Para, can you please explain how you work out the point value of palp uses

You simply divide the point cost of a ship by its amount of health.

I run a 31 point Inquisitor. Each of health of his is worth 7.75 points.

Each 38 point Vessery health I save is worth 6.333... which I round to 6.25.

Each Palp Shuttle health is worth 3.1.

I also calculate the extra damage Palpatine contributes in the same way, although when he adds a direct hit crit or stunned pilot on a ship that bumps and takes a damage I count that too.

So when I use Palpatine to save Vessery from an asteroid damage, I get 6.25 points of value from it.

So by your flawed logic Crackshot and Juke should also cost more

Right now Palp Aces is dominent, but it's not solely because of Palpatine.

Wave 8 introduced the Uboat/Jumpmaster ordinance carrier. This, more than anything else, scared off Rebel control and regen lists which acted as a good check to Palp Ace squads. The recent FAQ included a "soft nerf" which will have a positive flow on effect.

Right now I've noted more and more Rebel lists creeping back into the meta, with the Ghost/Dash and Corran/Biggs pairing becoming more popular. I love flying Dash/Ghost - one of my favorite lists at the moment.

FYI yes I do frequently fly Palp Ace squads and in no way regard it as a auto-win option. It does take some thought and skill to make truly effective. It can be easily countered if you know how to fly against it. Just practice.

I used to fly Imps without Palp before I got the card. And yes, it was harder and took more concentration. Palpatine is more insurance than significant game changer.

There are some good lists and strategies that act as natural counters to Palp Aces (not just Uboats) - I suggest exploring those.

I think this is a great comment. Palpatine is a symptom (and a bad one!) but not the disease. JumpMaster is the issue here as it has knocked so much other stuff which could control Palp out of contention.

This is a completely ridiculous comment and an example of Imperial players and their obnoxious greed/inability to see just how broken the ships they fly are.

Palp Aces kills off all of the U-Boat counters. It goes both ways, and a meta where Palp Aces was eliminated and U-Boats were left standing would be an easier one to deal with as all you'd have to do is bid to PS 4. Hell, triple Defender kicks U-Boat ass and those are just PS 1 ones.

I don't play Imperial, I play rebel! - and I stick by my comment! Palp is good, perhaps too good but I think U-boats are still the current problem in the meta. While Palp was good in the pre-U-boat meta, we still saw plenty of other builds and those builds were competitive - think rebel regen, or fat turrets or k-wings or whatever. Where are all these builds now? Gone because they can't stand up to the alpha strike from the combo of cards on the U-boat.

Palp aces have counters

U-boats have counters

However Palp aces kill off U-boat counters and viceversa (that's the big issue).

A meta with u-boats and no Palpatine will be just as healthy as a meta with Palpatine and no u-boats, so why are the u-boats a bigger problem than Palpatine?

Para, can you please explain how you work out the point value of palp uses

You simply divide the point cost of a ship by its amount of health.

I run a 31 point Inquisitor. Each of health of his is worth 7.75 points.

Each 38 point Vessery health I save is worth 6.333... which I round to 6.25.

Each Palp Shuttle health is worth 3.1.

I also calculate the extra damage Palpatine contributes in the same way, although when he adds a direct hit crit or stunned pilot on a ship that bumps and takes a damage I count that too.

So when I use Palpatine to save Vessery from an asteroid damage, I get 6.25 points of value from it.

So by your flawed logic Crackshot and Juke should also cost more

It's good that they're undercosted and that Crackshot has that weird omniscient timing window.

Ideally the game wouldn't be filled with invincible ships in the first place, and then we wouldn't need undercosted offensive cards either. Like ideally Alex Davy wouldn't have saturated this game with stupid turrets so we wouldn't need autothrusters and could go back to damaging things at range 3 again.

DO NOT nerf Palpatine!

Please add Yoda and Jabba the Hutt to counter balance him!

Yaknow im glad when im attacking/defending i mod my dice after you. If they introduced Yoda as an inverse Palp that could literally counter him if the mod steps went in reverse lol

"Once per round you may modify one of your opponent's die results to another"

As you manipulate your own dice last, your Yoda would technical not a counter to palpatine, but an offensive version of palpatine. ;-)

Though I would like to see Yoda in the game, I do like his star fighter. I am not sure if he should mirror the emperor's ability to manipulate his surroundings thought. It does not fit his theme. Adding focus results to allies sounds more like Yoda's thing.

Yoda

Reversed the order of dice rolling and modification is, yes? Hmmmm!

(when declaring an attack, handle step 4 & 5 of the timing chart before resolving step 2 and 3).

Yoda

Reversed the order of dice rolling and modification is, yes? Hmmmm!

(when declaring an attack, handle step 4 & 5 of the timing chart before resolving step 2 and 3).

Sounds ridiculously fun.

Declare the attack, declare all the re-rolls and tokens you use, all card effects.

the enemy declares what tokens and effects they deal

AND THEN YOU CRACKSHOT O_O

Yoda

Reversed the order of dice rolling and modification is, yes? Hmmmm!

(when declaring an attack, handle step 4 & 5 of the timing chart before resolving step 2 and 3).

Sounds ridiculously fun.

Declare the attack, declare all the re-rolls and tokens you use, all card effects.

the enemy declares what tokens and effects they deal

AND THEN YOU CRACKSHOT O_O

R3 is suddenly very useful too

I have to hand it to JimbonX. He is easily the best troll on these forums, and I don't think he is even aware of it. That's talent..

Nerf Stupids Always Wanting NERF!

Ner- *!#@Guagh!!!

Potential fix.

Yoda - Two Crew Slots - 7 Pts

Emperor Palpatine's game text is cancelled.

Yoda is small. Perhaps he takes up 0 crew slots and is merely an upgrade card that lives besides your ships.

I would gladly fly 93 point lists if it meant Palpatine was totally neutralized.

Nerfherder

10 points, modification

At the beginning of the game, choose an equipped upgrade card. Opponent discards that card.

Nerf Palpatine FFG. Make it the same way as a deadeye. You have to spend Palpatine before a ship attacks or defence and only once per round. That way, you force a player to take a uncertain choise, instead of using Palpatine as a crackshot.

He wouldn't be the Emperor then now would he?

Nerfherder

10 points, modification

At the beginning of the game, choose an equipped upgrade card. Opponent discards that card.

Nerfs are like bantas.

And bantas are filthy animals.™

I don't equip filthy animal upgrades.

Nerfherder

10 points, modification

At the beginning of the game, choose an equipped upgrade card. Opponent discards that card.

Nerfs are like bantas.

And bantas are filthy animals.™

I don't equip filthy animal upgrades.

Nerfherder

10 points, modification

At the beginning of the game, choose an equipped upgrade card. Opponent discards that card.

Nerfs are like bantas.

And bantas are filthy animals.™

I don't equip filthy animal upgrades.

I'll get the ones that come out the backdoor...

FFG; nerf Jimbonx . Please replace him with a kebab or pasty or some bacon.

FFG; nerf Jimbonx . Please replace him with a kebab or pasty or some bacon.

Don't let these kids bother you... to much.

Nerfing aside - I think it would have been a good contrast if Palp allowed you to mod an Attack die and Yoda (or Obi Wan) did the same for a Defense die.

(though, statistically makes Yoda better since there are less Evades on a green)

FFG; nerf Jimbonx . Please replace him with a kebab or pasty or some bacon.

Don't let these kids bother you... to much.

Not really bothered, I'm just bored of seeing his "the game needs fixing" threads. It was meant to come across a bit more tongue in cheek than maybe it does

I love how people think the value of a ship lies in its hull and shields alone. The attack dice mean nothing. The defense dice mean nothing. Pilot ability and dial mean nothing. Congratulations Paragoomba, you know how to do simple arithmetic, but you are not truly calculating the value of Palpatine. You're grossly overestimating it.

Might he be undercosted? Yes, but not nearly by what you are saying.

I love how people think the value of a ship lies in its hull and shields alone. The attack dice mean nothing. The defense dice mean nothing. Pilot ability and dial mean nothing. Congratulations Paragoomba, you know how to do simple arithmetic, but you are not truly calculating the value of Palpatine. You're grossly overestimating it.

Might he be undercosted? Yes, but not nearly by what you are saying.

It's a guy that gives you a free "shield" once per turn.

when you operate ships that have 3-4 HP total, if he saves even 2 HP for the ship, he already made the day.

So nope, he's not exaggerating it, Palp really is bloody awesome with squishy aces.

I love how people think the value of a ship lies in its hull and shields alone. The attack dice mean nothing. The defense dice mean nothing. Pilot ability and dial mean nothing. Congratulations Paragoomba, you know how to do simple arithmetic, but you are not truly calculating the value of Palpatine. You're grossly overestimating it.

Might he be undercosted? Yes, but not nearly by what you are saying.

Actually, that's kind of precisely what he is doing.

He's making an assumption that if Soontir costs 35pts and has 3 Hull/Shields then each point of damage he prevents is worth 11.7pts - those 11.7pts being the weighted cost of all the red dice/green dice/dial/actions etc of Soontir Fel.

I'm not saying his system is a good one, but it's at least doing that.

The best response I've seen is from the guy who said "yeah, that's great, now are you calculating the value you get from all your other synergies and upgrades?". Like, when you boost out of arc because of Push The Limit are you assigning a value generated based on average amount of damage you didn't take as a result? When you reroll a blank to a hit with Howlrunner are you assigning a value based on how much of your opponent's value you removed?

Without context to other common effects the 'value' generated by Palp is just a number.

LOL!!! Nobody would ever use him for that point cost! He's a great addition to the game. Why don't you go after him first like you're supposed to...rebel scum!

The easiest fix for Palp besides epic only (could you imagine the fury of people who bought awesome epic ships but hate fun so they never play them?) is to limit his result changing to eyes.

He can't pull a crit or evade out of his wrinkly backside, but so long as you have modification you can make use of him. A minor nerf, not unlike the R4 agromech timing change.