Veteran Gunners makes you reroll all dice. Maybe I am missing something, but the card looks miserable. I get that with SW7s, your blues are always useful. So rerolling them is probably no loss unless your reroll removes your needed acuracies.

Leading shots seems significantly better for the large Mon Cal ships.

Maybe over lunch i can go mathwars on it and see what works better.

Mind that you are allowed to spend any accuracy results to block defense tokens before rerolling all remaining dice in the attack pool.

Its not a great card at first sight, but it gives some failsafe ability to those underwhelming roles everybody has experienced already. Spend the 1-2 accuracies you need, afterwards reroll the entire remaining pool as long as its damage output is below average.

If you bring more than one reroll ability it is a nice first reroll try as well, since you dont have to sacrifice other dice (leading shots) or tokens (Vader, TRC).

I will give them a try on ships that reliably have to deal damage to play their part.

I'm confused here...according to this post: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/181567-do-you-have-questions-about-attacking-defense-tokens-and-critical-hits-read-this-first/, in Step 3, you modify the dice BEFORE declaring accuracy results. So wouldn't Veteran Gunners happen before declaring accuracy results?

But spending accuracy dice happens in the same step. Therefore you spend the accuracy and then reroll with Veteran gunners.

Veteran Gunners makes you reroll all dice. Maybe I am missing something, but the card looks miserable. I get that with SW7s, your blues are always useful. So rerolling them is probably no loss unless your reroll removes your needed acuracies.

Leading shots seems significantly better for the large Mon Cal ships.

Maybe over lunch i can go mathwars on it and see what works better.

Mind that you are allowed to spend any accuracy results to block defense tokens before rerolling all remaining dice in the attack pool.

Its not a great card at first sight, but it gives some failsafe ability to those underwhelming roles everybody has experienced already. Spend the 1-2 accuracies you need, afterwards reroll the entire remaining pool as long as its damage output is below average.

If you bring more than one reroll ability it is a nice first reroll try as well, since you dont have to sacrifice other dice (leading shots) or tokens (Vader, TRC).

I will give them a try on ships that reliably have to deal damage to play their part.

I'm confused here...according to this post: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/181567-do-you-have-questions-about-attacking-defense-tokens-and-critical-hits-read-this-first/, in Step 3, you modify the dice BEFORE declaring accuracy results. So wouldn't Veteran Gunners happen before declaring accuracy results?

Yeah, that post is inaccurate in that Modify Dice and Spend Accuracies happen concurrently, and thus you choose the order.

Veteran Gunners makes you reroll all dice. Maybe I am missing something, but the card looks miserable. I get that with SW7s, your blues are always useful. So rerolling them is probably no loss unless your reroll removes your needed acuracies.

Leading shots seems significantly better for the large Mon Cal ships.

Maybe over lunch i can go mathwars on it and see what works better.

Mind that you are allowed to spend any accuracy results to block defense tokens before rerolling all remaining dice in the attack pool.

Its not a great card at first sight, but it gives some failsafe ability to those underwhelming roles everybody has experienced already. Spend the 1-2 accuracies you need, afterwards reroll the entire remaining pool as long as its damage output is below average.

If you bring more than one reroll ability it is a nice first reroll try as well, since you dont have to sacrifice other dice (leading shots) or tokens (Vader, TRC).

I will give them a try on ships that reliably have to deal damage to play their part.

I'm confused here...according to this post: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/181567-do-you-have-questions-about-attacking-defense-tokens-and-critical-hits-read-this-first/, in Step 3, you modify the dice BEFORE declaring accuracy results. So wouldn't Veteran Gunners happen before declaring accuracy results?

Yeah, that post is inaccurate in that Modify Dice and Spend Accuracies happen concurrently, and thus you choose the order.

Is there somewhere I can find a reference to that or is Page 2, Step 3, under Attack in the rules reference guide that is used for this?

Don't have the RRG in front of me, but read RRG 4 - Attack. Pretty sure it's page 4, at least. I'm sure Dras will correct me if it's not.

Correction, it's page 2:

Resolve Attack Effects: The attacker can resolve attack

effects as described below:

◊ Modify Dice: The attacker can resolve any of its

effects that modify its dice. This includes card effects

and the P command.

◊ Spend Accuracy (G) Icons: The attacker can spend

one or more of its G icons to choose the same

number of the defender’s defense tokens. The chosen

tokens cannot be spent during this attack.

I also found this post: https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/221332-breaking-news-veteran-gunners-retire-darth-vader/page-2?hl=resolve+attacks#entry2241898 that explains everything pretty well too. Thanks for the replies guys! I am always learning something new about this game...it's maddening!!!

Ard found it before I could correct him


Yes, in that "collected rules" post, it is inaccurately described as a "Step One, Step Two" Process, when really, it is two bullet points under the same heading with no inherent timing specified other than "You can do these at this time!"...

So they are concurrent.

Ard found it before I could correct him

Yes, in that "collected rules" post, it is inaccurately described as a "Step One, Step Two" Process, when really, it is two bullet points under the same heading with no inherent timing specified other than "You can do these at this time!"...

So they are concurrent.

Edit*

Nevermind, I misunderstood spend and how this specifically applies to VG's.

Ard found it before I could correct him

Yes, in that "collected rules" post, it is inaccurately described as a "Step One, Step Two" Process, when really, it is two bullet points under the same heading with no inherent timing specified other than "You can do these at this time!"...

So they are concurrent.

Does this mean that this whole time, you've been able to leading shots/Vader to try to get 3-4 accuracies out of your ISDII blues? Who needs xi7's when you can just lock down every token!

Does this also mean that TRC'ing an accuracy doesn't cost you anything in terms of token locking?

Using an accuracy removes it from the dice pool.

So no

Well In my last game my opposition would have loved having some VGs. 3 times he rolled 4 blank red dice out of 4 (he even swapped out dice from the box for his next roll no help) and another attack from his Mc30 rolled from 1/8" away all blank and 3 acc. He said "well at least they are not all blank this time) Those 4 failed attack rolls gave me the game.

I like leading shot because in gives and element of certainty. Little like OE for Blue dice.

Ard found it before I could correct him

Yes, in that "collected rules" post, it is inaccurately described as a "Step One, Step Two" Process, when really, it is two bullet points under the same heading with no inherent timing specified other than "You can do these at this time!"...

So they are concurrent.

Does this mean that this whole time, you've been able to leading shots/Vader to try to get 3-4 accuracies out of your ISDII blues? Who needs xi7's when you can just lock down every token!

Does this also mean that TRC'ing an accuracy doesn't cost you anything in terms of token locking?

Using an accuracy removes it from the dice pool.

So no

But you cannot repeat the steps I assume... roll 1 acc and blanks, spend the accuracy, reroll the rest of the dice, then spend newly rolled accuracies?

Yep. Sure can.

I did explain it in detail in another thread, but I can't find which one now....

Basically, it can work like this:

You have QLTs and Vet Gunners:


Roll Dice. (Blue and Reds)

Get Natural Blue Acc. Spend to Lock down token.

Use Vet Gunners to Reroll. everything....

Get Red Acc. Get additional red ACC from QLTs....

Spend one Red Acc to lock down second Token.

Reroll 3rd Acc with Con Fire Token.

If that's an Acc too, you can even then spend that one to lock down a Third.....

except Vet gunners would not reroll the spent blue acc.. makes sense.

Veteran Gunners makes you reroll all dice. Maybe I am missing something, but the card looks miserable. I get that with SW7s, your blues are always useful. So rerolling them is probably no loss unless your reroll removes your needed acuracies.

Leading shots seems significantly better for the large Mon Cal ships.

Maybe over lunch i can go mathwars on it and see what works better.

Mind that you are allowed to spend any accuracy results to block defense tokens before rerolling all remaining dice in the attack pool.

Its not a great card at first sight, but it gives some failsafe ability to those underwhelming roles everybody has experienced already. Spend the 1-2 accuracies you need, afterwards reroll the entire remaining pool as long as its damage output is below average.

If you bring more than one reroll ability it is a nice first reroll try as well, since you dont have to sacrifice other dice (leading shots) or tokens (Vader, TRC).

I will give them a try on ships that reliably have to deal damage to play their part.

Umm i dont think so, from the rules ref guide, spend acc is after all your modify stuff. so cheaters be cheaters

Roll Attack Dice: Gather attack dice to form the attack pool and roll those dice. Gather only the dice that are appropriate for the range of the attack as indicated by the icons on the range ruler.

◊ If the defender is a ship, gather the attack dice indicated in the attacking hull zone’s or squadron’s battery armament.

◊ If the defender is a squadron, gather the attack dice indicated in the attacker’s anti-squadron armament.

◊ If the attacker cannot gather any dice appropriate for the range of the attack, the attack is canceled.

3. Resolve Attack Effects: The attacker can resolve attack effects as described below:

◊ Modify Dice: The attacker can resolve any of its effects that modify its dice. This includes card effects and the P command.

◊ Spend Accuracy (G) Icons: The attacker can spend one or more of its G icons to choose the same

Veteran Gunners makes you reroll all dice. Maybe I am missing something, but the card looks miserable. I get that with SW7s, your blues are always useful. So rerolling them is probably no loss unless your reroll removes your needed acuracies.

Leading shots seems significantly better for the large Mon Cal ships.

Maybe over lunch i can go mathwars on it and see what works better.

Mind that you are allowed to spend any accuracy results to block defense tokens before rerolling all remaining dice in the attack pool.

Its not a great card at first sight, but it gives some failsafe ability to those underwhelming roles everybody has experienced already. Spend the 1-2 accuracies you need, afterwards reroll the entire remaining pool as long as its damage output is below average.

If you bring more than one reroll ability it is a nice first reroll try as well, since you dont have to sacrifice other dice (leading shots) or tokens (Vader, TRC).

I will give them a try on ships that reliably have to deal damage to play their part.

Umm i dont think so, from the rules ref guide, spend acc is after all your modify stuff. so cheaters be cheaters

Roll Attack Dice: Gather attack dice to form the attack pool and roll those dice. Gather only the dice that are appropriate for the range of the attack as indicated by the icons on the range ruler.

◊ If the defender is a ship, gather the attack dice indicated in the attacking hull zone’s or squadron’s battery armament.

◊ If the defender is a squadron, gather the attack dice indicated in the attacker’s anti-squadron armament.

◊ If the attacker cannot gather any dice appropriate for the range of the attack, the attack is canceled.

3. Resolve Attack Effects: The attacker can resolve attack effects as described below:

◊ Modify Dice: The attacker can resolve any of its effects that modify its dice. This includes card effects and the P command.

◊ Spend Accuracy (G) Icons: The attacker can spend one or more of its G icons to choose the same

Yes, but notice that Resolve Dice and Modify dice are not numbered. They occur in any order. So you can spend accuracy icons before modifying (rerolling) the dice.

That said, you may not be able to spend extras that appear with the reroll. interesting.

When you spend a dice you remove it from the pool, so you can do it any order

Spend: When a die or die icon is spent, remove that die from the attack pool. rules ref guide page 7

I dont understand why people hate sensor teams...

Or maybe its my limited list selection that actually makes the card good.

I think it sucks because you have to spend a die AND exhaust the card for five points of cherry picking an accuracy. So it's only good for one attack, and you are limiting your die pool. Large ships have no problems rolling accuracies (6+ attack dice) so it is useless for them, and smaller attack pools don't want to discard dice for nothing. So far, the only ships that really want to use them are black dice ships that would rather have Ordnance Experts or the AFmkII that usually likes Gunnery Team or Flight Controllers.

I dont understand why people hate sensor teams...

Or maybe its my limited list selection that actually makes the card good.

Patience my friend. They will see the error of their ways

I think it sucks because you have to spend a die AND exhaust the card for five points of cherry picking an accuracy. So it's only good for one attack, and you are limiting your die pool. Large ships have no problems rolling accuracies (6+ attack dice) so it is useless for them, and smaller attack pools don't want to discard dice for nothing. So far, the only ships that really want to use them are black dice ships that would rather have Ordnance Experts or the AFmkII that usually likes Gunnery Team or Flight Controllers.

This. They're not bad, it's just that there's no application for them right now that's not done better with a different build. With the possible exception of Gink's Ackbar EA torpedo frigates, which I still think work better with any number of alternate builds.

It would take a large number of red dice that somehow didn't want GT but did have the weapons team slot to make ST worth taking.

Playing against gink ackbar torps, and I gotta say, don't like going up against sensor teams with flotillas one bit... no sireee