A NO from my side also.

Why ?

Someone said it if you want to play vampires - play WoD. And even there you play the good guys - your supposed to keep it secret (The masquarade). If you want to play the bad guys theres a hogshead Publishing product: It is called Violence. IIRC correctly you get more exp for slaying a single mom student than for a student.

There are no cool adventures for evil guys. The cool thing about WFRP was, that the players hat to keep on human rules and morality. Not like DnD were there were wading throu the blood of their enemies.

Greets Wk

But we already have a bestiary incoming

And I'm not into playing vampires, or WoD

I want to play as an Orc, or Scaven !!

And it doesn't have to cripple future expansions.

It can be done like in 2-nd ed.

While they were describing a race, they just added some rules for creating such characters.

It just adds more play options!

But Sunatet, that wasn't commoner's suggestion. He said, and I quoted him, that he wanted FFG to stop the Creature Vault and Creature Guide (ie the "boring old beastiary") and make them into a "Dark Core". So, yes, his suggestion is damaging the future expansions.

As I said, I don't mind the idea of a "Dark Core". I don't think I'd run an entire campaign of evil PCs, but like any RPG, it is occasionally fun to run/play a game or two as the other side. So, as an additional supplement it's not a bad idea. As a replacement for the beastiary (CG/CV) it's a horrible idea (IMHO).

Now, we also have to keep in mind the number of people designing the supplements (essentially two, Jay and Dan) and the amount of stuff they are already working on. It's doubtful they have much ability, if any, to alter their already frenetic pace of scheduled releases through 2011. Their plates are pretty full, so it's a question of priorities. There is lots of stuff that I know Jay wants to add to WFRP, its just a matter of time and resources. They have to manage what is needed before what, as well as keeping supplements interesting and varied for the consumers. In essence, while a "Dark Core" is a fun idea, and one that I expect to see in some form or other in the future, there is just so much other more basic and important stuff to add before spending the time and resources to make an "alternative" product like the "Dark Core".

But i think it is more about the "dark Core" idea, and less about replacing the normal line of announced products, in the end, fantasy flight will not stop works that probalbt are already finished, but the idea of implementing other evil races in the future for playing them, is amazing. It can be done via that idea of a "Evil Box" or dark Core, or even as a suplemment as signs of faith, or similars.

And i believe there can be many, many adventures that can be done by evil characters, and as any hero can become a villian , it will be also good to see that a villan can be a antihero, if at least for selfish motives. I believe seen the others races perspective , will do a lot of good to the setting, showing the ambiguity and true Chaos of the nature of all the mortals in Warhammer.

I don't understand peoples want to play "evil" races. If you want to play an evil character play a Witch Hunter, Flagellant or a Thug A far more interesting story then a Evil story is a story where the players do the right thing the wrong way.

Evil stands out when your expected to be good, If your character makes a deal with the ruinous powers to accomplish his objective, or kills a criminal that should of been jailed: their Evil! They don't need to wear big black armour with spikes or be a dark elf or an ork. You can play very evil characters as the game is already.

Ork's have little room for character or story, and Skaven are only slightly better. And chaos and dark elves will probably result in characters trying to do the most absurd overly-evil thing they can. Most of thease races have been designed to be antagonists and leave little room for anything but mindless killing and if that's what you want from a game: play a skirmish game or a war game, Those games are balanced and have the objective "Defeat your Adversary" as apposed to role playing games that are designed for ROLE PLAYING!

If you want evil races very badly, make them yourself.

reidchapman said:

Let me explain then.

World of Warhammer is big with many places to explore, many races, many cultures.

Some people can play their entire lives without even thinking of setting foot out of Empire borders, never choose another race than human to play, never choose a mage to play and are happy with it (I know such people, I don't understand them in the same way they don't understand me).

Others go a step forward, they choose different professions, different races, maybe even go out outside of the empire and are happy with it too (that's probably a majority of people that play warhammer).

But there are also those, that want to experience this world on as many ways as possible, go to every place there is, play as many races as thay can, try different professions.

Orcs have no less roleplaying oportunities than when you play a crazied stuntie with big axe and orange mohawk on his head, they are just different.

Druchii have a culture too, it's wicked yes, but it is a culture.

Becoming a chaos warrior is a long and dangerous path. A path full of adventure.

And to play a skaven... You have to enter the highest peaks of social skills to survive in there (a good pointed flattery, intimidation, shady deal). All about intrigue.

Its not that "evil" races lack the opurtinities to roleplay, or are all about killing. It is about what you make it. It is about experiencing the world in a new exciting way. It's about fun, and possibilities. It's about trying something new.

Saying that evil races are not good for play, because you are happy with the ones you have is like trying the creme from the top of the cake and saying "mmm, this creme is good, but I don't like the cake" without even trying the cake.

There are people that want to dig deep in the cake.

I LIKE THE CAKE!

@Dvang

Looks like I mixed something up then.

And yeah, they have small team, but very creative

Some base attribute values for a race, creation points pool, special traits, list of available careers (ie: all with combat or military traits), some roleplaying guidelines and we are good to go.

Its like one or two pages in the book, the content will not be hurt by it.

If they add to this some race specific careers I call it a bonus (and they are already creating action cards for all the monster races in the Creature Vault).

Besides, all of that was done before, so it can be done again... someday I hope.

why are we having a discussion wether we like the idea or not of having a Dark Core set?

It will never happen anyway, It won`t happen, it doesn`t suit either FFG nor GW policy. In Night`s Dark Masters, which was a 2nd e sourcebook about vampires in Sylvania, they deliberately removed some vampire careers just to make that undead race less playable. And they strongly adviced against playing a vampire, all of this can be found in that book, it gave me a strong indication of GW policy.

But I agree with Sunatet that the Creature guide should contain rules to adapt your own monsters, like having Building points to tailorsuit your own black orc. and in away that would be enough to adapt almost any creature into a playable race if you are creative enough (or deviant enough)

But having a true dark core set, where races like dark-elves, and kurgan are represented as player races? No that will simply never happen.

@Sunatet

First of all, When was I saying anything about races other then humans, I completely support the Idea of having more stuff for Elves, Dwarves, Brettonians, Tileans etc. and I don't think campaigns should stay only within the realms of the Empire.

It's not that I don't want to play other races, It's just that the Warhammer World has been designed to be looked at through the looking glass of the good guys, Orks are, In many ways, The Perfect adversary: Their Stronger then you yet can easily be outsmarted, Their brutal minded and you'd have to be very liberal in your application of the word "sentient" to use it to describe them, So theirs no moral problems with killing them. They Exist for no purpose other then to be a constant threat to the Empire and Dwarves.

The races you face are single purposed and non-developed, One exception.

Corruption, corruption makes interesting plots and characters, I would appreciate fully worked out corruption rules to allow characters to become chaotic.

I would further like to point out that it is very unlikely that a "dark core" will ever come out, so why don't you just make house rules.

Orks - make an ork as you would any other character

Str 4

Tog 3

Agi 2

Wil 2

Int 1

Fel 2

Wound Threshold 12 + Tog

Orks regenerate 1 wound an hour and 1 critical wound a week

An Ork may waagh once per session, giving all Ork allies +1 white dice to all attacks until end of turn, this stacks with other orks Waagh-ing.

Orks can be Choppa's (equivalent to troll slayer), Black Orks (Grudge Bearer), Boy (Soldier), Arrer Boy (Hunter) or Runt herder (Rat catcher)

Now all you have to do is pretend the picture of a dog is actually a snotling and then you can play an ork campaign.

reidchapman said:

AWESOME

Nice ideas!

Was just about to stat Dark up - starting with orcs. glad i checked

Btw - Ork is 40k. WFB/RP is just orc still.

@ chriscdo

thanks for the correction, didn't notice that until you pointed it out.