now, lists can be pretty divergent and there's a pretty influential Rock-Paper-Scissors sort of dynamic, where some games are largely determined when lists are revealed.

Armada has always had a something like this (e.g. back in Wave 2: No Fighters > Dogfighters > Bombers > No Fighters). This will become a greater factor in Armada with things like the Interdictor, which nerfs MC30s/Demolishers hard but has a much more minimal impact in a game against Triple Victory Super Carriers.

The MC30 is my favorite ship, but I'm sad I can no longer run it past Wave 4, because there is always the chance that I might play against an Interdictor kitted out to keep a ship's speed at 0. You can't afford to waste 90 points on a ship that might not get to roll any dice in a certain match-up...

This weekend was an epic one for me due to my wife giving me a pass. I played 9 games across Friday-Sun and faced a variety of fleets and opponents. Consistently, the same thing kept coming up; that things will turn very Rocks-Paper-Scissors. For example, the game that spurred this thread was a twin Interdictor w VSD vs my Cracken list. I got crushed. Again and again this played out, lists can definitely be competitive, but chances are you're going to run into something that you just aren't set up to handle.

My take away, so far, is that this is healthy. I think tournaments are going to be more competitive as a result. Demo lists are going to struggle with Interdictors, but will be fine against others.... And so on.

I might spend time trying to build an all-comers, but I think this will just get more and more difficult, and be ultimately pointless. For now I'm going to focus on a couple of basic list designs and just try to get really proficient with them.

From my point of view, a Rock-Paper-Scissors metagame is the opposite of being healthy for a tournament. Ultimately, the winner should not be determined by the luck of the draw (having good match-ups or not) or the list he brought, but by the skills he have playing the game. Bad match-up will happen, but you should always be able to at least handle it with skills. There is nothing worst in a game than having lost before it even began; that's the opposite of a balanced game.

I agree with your concept here, in that if it ever becomes a completely Rock-Paper-Scissor list situation then that would be bad for the game. But honestly, I'm not that worried about it. It's fine for there to be checks/counters to different fleet elements. But you can always still win. I beat a six ship Rieekan Swarm with a 5 ship DeMSU at regionals. That list should have hard countered me, right? But I was, quite frankly, the better admiral and so I won. (The fellow I played was super awesome at being a people though, which is by far the more important skill.) That's one quick example, but I'm sure we've all won games where we looked across the table at the onset and said "Well...<Insert favorite four letter word here>". Just as I'm sure we've all looked across the table at a list, snickered to ourselves, and then found ourselves humbled 2 hours later. There is such a high skill cap in this game, and I think sometimes that gets lost when we sit here and theory-craft on the forums, because when we do we have to assume equal skill on both sides of the table. In practice though, even when you have two players who are relatively equal in skill, one might be having an off day, or one might catch a spark of real inspiration and pull a miracle out of his aft.

Don't get me wrong, I never said that Armada was like that or that I believed it was going this way. I was only replying against the notion that a rock-paper-scissors system makes healthy game.

I do believe that Armada is currently balanced and that your victory is more based on your skills than on the fleet you bring.

How is everyone finding the Liberty? The 2 shields on the side are really starting to bother me.. too many things in the game are fast enough to put consistent fire down onto side hulls.

The guys running these were doing well by building them slippery. Basically Engine Techs and or Madine, and Nav Commands.

But I think the match-ups are going to start getting like AllWingsStandingBy commenting. Sometimes you're going to get really advantageous games and others will be an uphill battle the whole way.

Yea, unfortunately I think this will be true. X-Wing has very much devolved into something similar. With so many options in X-Wings now, lists can be pretty divergent and there's a pretty influential Rock-Paper-Scissors sort of dynamic, where some games are largely determined when lists are revealed.

Armada has always had a something like this (e.g. back in Wave 2: No Fighters > Dogfighters > Bombers > No Fighters). This will become a greater factor in Armada with things like the Interdictor, which nerfs MC30s/Demolishers hard but has a much more minimal impact in a game against Triple Victory Super Carriers.

The MC30 is my favorite ship, but I'm sad I can no longer run it past Wave 4, because there is always the chance that I might play against an Interdictor kitted out to keep a ship's speed at 0. You can't afford to waste 90 points on a ship that might not get to roll any dice in a certain match-up...

This weekend was an epic one for me due to my wife giving me a pass. I played 9 games across Friday-Sun and faced a variety of fleets and opponents. Consistently, the same thing kept coming up; that things will turn very Rocks-Paper-Scissors. For example, the game that spurred this thread was a twin Interdictor w VSD vs my Cracken list. I got crushed. Again and again this played out, lists can definitely be competitive, but chances are you're going to run into something that you just aren't set up to handle.

My take away, so far, is that this is healthy. I think tournaments are going to be more competitive as a result. Demo lists are going to struggle with Interdictors, but will be fine against others.... And so on.

I might spend time trying to build an all-comers, but I think this will just get more and more difficult, and be ultimately pointless. For now I'm going to focus on a couple of basic list designs and just try to get really proficient with them.

From my point of view, a Rock-Paper-Scissors metagame is the opposite of being healthy for a tournament. Ultimately, the winner should not be determined by the luck of the draw (having good match-ups or not) or the list he brought, but by the skills he have playing the game. Bad match-up will happen, but you should always be able to at least handle it with skills. There is nothing worst in a game than having lost before it even began; that's the opposite of a balanced game.

I agree with your concept here, in that if it ever becomes a completely Rock-Paper-Scissor list situation then that would be bad for the game. But honestly, I'm not that worried about it. It's fine for there to be checks/counters to different fleet elements. But you can always still win. I beat a six ship Rieekan Swarm with a 5 ship DeMSU at regionals. That list should have hard countered me, right? But I was, quite frankly, the better admiral and so I won. (The fellow I played was super awesome at being a people though, which is by far the more important skill.) That's one quick example, but I'm sure we've all won games where we looked across the table at the onset and said "Well...<Insert favorite four letter word here>". Just as I'm sure we've all looked across the table at a list, snickered to ourselves, and then found ourselves humbled 2 hours later. There is such a high skill cap in this game, and I think sometimes that gets lost when we sit here and theory-craft on the forums, because when we do we have to assume equal skill on both sides of the table. In practice though, even when you have two players who are relatively equal in skill, one might be having an off day, or one might catch a spark of real inspiration and pull a miracle out of his aft.

Don't get me wrong, I never said that Armada was like that or that I believed it was going this way. I was only replying against the notion that a rock-paper-scissors system makes healthy game.

I do believe that Armada is currently balanced and that your victory is more based on your skills than on the fleet you bring.