Well but did they even run into it? It didn't do so hot over the collected regionals, maybe it wasn't overly present at gencon.

Well but did they even run into it? It didn't do so hot over the collected regionals, maybe it wasn't overly present at gencon.

Me too, no idea. But tournaments are definitely some luck based when it comes to pairings. Maybe the DeMSU got knocked out early or what not for both players, or it just didn't see its counter archetype at the tournament.

All tournaments are like this. While it's definitely skill, there is a certain breath of luck for pairings, even down to the player.

But as soon as you ram, goodbye montferrat... and I always ran, at least twice...

But as soon as you ram, goodbye montferrat... and I always ran, at least twice...

How would ramming stop Montferrat? Your ship is still considered at speed 3 even if you cannot move because of ramming.

But as soon as you ram, goodbye montferrat... and I always ran, at least twice...

How would ramming stop Montferrat? Your ship is still considered at speed 3 even if you cannot move because of ramming.

Discard Monty

But as soon as you ram, goodbye montferrat... and I always ran, at least twice...

How would ramming stop Montferrat? Your ship is still considered at speed 3 even if you cannot move because of ramming.

Discard Monty

****, completely forgot about that part, Thanks.

Well, you can't ram him.

You have to set it up so he rams you.

If you Ram him, and then, on his movement, he can completely clear your? Monty stays.

Reminder, overlapping is something you do, not something that can be done to you. Ramming your opponent does not make him count as overlapping you. Was surprised I had to point that out to an opponent who tried to ram me.

I will say this, without naming names or assigning blame: I saw several instances where people made or nearly made significant rules mistakes, likely due to how they play at home or in a slightly more forgiving competitive environment.

Everyone is allowed to make mistakes, but I'd suggest to players trying to pay at top levels that you try your best to figure out what might seen like odd corner cases. Playing Devastator for several months now has forced me to learn the entire attack process backwards and forwards, and realize that it can and wants to do many crazy things that don't initially seem to be normal for other ships.

And when you really understand how these odd corner case rules interact, you'd be surprised at how many options you can suddenly find yourself with, or even looking to set up and exploit.

Are any of the games from GenCon up online to watch?

Are any of the games from GenCon up online to watch?

They didnt record them.

Are any of the games from GenCon up online to watch?

They didnt record them.

Booo! Great to grow a competitive community is to record/stream your competitive matches. Gets people interested in the game who might not have been already and encourages casuals to get more into the competitive scene. Magic has used this to great effect over the past few years.

Are any of the games from GenCon up online to watch?

They didnt record them.

Booo! Great to grow a competitive community is to record/stream your competitive matches. Gets people interested in the game who might not have been already and encourages casuals to get more into the competitive scene. Magic has used this to great effect over the past few years.

I agree but I do know they will live Twitch the Worlds in December.

Are any of the games from GenCon up online to watch?

They didnt record them.

Booo! Great to grow a competitive community is to record/stream your competitive matches. Gets people interested in the game who might not have been already and encourages casuals to get more into the competitive scene. Magic has used this to great effect over the past few years.

I have been trying to get Team Covenant to do videos but they are dragging their heels. . .

Are any of the games from GenCon up online to watch?

They didnt record them.

Booo! Great to grow a competitive community is to record/stream your competitive matches. Gets people interested in the game who might not have been already and encourages casuals to get more into the competitive scene. Magic has used this to great effect over the past few years.

I have been trying to get Team Covenant to do videos but they are dragging their heels. . .

When they do videos they usually release them weeks or months after the actual event.

Are any of the games from GenCon up online to watch?

They didnt record them.

Booo! Great to grow a competitive community is to record/stream your competitive matches. Gets people interested in the game who might not have been already and encourages casuals to get more into the competitive scene. Magic has used this to great effect over the past few years.

I have been trying to get Team Covenant to do videos but they are dragging their heels. . .

When they do videos they usually release them weeks or months after the actual event.

I've seen plenty of 2 ship fleets in tournaments.

Though ISD/Demo is not common.

How is this not common? It's basically the standard cut Fireball. I've seen this as early as last year, pre-winter Vassal tournament, played by I think JJ?

Its either ISD-II + Demo with big bid or ISD-II with 2x Raiders with 400. That's what the Fireball is.

I think the two ship builds fell out of favor some on the forums after clon wrecked mine in the finals.

Ah yes. Defeated in one tourney means it automatically falls out of favor by the likes of the internet.

Doesn't matter now, we're so close to Wave 4 that the Demolisher will undergo a series of tests against the new meta. Will control be enough? We shall see.

I can't tell if thats a remark chiding the fickle nature of the internet or my hypothesis that clons victory cut into the popularity of two ship fleets. In case it was my point, you should be aware that there was a cavalcade of threads regarding clons list, demo, and the necessity of activation advantage which flooded the forum afterwords. It wasn't that a 2 ship list lost a game, it was the danger posed by last-first demo/mc30 activations and the difficulty in avoiding them as a two ship fleet.

I would love to see the games norm and dong played, because maintaining that margin is freaking impressive.

I would like to see the games they played against ultra bid DeMSU more.

I would also be curious if they came up against a good DeMSU list and if there were any in the tournament. Looking at the winning fleet the bomber force isn't scary enough to prevent Demo from easily finishing off the Demo flanker with Ozzel before the fighters kill your Demo. Precision strike is also going to give more points to the DeMSU than that list. My guess is there wasn't many experienced DeMSU lists and the top 2 didn't play 1.

I've seen plenty of 2 ship fleets in tournaments.

Though ISD/Demo is not common.

How is this not common? It's basically the standard cut Fireball. I've seen this as early as last year, pre-winter Vassal tournament, played by I think JJ?

Its either ISD-II + Demo with big bid or ISD-II with 2x Raiders with 400. That's what the Fireball is.

I think the two ship builds fell out of favor some on the forums after clon wrecked mine in the finals.

Ah yes. Defeated in one tourney means it automatically falls out of favor by the likes of the internet.

Doesn't matter now, we're so close to Wave 4 that the Demolisher will undergo a series of tests against the new meta. Will control be enough? We shall see.

I can't tell if thats a remark chiding the fickle nature of the internet or my hypothesis that clons victory cut into the popularity of two ship fleets. In case it was my point, you should be aware that there was a cavalcade of threads regarding clons list, demo, and the necessity of activation advantage which flooded the forum afterwords. It wasn't that a 2 ship list lost a game, it was the danger posed by last-first demo/mc30 activations and the difficulty in avoiding them as a two ship fleet.

I would love to see the games norm and dong played, because maintaining that margin is freaking impressive.

I would like to see the games they played against ultra bid DeMSU more.

I would also be curious if they came up against a good DeMSU list and if there were any in the tournament. Looking at the winning fleet the bomber force isn't scary enough to prevent Demo from easily finishing off the Demo flanker with Ozzel before the fighters kill your Demo. Precision strike is also going to give more points to the DeMSU than that list. My guess is there wasn't many experienced DeMSU lists and the top 2 didn't play 1.

I'm not taking a thing away from the top two lists (they are awesome and I want to play with them and against them since they include no rebel scum parts).

However, one of the things that is challenging is how much luck of the draw matters in the tournament. The same winning list will lose or be obliterated if it comes up against another type of list. In our Regional, my brother planned on facing a ton of DeMSU lists and had a nice B-wing build to counter them. Well he drew three opponents that not only didn't have Demo, but had great counters to his list. I faced Demo in every game. You never know what you will face.

I'm not taking a thing away from the top two lists (they are awesome and I want to play with them and against them since they include no rebel scum parts).

However, one of the things that is challenging is how much luck of the draw matters in the tournament. The same winning list will lose or be obliterated if it comes up against another type of list. In our Regional, my brother planned on facing a ton of DeMSU lists and had a nice B-wing build to counter them. Well he drew three opponents that not only didn't have Demo, but had great counters to his list. I faced Demo in every game. You never know what you will face.

I am glad you pointed this out because because the knee jerk reactions of the community after big tournaments is to assume the winning lists are unbeatable and they are not. I would say 25% of the game and your success is match ups.

I said the exact thing a page back.

Pairings is very important to pay attention to when determining the effectiveness of a particular list.

I said the exact thing a page back.

Pairings is very important to pay attention to when determining the effectiveness of a particular list.

It also comes down to the tournament.

At Tacoma I faced ArmadaJim who got a 9 point buy due to the software and randomly faced me in the second round. If he had gotten the 8 points I would not of faced him and it would of been a different tournament.