First of all, I know nothing about the current L5R game. That being said, I'm hoping they go for mechanics that will make the game mainstream. Amongst those that play mainstream card games, there seems to be a lot of appreciation for the Force of Will mechanics (though the art is not to everyones taste). Is it a safe assumption that FFG are taking all modern games like this into account as they are designing the game? Or do you think they will do something like re-brand AGOT as L5R more or less... with some added L5R mechanics?
How Radical? Similar to Force of Will?
It's radical to the max.
I think they will (or given the timetable, already did) take all of the elements that define L5R, and figure out a way to distill and streamline them into a game that honors the spirit of the CCG, while being relevant to the present age of customizable card gaming.
The thing with FoW that is so revolutionary (though not really), is that your "mana" cards are not part of your main deck, so there's no way you will get resource screwed.
These types of mechanics have been in previous games as well, so it's nothing new from FoW. In both Call of Cthulhu LCG and the World of Warcraft TCG you can play any card from your hand facedown as a resource. Game of Thrones gets around the "gold screw" by having you plan your turns around the gold production of your Plot Cards (which are also their own side deck). Even Netrunner has a default way to get your economy rolling, Clicking for a Credit, and it helps that you actually get to bank your credits turn after turn.
The thing that L5R NEVER got right is how to avoid the Gold Screw. They tried by introducing Gifts and Favors, then Border Keep and Bamboo Harvester, but it never really solved the problem of drawing into Holdings when you needed personalities late game, or drawing Personalities early game when you needed economy. Not to mention that some Blitz decks got ridiculous (like Scorpion Paragon-Jojimbo deck that didn't use any gold aside from the SH, BK and BH).
So yea, I hope FF modernizes the way economy works in L5R, cause praying for 2 Holdings and 2 Personalities on the first turn is old.
Edited by El_GansoNot to mention that some Blitz decks got ridiculous (like Scorpion Paragon-Jojimbo deck that didn't use any gold aside from the SH, BK and BH).
The Parajimbo deck was never a Blitz deck, nor did it eschew Holdings (though it did only have 8)
Not to mention that some Blitz decks got ridiculous (like Scorpion Paragon-Jojimbo deck that didn't use any gold aside from the SH, BK and BH).
The Parajimbo deck was never a Blitz deck, nor did it eschew Holdings (though it did only have 8)
Oh yea, it did have 8 holdings, though it did skew on the speedy side (though nothing will ever be as fast as ye olde 30/30 Lion with Charge, Strength of Purity, Destiny, Wedge, etc etc etc)
Anyway, point is: L5R's economy scheme was old and broken and needs a fix badly
The thing that L5R NEVER got right is how to avoid the Gold Screw. They tried by introducing Gifts and Favors, then Border Keep and Bamboo Harvester, but it never really solved the problem of drawing into Holdings when you needed personalities late game, or drawing Personalities early game when you needed economy. Not to mention that some Blitz decks got ridiculous (like Scorpion Paragon-Jojimbo deck that didn't use any gold aside from the SH, BK and BH).
So yea, I hope FF modernizes the way economy works in L5R, cause praying for 2 Holdings and 2 Personalities on the first turn is old.
You stopped in Emperor, right? So you're completely wrong.
In Ivory Edition there were three mechanics to fix it:
1) Rulebook Cycle mechanic that allow to refill your cards in Provinces (like on Border Keep).
2) Kharmic keyword, so building your dynasty around recycable Holdings (alike Famous Bazaar or Spirits Essence Dojo ), Holdings with Kharmic keyword or special Senseis minimized you chances of "flooded by Holdings" in late game.
3) Option to search for Legacy Holdings every round even if you bought Holdings from Province to avoid gold screw.
All of them caused that game flow was much better than in earlier editions, i mean number of games lost by problems with Holdings decreased dramatically.
Edited by kempy(though nothing will ever be as fast as ye olde 30/30 Lion with Charge, Strength of Purity, Destiny, Wedge, etc etc etc)
Emperor Edition blitz decks were fast enough to finish game in 3rd round (Lion, FotM or JEKxp ). Only because of cheaper guys, additional startiing Holding with ability to cycle Hand and Provinces and many control cards both on Dynasty and Fate. FotM and JEKxp blitzes were also without Personalities in Dynasty, everything was based on creating them from hand or Holdings.
Lotus Rats from Clone Your Buddy Stronghold also had good chances to finish on 4th round (you know Broad Front and multiple followers from Reinforcements Arrives did miracles).
Edited by kempyThe thing with FoW that is so revolutionary (though not really), is that your "mana" cards are not part of your main deck, so there's no way you will get resource screwed.
These types of mechanics have been in previous games as well, so it's nothing new from FoW. In both Call of Cthulhu LCG and the World of Warcraft TCG you can play any card from your hand facedown as a resource. Game of Thrones gets around the "gold screw" by having you plan your turns around the gold production of your Plot Cards (which are also their own side deck). Even Netrunner has a default way to get your economy rolling, Clicking for a Credit, and it helps that you actually get to bank your credits turn after turn.
Also in The Spoils where you can start with two Resources ("lands") of your choice and every card from hand might be placed face-down as colorless additional one (+ Flip-Up mechanic that allow to use them later as normal card).
The thing with FoW that is so revolutionary (though not really), is that your "mana" cards are not part of your main deck, so there's no way you will get resource screwed.
These types of mechanics have been in previous games as well, so it's nothing new from FoW. In both Call of Cthulhu LCG and the World of Warcraft TCG you can play any card from your hand facedown as a resource. Game of Thrones gets around the "gold screw" by having you plan your turns around the gold production of your Plot Cards (which are also their own side deck). Even Netrunner has a default way to get your economy rolling, Clicking for a Credit, and it helps that you actually get to bank your credits turn after turn.
Also in The Spoils where you can start with two Resources ("lands") of your choice and every card from hand might be placed face-down as colorless additional one (+ Flip-Up mechanic that allow to use them later as normal card).
People just tended to put two resources of one "color" at their starters and then put another "color" in the deck in Spoils. I'd rather not see that for L5R, as it could mess with clan identity.
I don't mind seeing some a few holdings start out in play (maybe tied to the stronghold-type or clan-type card) to help with mana/gold screw. I have a feeling the new game will be slower or more methodical at its outset, which should also help some of the problems.