Hi all,

As a relatively new player I was recently thrashed in a local tournament, besides flying my MC80 off the board by a few mm my other ships were pretty much melted by Ackbar and TRC's. In my Rebel fleet I deliberately chose not to use Ackbar but everyone else did!

I'd like to run an Imperial list in the next tournament and can already see the Rebel line coming down the side of the play area with TRC MC30's sptting red dice at me. I'm thinking that an Imperial class, Vic and Demolisher would be the core of my fleet and to disrupt the conga line I'd use tractor beams on the leading ships.

In your experiences would this work, could I keep the MC30s in my front arc and from passing behind me and melting everything?

Cheers.

Jon

Have you read this?

https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/184142-gladiator-boxing-tactics-from-gencon/

Have you read this?

https://community.fantasyflightgames.com/topic/184142-gladiator-boxing-tactics-from-gencon/

That's certainly a good read, however I feel it's very much wave 1 specific and doesn't account for Ackbar, whose sheer number of red dice are enough to blow up the flanking GSD in the example.

Wave 2 tactics as imps generally include the use of a small. sacrifice ships (generally a raider because of its cheap cost and awesome navigation chart) and parking said ship in the front arc of the first ship of the conga.

This is usually enough, if pulled well, to disrupt the toilet bowling and cause some havoc, in the form of multiple collisions and need to rethink the flying paths, to open up a window of opportunity for you to jump to their throat.

The general strategy to fighting Ackbar in any of the broadside ships is to get into his front or rear arc without going into his side arc. Most of Ackbar ships don't have a significant amount of damage in their front arc, so this will help you avoid most or any damage, aside from possibly ramming. And since ships of any size can ram, you can sacrifice a small low-powered ship to pin your target in place from the front while another ship goes in from the side or rear after your target moves.

Ships that can accelerate to speed 4 quickly can potentially get from outside of long range to inside close range on a single turn, letting them perform a hit and run maneuver if they go first the next turn. This is a favored tactic of Demolisher in particular, but also works with other small fast ships like Raiders and MC30s.

Put raiders in rebels front arcs, this works as a speed bump that jumbles the whole line while usually keeping the raider alive or at least delivering a payload into the lead ship while flat footed. A high speed ISD can cut a conga line pretty well from the front or the back(if you use the raider speed bump). And I've personally dropped an entire 3 ship conga with one demsu and a few firesprays. By the way I guess this all only works if you play Empire.

If you're new, I really recommend the single ISD, with cheap Demo or Raiders with Expanded Launchers for activations.

That or play a really squadron heavy list. Those deal with Ackbar VERY WELL!!!

If you want to go pound for pound, punch for punch with them, I suggest this wave2 legal list:

General: 7/10. Gives you 4 ships, and 6 deployments, with a 22 bid for 1st, although, being 2nd with this list against anything other than 5ship Demolisher is really fine!

AA capacity: 9/10. Very good. ISD and 2 raiders with Ord give you serious AA. Instigator really shouldn't bother attacking ships, go for cutting down his AA. Instigator title is REALLY GOOD. 4 fighters to simply tie them up.

Firepower: 8/10. Ram the ISD up his throat. Screed the crap outta all 4 of your ships. Demolisher!! With Engine Techs.

Defense: 6/10. Warning. You must learn how to go from being at not-in-range, to way-too-close range. Otherwise, your ships will melt to sustained long range fire.

[if 2nd, you must make good use of your objectives! Learn to create a Minefield. Hyperspace ONLY demolisher. Most Wanted is most likely to be played, pick your Raider, pick their most forward ship.]

(You can learn to outplay 5ship Demolisher, just takes some practice, but that's probably not the easiest match for this list.)

... Yknow, hell. This is a good list. I might try this for a bit until wave3 lands.

That or play a really squadron heavy list. Those deal with Ackbar VERY WELL!!!

that's how I do it

Thanks all,

I really dislike ramming and think it's very gamey, but hey if it works!

I hadn't though of Ordnance Experts on an AA ship so thanks for that, Instigator was on my list (with a single Raider) but then I'd be losing the Vic II to fit in with my current collection, as my wife might kill me if I buy any more models.

Cheers.

Jon

this is what I would take

Empire Fleet (373 of 400 pts)
Commander: Admiral Screed (26 pts)
Flagship: (141 pts)

• Imperial II-class Star Destroyer(120 pts)
• Avenger (5 pts)
• Gunnery Team (7 pts)
• Boosted Comms (4 pts)
• SW-7 Ion Batteries (5 pts)
  

Fleet Ship 1: (100 pts)

• Victory II-class Star Destroyer(85 pts)
• Gunnery Team (7 pts)
• Overload Pulse (8 pts)
  

Squadrons (132 of 134 pts):

• 1x Punishing One - Dengar (20 pts)
• 2x Tie Advanced Squadron (24 pts)
• 4x Firespray-31 (72 pts)
• 1x Major Rhymer Tie Bomber Squadron (16 pts)
  

Objectives: Precision Strike , Contested Outpost , Minefields

the ISD does nothing but Squadron commands but keep the fighters close neve beyond long range and use the VSD to soften up the targets with overload pulse and screed so Avenger can take them out if the bombers have not. Denger and the 2 advanced ties should be enough to tie up there fighters

Here is a great article written by Angry Space Triangles on how to beat Ackbar.

https://crudereviews.net/2016/03/12/angry-space-triangles-how-to-kill-ackbar/

@Jonny

I'm gonna use a Street Fighter analogy...

In terms of Admirals (there are power levels but must be viewed from a learning curve perspective).

For example, Ackbar is like Chun Li (a solid character)... when you are starting out, her Lightning Kicks can just splash damage you even if you are blocking. The learning curve to spam Lightning Kick will is low. As you play stronger competition, Chun Li is usually beaten by Ryu (the Dragon Punch).

In my opinion, Ackbar is bad for the game (I can't remember my post about this) because you can easily get tabled if you get caught (it's actually pretty easy to get caught so don't feel bad if you are getting caught) in it.

The advice above is valid but moving ships in to block is not exactly easy.

The easiest way to counter Ackbar Gunline is with a RhymerBall (e.g., anything that makes them come to you and not turtle)

Since you're new, the cheapest way...

2x Packs of Imperial Fighters

1x Rogue & Villains

ISD

Raider

Demolisher (Gladiator)

That should give you enough to have FUN with!

Some good advice in here already, but if you want some generalities that don't necessarily depend on specific fleet builds, here is my experience from consistently beating Ackbar fleets (spoiler: I don't think Ackbar is a very good commander AT ALL)

1. Obstacles: One of the supremely crappy thing about conga lines if that they telegraph in big bold letters to your opponent what it is you want to do (e.g. hug the edge) and barring a couple of objectives, you can have a say on where obstacles go! MC80's are kinda slow pigs so you can practically put on a blindfold and put obstacles in places they will want to go to force them to go places they don't want to go OR eat some obstacle damage.

2. Objectives: Build a fleet that likes to go second and choose objectives that your Ackbar meta won't like. I found that they end up choosing Mine Fields and this objective (while boring and potentially a 2 edged sword to the unexperienced) lets you Maximize #1 to an extreme degree. You can manage to make congaing along one edge of the board virtually suicide guaranteeing either a head on engagement (which imperials love) OR you will know exactly which way the conga will go and can block it so much easier

3. Deployment: Understanding how to deploy your fleet to meet a particular threat is huge. Start thinking/practicing placing obstacles and how to deploy based on said obstacles (there are some great Articles by BiggsIRL on obstacle theory that really helped me out when I was starting, if you never gave it any thought obstacle placement feels random and almost pointless but getting good at it can be a difference maker)

4. Bombers or even just fighters: I know this was already mentioned but it bears repeating. It almost doesn't matter what you bring but a mix of things from imperials or just a bunch of X and/or A wings for rebels can absolutely punish a conga. One of the other crappy things about ackbar is that he is a very expensive Admiral and therefore people who run him start understanding that the only way to get value for his points is to Min/Max (maximize broadside dice, minimize squadrons) meaning a typical conga list doesn't have much of an answer for a decent squadron force (maybe a token 50 points or less which can be quickly overwhelmed and those are points in your pocket).

5. Fast Blocker: Again already mentioned. Nice thing for imps is that one of our biggest ships is also pretty fast at speed 3. if you utilize obstacle/objectives and do well in deployment you can sometimes manage to front-block a conga with an ISD, demolisher or even generic glad with ETs is even easier. There is nothing sweeter than watching a conga pusher sweat as his expensive broadside ships dink 3 dice off an ISD or Gladiator while you unload devastating arcs.

As for list building, lately I have been enjoying a variation on PTs 2 ISDI/3 raider list. I have gone 3/3 with it so far, it requires some mastery of manouver and deployment but so far it has eaten 2 heavy imperial squadron lists and a Mothma mixed fleet. It is a fast moving list that can set up double-threat situations all over the board, but I would say it isn't for beginners.

I generally agree with the MCWORRELL points to, tho with a few what I think are important additions.

1) You can use the board to help the "cork and bottle" approach. That's what I call this method to defeat Ackbar. With obstacle placement you can introduce subtle motivation that ackbar fly his conga line in a certain way. A little asteroid here, some debris there and that conga gets pretty predictable.

2) The article calls it the Hook, I call it the cork and for me, that's an ISD. At speed 3, it's the perfect vehicle for getting in front of the train and blowing things to crap.

3) I want my ET or speed 4 stuff to go chasing after Ackbar's muffler. Generally if you can get the conga line to have to turn and run up the side of the board that means your ships going after the rear have to do a more sweeping arc as I generally aim for the last ship in the line. The article says charge into their flank. To me that is stupid and you don't need to do that. If the rebels break the line and execute a fleet turn to the center of the board, awesome, they are then presenting their forward arc for you.

4) Squadrons, If you're squadron heavy, you're probably going to win the squadron game fast, then it comes down to where to help your ships out most with your squadrons. Either you work back to front or front to back. Front to back works better if not having squadron commands is an issue.

The problem with Ackbar is the ships you want him for (i.e. AFmkII) are undergunned even when you're in the broadside if you're at close range relative to other ships if you can assassinate the admiral himself.

Couple this with how easy it is to cause a traffic jam/predict where everyone's going to go and a lot of times even the activation order, and you're asking for a face-full of fighters/black dice on the flagfish.

The problem with Ackbar is the ships you want him for (i.e. AFmkII) are undergunned even when you're in the broadside if you're at close range relative to other ships if you can assassinate the admiral himself.

Couple this with how easy it is to cause a traffic jam/predict where everyone's going to go and a lot of times even the activation order, and you're asking for a face-full of fighters/black dice on the flagfish.

Exactly, and for all the reasons above, ackbar has been steadily disappearing from most metas as players realize the predictability in this game is potentially suicide. Rebels these days I find are either running Mothma, Reeikan, and more rarely but also most nasty in the wrong hands Dodonna

I still get mileage out of Ackbar and driving right through the enemy to get the Ackbar Slashes...

"You're Crazy..."

"YEAH?! WHAT MADE YOU THINK I WAS SANE?!"

Double ISD + Rhymer made me stop using Ackbar. Got blocked. Bumped My self. Got bombed. Got out Mottied.

Soo many dont understand the true Ackbar its upsetting. Conga line is level 1 Ackbar, but there is oh so much more for him to give.

The misuse problem I see with most people using Ackbar, is there are better ways to fight broadside ships then putting them in a line nose to tail. Read some books on WWI to WWII navy combat tactics. (nose to tail line went out when they invented the gun turret)

V (fast ship)

V v (Fast ships)

V (Slow ship)

Target

ships

here.

if the target ships get to close the fast ships turn out at speed and fly around them forming a kill pocket

As for beating him. Kill him first your whole fleet targets his ship first and only his ship. Then its all about cleaning up the rest of the less dangerous fleet. if the Ackbar player uses the line cut it off and attack his front .

VvV

^

^

^

Mothma and double MC30 plus titles and tons of upgrades is it rigtht now. Demolisher is dead with these on the board.

The conga line is vulnerable, but as others have said, Ackbar doesn't have to use it.

Also, the OP talked about TRC MC30s, but most early responders talked about stopping MC80s and AF2s.

Sticking a raider in front of a TRC MC30 ain't stopping nothin'.

No, but by being in front of it, you are literally halving its available firepower to use against you.... Stick in Front, or Behind. Its still good for you.

The conga line is vulnerable, but as others have said, Ackbar doesn't have to use it.

Also, the OP talked about TRC MC30s, but most early responders talked about stopping MC80s and AF2s.

Sticking a raider in front of a TRC MC30 ain't stopping nothin'.

Good catch! I derped !

I played around with TRC30's + Ackbar, and here's what I personally had problems with: perhaps the OP could exploit those.

-Lots o points on 4 hull. You're going to be outgunned or outlasted at long range, even with Ackbar/TRC for the points you're sinking.

-Extreme vulnerability to fighters.

-Extreme difficulty in focus firing- there's only so many black range places to go for a single ship! If I attempt to kite, I've overpaid for my TRC platform and am probably severely undergunned overall- how many of these can he put on the table? What does that leave?

-I'm probably not going to get more than 1 or 2 good broadsides per game per ship, or I'm really awesome, or my opponent is really not-awesome at keeping those opportunities away from me.

It seems the OP wants to use Imps- if a massive rhymer ball does not seem appealing to you, you could try running an APT Clonisher (demolisher glad I, ordnance experts, APT, intel officer, engine techs) to assassinate Ackbar's flagship.

Guys your are paying 38 points to, in most cases just moves your fronts reds with your side shot. Not that big of a deal. Double arcing to do the same thing is actually more dangerous.