Our community has some wonderfully creative people creating the ships and squadrons that FFG has not (yet) released. I really enjoy both Kuat Drive Yards , DA's Armada Shipyards , and Mel Miniatures .

Other than the 3d models on Mel's, KDY and DA's do not (yet) seem to have a version of the VT-49 Decimator as a squadron. If I want it, then I suppose I would have to make it (and KDY does allow those to be created), unless someone beats me to the punch.

Anyway, as I haven't made anything custom yet, I figured I would pose the first-blush version here, and let people critique it into workable stats.

In X-Wing, the VT-49 is a turret ship, like the YT-1300, beefier, but a bit more sluggish. I was thinking this:

Hull: 8

Move: 2

Anti-Squadron: 2 blue, 2 black

Anti-ship: 1 black

Keywords:

• Counter 1
• Heavy
• Rogue

Points: 17

Your thoughts?

Seems fun. I'd consider running that build in a fleet.

So comparable ships

- YT1300 - 13 points - 1 less HP, 3blue antisquad instead of 2/2, Escort, Not Heavy.... Sounds reasonable

- YT2400 - 16 points - speed 4 (not 2), slightly less antifighter, 6 hull, not 8.

- Flying Garbage Truck Generic Bossk Thing - 15 points, same speed, same heavy, same antisquad, same rogue, no counter.

So you are saying this is a YV666 for 2 points more but you get counter 1 and 1 hit point...

I'd say the comparison to the rebels is ok but it basically steals the YV666's role in the fleet.

But then if you are of the opinion that the Imperials should have "line" versions of the generic rogues this might be the point!

So comparable ships

- YT1300 - 13 points - 1 less HP, 3blue antisquad instead of 2/2, Escort, Not Heavy.... Sounds reasonable

- YT2400 - 16 points - speed 4 (not 2), slightly less antifighter, 6 hull, not 8.

- Flying Garbage Truck Generic Bossk Thing - 15 points, same speed, same heavy, same antisquad, same rogue, no counter.

So you are saying this is a YV666 for 2 points more but you get counter 1 and 1 hit point...

I'd say the comparison to the rebels is ok but it basically steals the YV666's role in the fleet.

But then if you are of the opinion that the Imperials should have "line" versions of the generic rogues this might be the point!

Yeah, I think this is the best comparison. Really, probably the easiest thing to do would be to use the 666 stats and be done with it.

So comparable ships

- YT1300 - 13 points - 1 less HP, 3blue antisquad instead of 2/2, Escort, Not Heavy.... Sounds reasonable

- YT2400 - 16 points - speed 4 (not 2), slightly less antifighter, 6 hull, not 8.

- Flying Garbage Truck Generic Bossk Thing - 15 points, same speed, same heavy, same antisquad, same rogue, no counter.

So you are saying this is a YV666 for 2 points more but you get counter 1 and 1 hit point...

I'd say the comparison to the rebels is ok but it basically steals the YV666's role in the fleet.

But then if you are of the opinion that the Imperials should have "line" versions of the generic rogues this might be the point!

Yeah, I think this is the best comparison. Really, probably the easiest thing to do would be to use the 666 stats and be done with it.

The YV-666 was indeed what I was taking as the most comparable ship. It also has a black anti-ship (non-bomber) die, rather than a non-bomber blue. Also, it replaces grit with counter.

It's not my agenda to replace the YV-666. I'm just thinking that the Decimator should be represented, and I'm thinking about what that would be like.

What about using the rules for the YV666 with the Decimators' model ?

It's pretty comparable overall, I actually wouldn't mind gunships over Rogues, but they'd need something different imho

I wonder whether the Decimator would actually play a different role from the YV666. That would be a mercenary ship, hired in to support the fleet but still being somewhat independent. The Decimator (according to cannon) served as picket ships, filling in the gaps between the main capital ships. They were also used as firebombers during ground assaults, so I think a bomber keyword would work. So I think lots of hull and low speed is absolutely what we should be looking out, but playing a less independent and specialised anti-squadron role. I see it sticking with capital ships, warding off enemy fighters and providing a threat to any capital ships that come too close.

Would the VT-49 be likely to show? It fits very well in X-Wing because in a dogfight it's usually the biggest ship there. As a solo patrol craft is it likely to turn up in large scale fleet engagements?

I would consider:

8 hull with counter is a lot maybe drop it to 7 ?

Anti ship wise it's got torpedoes so may be a red bomber dice like an x wing ?

18 Points, is it better, worse or the same value as a fire spray ? That gives you your balance re points.

Would the VT-49 be likely to show? It fits very well in X-Wing because in a dogfight it's usually the biggest ship there. As a solo patrol craft is it likely to turn up in large scale fleet engagements?

Probably:

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/VT-49_Decimator/Legends

Decimators were used as either long-range reconnaissance units or picket ships stationed along the perimeter of Imperial fleets . Sometimes Decimators were used to break through enemy forces to deploy raiding parties.

Would the VT-49 be likely to show? It fits very well in X-Wing because in a dogfight it's usually the biggest ship there. As a solo patrol craft is it likely to turn up in large scale fleet engagements?

I counter with the following:

YT-1300, YT-2400, YV-666, HWK-290 - Freighters

Jumpmaster 5000 - Long range scout ship

How likely are these to show up in large scale fleet engagements?

The YT-49 at least has the advantage of being a ship designed as a military ship first and foremost.

Would the VT-49 be likely to show? It fits very well in X-Wing because in a dogfight it's usually the biggest ship there. As a solo patrol craft is it likely to turn up in large scale fleet engagements?

The B-wing and the YT-1300 are speed 2.

I like the thought behind it, and love the Decimator. Would be a fun one to play around with.

I'd be happy to see actual Imperial equipment being used for single ship squadrons, it personally kind of feels a little weird that the Empire has to use Scum ships.

I imagine the Decimator in a pack that contains Lambda shuttles.

I wonder whether the Decimator would actually play a different role from the YV666. That would be a mercenary ship, hired in to support the fleet but still being somewhat independent. The Decimator (according to cannon) served as picket ships, filling in the gaps between the main capital ships. They were also used as firebombers during ground assaults, so I think a bomber keyword would work. So I think lots of hull and low speed is absolutely what we should be looking out, but playing a less independent and specialised anti-squadron role. I see it sticking with capital ships, warding off enemy fighters and providing a threat to any capital ships that come too close.

As others have said, my mind was more on its role as a patrol vessel. Something that, like Blue Five argued, is meant to operate away from the fleet, searching for Rebel and pirate activity in order to deal with small-scale threats and make the fleet aware of large-scale threats. He is right that this role is not directly germane to Armada, but neither are - directly speaking - the freighters that come in R&V. The point here is that it needs to be able to operate independently from the fleet.

You mention its role as a picket ship. A picket ship is also a vessel that operates at some distance from the fleet, because the purpose of pickets is to warn the fleet of approaching threats - to expand the sensor range. As such, it should also not be reliant on the direct proximity of command vessels.

That was my thinking behind adding the keyword 'Rogue'. (Well, the patrol ship aspect was. I had forgotten about its role as a picket. )

I would consider:

8 hull with counter is a lot maybe drop it to 7 ?

Anti ship wise it's got torpedoes so may be a red bomber dice like an x wing ?

18 Points, is it better, worse or the same value as a fire spray ? That gives you your balance re points.

The 8 hull I get from X-Wing, where it is has more hull than any other single-card ship in the game.

Hm, a red die might be justifiable. What does the hive mind think?

I haven't seen anybody really object to the 18 points. It certainly fulfills a different role than the Firespray, which is a bomber, rather than an anti-squadron ship the way I'm conceiving of the Decimator.

Thinking out loud, Decimator would make a really nice outrider for a Gozanti, particularly if it had bomber as I suggested above. Given that Gozantis have only minimal dice, both for anti-capital and anti-squadron, a slow-moving heavy-hitter with plenty of hull and a decent pool to throw against either a swarm of squadrons or a ship could provide a sort of heavy escort for the more vulnerable ship.

I wonder whether the Decimator would actually play a different role from the YV666. That would be a mercenary ship, hired in to support the fleet but still being somewhat independent. The Decimator (according to cannon) served as picket ships, filling in the gaps between the main capital ships. They were also used as firebombers during ground assaults, so I think a bomber keyword would work. So I think lots of hull and low speed is absolutely what we should be looking out, but playing a less independent and specialised anti-squadron role. I see it sticking with capital ships, warding off enemy fighters and providing a threat to any capital ships that come too close.

As others have said, my mind was more on its role as a patrol vessel. Something that, like Blue Five argued, is meant to operate away from the fleet, searching for Rebel and pirate activity in order to deal with small-scale threats and make the fleet aware of large-scale threats. He is right that this role is not directly germane to Armada, but neither are - directly speaking - the freighters that come in R&V. The point here is that it needs to be able to operate independently from the fleet.

You mention its role as a picket ship. A picket ship is also a vessel that operates at some distance from the fleet, because the purpose of pickets is to warn the fleet of approaching threats - to expand the sensor range. As such, it should also not be reliant on the direct proximity of command vessels.

That was my thinking behind adding the keyword 'Rogue'. (Well, the patrol ship aspect was. I had forgotten about its role as a picket. )

That makes sense! In fairness, you could also have more than one variant, or different keywords depending on whether it's a standard squadron or named one. A named squadron could perhaps get Rogue, to reflect it having greater independence from the fleet, as well as greater anti-fighter capabilities. The standard could lose the Rogue keyword to have slightly less autonomy, but be a slightly more rounded squadron in terms of capabilities by adding bomber.

Thinking aloud mainly! But I'd love to see this ship brought into the game.

Or, what about...

as a flotilla?

*ducks*

Here's the current version on KDY:

VT-49 Decimator

I took Jondavies72 's advice on the anti-ship die. Furthermore, while I was able to get an image that didn't look too bad scaled to 1650x900, I wanted to play around with FoaS' article on Making Small Art Work , which I think is really amazing stuff.

Taking this in a different direction, should the VT be a flotilla over a squadron maybe?

Another factor to consider is I think it can be said that the VT was designed to be a military vessel as compared to something pressed into service. I mean hey I'm sure garbage can absorb damage and all but I'd like to think the VT is at least designed for it and as a result the stats should be better for it.

So for me if it's a squadron :

Hull: 7

Taking this in a different direction, should the VT be a flotilla over a squadron maybe?

Another factor to consider is I think it can be said that the VT was designed to be a military vessel as compared to something pressed into service. I mean hey I'm sure garbage can absorb damage and all but I'd like to think the VT is at least designed for it and as a result the stats should be better for it.

So for me if it's a squadron :

Hull: 7

Move: 3

Anti-Squadron: 1 blue, 2 black

Anti-ship: 2 blue

Keywords:

Counter 1

Bomber

Rogue

Grit

Points: 22

Ah, you're taking this in a very different direction, so I want to take the challenge seriously. Your idea is much more as an anti-ship platform than anti-squadron. You also see it as a faster ship. We share 'Rogue' and 'Counter 1'.

There's so very little in the lore to suggest it as one or the other. I guess, in Star Wars: Commander (which is Canon, not Legends) it is a bomber in that it is deployed against infantry. So, I think you score points for your interpretation there.

My conception comes from its stated role as a long-range reconnaissance vessel (it also says that it's a transport for raiding parties, which would be a ground role). In regard to reconnaissance, I guess it would be there to detect enemy fleets. If it's just there to detect and not engage, the most immediate threat to it would be enemy fighters being sent to destroy it before it could complete its sensor scanning mission and hit the hyperdrives to report back to the fleet. (Ergo: Counter 1 and anti-squadron.)

But you make a good point. What does everyone else think?

In the wiki it said that the design was originally created so the imperials could have a craft similar to the yt1300. So I think the comparison to a Squad (since that is where they went with the 1300) is right on. Stat wise I liked the fact that where you started was so similar to the YT because I felt that was spot on too. It is pretty much a militarized Millenium Falcon, so adding bomber I think waters down it's role makes it a feel like a point-bloated jack of all trades master of none. I think the YT1300 and YV666 should be the primary inspirations for the stats and I feel that was relatively well done in the way the card the way it was posted.

In x-wing Decimator has higher speed green maneuvers than YT-1300, so maybe it could get speed 3 - it would make it different to YV-666.

Hull - 6 or 7

- I must say that I don't really like high hull values on "big ship" squadrons - I don't know how many ships are represented by one stand, but it is strange that they are so much more robust than snubfighters, especially against capital ship fire, while actually bigger ships should be easier to hit by piont defence than a swarm of smaller and usually faster targets. In fact it is practically impossible for Victory to destroy a single YT-1300 in 6 turns, but no problem to shoot down hundreads of Tie Fighters. And the fact that roughly half of available capital ships can deal up to 6 hits to Firespray (6 turns) and 3 on average, while Firespray can deal up to 12 and 9 on average through 6 turn of fire is quite difficult to explain. But maybe one stand is a lot of Firesprays.

Bomber - looking at X-wing version of Decimator (torpedo and bomb slot) bobmer keyword is fitting

I really like the idea to introduce the ability to activate other squadrons + rogue, or maybe "all squadrons at distance 1 may activate as if they have rogue" - it is very fitting to Decimator's role as "patrol leader", and would allow for new tactics. This would require speed 3, to be practical. Decimator would not have to be rogue itself - crew is too ocupied with coordinating other squadrons to move and shoot. This would probably require new keyword, but it could also be unique pilot's ability - so we couldn't spawn it.

Counter 1 - actually i think that all squadrons equipped with turrets should have counter

Heavy,

3 blue anti - squadron

1 red or 1black anti ship

one problem is that the generic YV666 currently kind of sucks. Very few people have used it and figured out what its good for. (If anything).

Seond, I see the VT as being faster than 2 speed.

I think at this point, we need new keywords for squadrons.

Rebels seriously lack a cheap Rogue with Bomber.

The only thing the Imperials lack atm is.... err. Nothing i guess.

What if its like a serious pounder alone?

Point Cost 18

Hull 7

Move 3

AA: blue blue black black

Batt: blue black

Lone Wolf : When attacking or defending against a squadron, if there are no other allied squadrons within distance 3, you may reroll two dice of your choice.

(No other keywords)

Engages a flank of fighters, not heavy. Can easily win 1v2 or even 1v3. Still requires sq commands, not rogue. Extremely good superiority fighter that needs commands. Unlike the Aggressor.

No Bomber, but gives you an avg of 1.25 hits if needed to attack ships.

Oh, the perfect fighter for the 1 command ships like the Raider. Fly a Deci next to your Raider. Lock down a small group of fighters for your Raider's next turn volley.