I'm rooting for the Devastator fleet. Without Riekaan keeping everything alive, is the most dangerous ship in the game after Demolisher in its ability to remove targets from the board.

Congrats to the winners!

Having said that I wish I would of gone with one of the several Imperial lists I mocked up. I am disappointed that we only have Tie fighters for the 2 imperial fleets as I thought an Interdictor Rhymerball fleet would have been very interesting. I'm rooting for the Devestator Fleet but I think the Rebel heavy squadron fleet will do well. The VSD's are interesting but I still think they will go down to an MC80 shooting at medium or long range. Making the MC80 go slower only plays into the Rebels hand shooting at longer ranges.

Also I am disappointed no commander chose a fleet with slicer tools. I was positive they would want to demonstrate its usefulness disrupting the enemies plans.

I'm not one for Rhymerballs in general, and getting the Interdictor is very expensive points wise, you are basically left with just TIEs if you want to maintain that many activations/deployments. If you must need to win the air war, going to a Howl/Soontir/Advanced/Int ball lets you punch up nicely for not much cost, and then any TIE's left over are just a bonus, but you also have to sacrifice one Gozanti to do that.

Also I can't even keep one Raider alive, so you'd have to look at someone else to brave slicer tools.

Does this mean you're the author of the finalist fleet with the Interdictor and Victories? If so, congratulations! Great list.

Yeah that is me. Thank you! I'm used to running 2 VSD's with an ISD, so that sort of list is right in my wheelhouse anyway, and I was kind of floored they made Konstantine. That ability for that cost... I like Motti for making VSD's rocks, but slowing or accelerating everything in range regardless of size looks absolutely bonkers.

Konstantine looks like a ton of fun. I have been saying he will probably make me temporarily defect. Changing speed is super strong.

I am also excited for what Madine can do eith MC30s. Wish Madine was a skosh cheaper, though.

Konstantine looks like a ton of fun. I have been saying he will probably make me temporarily defect. Changing speed is super strong.

I am also excited for what Madine can do eith MC30s. Wish Madine was a skosh cheaper, though.

I'll be honest I just play Imperials because I have no idea with how to begin with Rebel lists, and their admirals are not exactly what I want. Madine in particular seems overcosted for just being navigation team for all ships, if he didn't make you take a command he'd be much better and fairly costed.

Well, that and its Navigation Teams for everyone, support slot or not, so that has a bit of an opportunity cost to it, I guess... And the extra-extra if you do use the full dial...

Well, that and its Navigation Teams for everyone, support slot or not, so that has a bit of an opportunity cost to it, I guess... And the extra-extra if you do use the full dial...

I just compare it to Ozzel. Maybe I am not rating the utility high enough? Ozzel has that situational ability but he's also costed appropriately for it.

Yeah that is me. Thank you! I'm used to running 2 VSD's with an ISD, so that sort of list is right in my wheelhouse anyway, and I was kind of floored they made Konstantine. That ability for that cost... I like Motti for making VSD's rocks, but slowing or accelerating everything in range regardless of size looks absolutely bonkers.

First of all - congratulations. I should say that I like your list a lot and fell that its pretty balanced and thought out. My only question is - what is your plan for fighting large ships trying to outflank you?

Yeah that is me. Thank you! I'm used to running 2 VSD's with an ISD, so that sort of list is right in my wheelhouse anyway, and I was kind of floored they made Konstantine. That ability for that cost... I like Motti for making VSD's rocks, but slowing or accelerating everything in range regardless of size looks absolutely bonkers.

First of all - congratulations. I should say that I like your list a lot and fell that its pretty balanced and thought out. My only question is - what is your plan for fighting large ships trying to outflank you?

Konstantine and G-8 still slow one ship to either 1 or 0. You can keep up with one and better it down, while messing with the other, forcing it to stay at 1-2, rather than 3 and keep using Maneuvers or being stuck at 1 if they want any other commands. As well the VSD's are free to simply navigate on their own, as they don't need to squadron duty, and the Interdictor is the key element and what I expect to be targeted, given all the key upgrades are on it. With just one large ship it shouldn't be a problem to at least hold in firing range, using a VSD to block and ram if needed.

I'm not entirely sure to fight a 3 ISD list or anything, though in that situation you probably want to speed two up and focus on the other. That's where Konstantine's speed boosting effect is incredible.

Konstantine and G-8 still slow one ship to either 1 or 0. You can keep up with one and better it down, while messing with the other, forcing it to stay at 1-2, rather than 3 and keep using Maneuvers or being stuck at 1 if they want any other commands. As well the VSD's are free to simply navigate on their own, as they don't need to squadron duty, and the Interdictor is the key element and what I expect to be targeted, given all the key upgrades are on it. With just one large ship it shouldn't be a problem to at least hold in firing range, using a VSD to block and ram if needed.

I'm not entirely sure to fight a 3 ISD list or anything, though in that situation you probably want to speed two up and focus on the other. That's where Konstantine's speed boosting effect is incredible.

Well, that and its Navigation Teams for everyone, support slot or not, so that has a bit of an opportunity cost to it, I guess... And the extra-extra if you do use the full dial...

I just compare it to Ozzel. Maybe I am not rating the utility high enough? Ozzel has that situational ability but he's also costed appropriately for it.

They're not really comparable... I mean, they're the closest thing we have, but that still feels like, rather than Comparing Apples to Oranges, we're comparing Peaches to Apricots....

Mostly because Changing Speed is different than Clicks of Navigation...

I don't know, I could well be wrong... Ozzel allows you to get an additional one click. Wether you are already gaining 1 or 2 as a speed change, its just the additional one... Madine does potentially let you jump an additional 2... ::shrug::

Its semantics I guess.

I am really excited to put Madine on the table and see what he can do. I suspect he's going to be a lot of fun.

And as for my MC30 build, I figured I'd say that I put quite a bit of thought into it, and the "combo" isn't really the point of it. XX-9s mean you can make use of blue crits, and I can't tell you how many times that, even fishing hard, that black crit sometimes just doesn't happen. XX-9s are more about bypassing Interdictor contains than comboing in case there's a blue crit but no black one. I put FCT on there because hey, for 2 points, if I do get the right rolls, it's even worse. I envisioned the MC30 to let the MC80 strip some shields and then have the 30 come in after some shields were already stripped. Mon Karren only allowing one defense token means that the brace will more than likely be used on that ship's attack, and ACMs were chosen cause they mitigate redirects, which will be the token most used by ships attacked by the MC30. I find a lot of time when examining builds sometimes we fall into the trap of thinking of ships as existing in a vacuum, without other ships contributing. My build might not be worth it, but I think exploring it is fun and worthwhile.

Not to be that guy, but as predicted it looks more like a showcase kind of fleet to point out how awesome all that new stuff is. Except for Adams list (which I consider having the upper hand, out of the three) they all only use token squadrons to display capitals a lot bigger than they are in current meta - 6/4 TIE fighters respectively on imperial side is a bit underwhelming considering that Imps will likely remain being able to deploy the strongest bomber force in wave 3+4. Eimis list still has some nice synergy to work with and is the appealing imperial list of the two, but I seriously fail to understand how any FFG guy could have taken a look at the Lockwood list and considered playing it .

I just hope FFG will release some mildly believable gameplay report later on, and not some "look how this new shiny wave xy toy single-handedly slaughtered everything on the table!!111" White Dwarf-style BS. Well, I should know better probably.

First things congrats to the winners.

Not to be that guy, but as predicted it looks more like a showcase kind of fleet to point out how awesome all that new stuff is. Except for Adams list (which I consider having the upper hand, out of the three) they all only use token squadrons to display capitals a lot bigger than they are in current meta - 6/4 TIE fighters respectively on imperial side is a bit underwhelming considering that Imps will likely remain being able to deploy the strongest bomber force in wave 3+4. Eimis list still has some nice synergy to work with and is the appealing imperial list of the two, but I seriously fail to understand how any FFG guy could have taken a look at the Lockwood list and considered playing it .

I just hope FFG will release some mildly believable gameplay report later on, and not some "look how this new shiny wave xy toy single-handedly slaughtered everything on the table!!111" White Dwarf-style BS. Well, I should know better probably.

I am right there with you, I do not know if it is just that my area meta is so different, but talking with my group we do not think any of the lists that won are playable lists.

I think there's a big difference between a list being perceived as "not playable" and it actually being so. 400pts worth of GR75 transports would be not playable. The winning lists just involve different thinking from different people (the writers of the lists and then those at FFG choosing).

I'm not fan of the ISD list and the fighter heavy Reb one, but i can see their logic. it's down to player preference and ability if they work or not. People talking of "stabilising/ stabilised metas" sounds a lot like group-think and dull list making.

That said, i'm really hoping it isn't a white dwarf style whitewash battle report.... i wanna see Libs and Interdictors burning!

I think there's a big difference between a list being perceived as "not playable" and it actually being so. 400pts worth of GR75 transports would be not playable. The winning lists just involve different thinking from different people (the writers of the lists and then those at FFG choosing).

I'm not fan of the ISD list and the fighter heavy Reb one, but i can see their logic. it's down to player preference and ability if they work or not. People talking of "stabilising/ stabilised metas" sounds a lot like group-think and dull list making.

That said, i'm really hoping it isn't a white dwarf style whitewash battle report.... i wanna see Libs and Interdictors burning!

I'm reminded of an ancient proverb: Nothing is ever perfect and original at the same time.

One of the best ways to learn and grow is simply to keep trying new cards/ships/ideas and see what works. You may lose, but you'll learn a lot.

I think there's a big difference between a list being perceived as "not playable" and it actually being so. 400pts worth of GR75 transports would be not playable. The winning lists just involve different thinking from different people (the writers of the lists and then those at FFG choosing).

I'm not fan of the ISD list and the fighter heavy Reb one, but i can see their logic. it's down to player preference and ability if they work or not. People talking of "stabilising/ stabilised metas" sounds a lot like group-think and dull list making.

That said, i'm really hoping it isn't a white dwarf style whitewash battle report.... i wanna see Libs and Interdictors burning!

I agree that just because it is not playable to one, does not make it the same for someone else. I may be able to see some value in a fleet, but still think that it is unplayable due to my play style. That is more what I was saying, here I am really looking forward to wave five, as three and four are a major yawn to me. The Interdictor had promise but it is just way to expensive for what limited use I think I would get out of it. If I played rebels the Liberty looks like a great ship, but the only Rebels ships I have are the Neb-B and Corvette. The flotilla to me are an answer looking for a problem, they do not add much to the fleet firepower, and I have never had issues running my squadrons. So I am not saying that others views are different, based on some of the reading they are very different.

I just managed a fleet wipe with Devastator, and the build they have is certainly viable though probably not optimal. I would not have chosen Darth Vader to command it, as his ability makes Devastator actually harder to run especially with Needa removing any duplicate tokens. Vader also isn't improving the dice rolls substantially on any other ship there except for possibly the Interdictor.

As for Flotillas being an answer to a problem, I think they are and I think that problem is different for each faction On the Rebel side, Rebels didn't have good ways to disrupt or block incoming fast brawlers like the Gladiator and fast ISDs except to have Riekaan keep the ship alive long enough to hit back anyway. On the Imperial side, Flotillas are finally letting us use the cheap generic squadrons as the swarms they were intended to be and also giving us more options for filling in ship activations without being forced to skip the heavy hitters like ISDs and Interdictors.

Imperials could activate swarms just fine. Watch an ISD/VSD/VSD list activate 13 TIE fighters in one turn. Now, they had nothing but the swarm really going on, but it was impressive.

Imperials could activate swarms just fine. Watch an ISD/VSD/VSD list activate 13 TIE fighters in one turn. Now, they had nothing but the swarm really going on, but it was impressive.

note they could, but you're devoting commands from some very expensive ships that could benefit from other commands (especially nav, poor VSDs)

with the gonzati, you're getting more Squadron per points than any other ship

note, gonzati won't invalidate squadron commands on other ships, because stuff like the ISD can do an incredible amount of damage during its activation with a squadron command (4+ squadrons and its batteries before the enemy activates) but for ordering around a whole swarm of mooks, I think it'll ultimately be more efficient

Wait. . . Their are lists that are not playable? I don't believe that for one second.

Armada is a game of experience. Every list is playable. If you say it is not then you are closing off an avenue of thought and that can hurt you a lot.

Test, play, hypothesize, repeat. That is what makes this game great in my opinion. Everything works, it's on you to learn the lessons of those things. As for the token squadrons, I am sad that the Howlrunner list did not have Dengar in it. Anti-squadron of 4 blue and counter 2 on tie Fighters can be dangerous!

Wait. . . Their are lists that are not playable? I don't believe that for one second.

Armada is a game of experience. Every list is playable. If you say it is not then you are closing off an avenue of thought and that can hurt you a lot.

Test, play, hypothesize, repeat. That is what makes this game great in my opinion. Everything works, it's on you to learn the lessons of those things. As for the token squadrons, I am sad that the Howlrunner list did not have Dengar in it. Anti-squadron of 4 blue and counter 2 on tie Fighters can be dangerous!

Might have to do with my hangover today, but this overly enthusiastic "hey embrace everything" kumbaya attitude is killing me I also sense a latent reproach that everybody disagreeing with you is regarded as less adventurous ..

I am pretty darn sure the guy did not mean that a list is physically unplayable. Hell, like one poster said, show up with an utter GR-75 fleet and well, it will be playable of cause. Your chance of winning will just be a tad slim, to say the least.

Wait. . . Their are lists that are not playable? I don't believe that for one second.

Armada is a game of experience. Every list is playable. If you say it is not then you are closing off an avenue of thought and that can hurt you a lot.

Test, play, hypothesize, repeat. That is what makes this game great in my opinion. Everything works, it's on you to learn the lessons of those things. As for the token squadrons, I am sad that the Howlrunner list did not have Dengar in it. Anti-squadron of 4 blue and counter 2 on tie Fighters can be dangerous!

Lyraeus, I'm in agreement with you: smart play trumps obvious picks, all else being equal.

Except that these lists won't be played by the people who understand them best, and the meta tends to revolve around lists that are frankly very point-and-click. And they will be played, theoretically, in a tournament. So all things should not be equal under any circumstance.

Wait. . . Their are lists that are not playable? I don't believe that for one second.

Armada is a game of experience. Every list is playable. If you say it is not then you are closing off an avenue of thought and that can hurt you a lot.

Test, play, hypothesize, repeat. That is what makes this game great in my opinion. Everything works, it's on you to learn the lessons of those things. As for the token squadrons, I am sad that the Howlrunner list did not have Dengar in it. Anti-squadron of 4 blue and counter 2 on tie Fighters can be dangerous!

Lyraeus, I'm in agreement with you: smart play trumps obvious picks, all else being equal.

Except that these lists won't be played by the people who understand them best, and the meta tends to revolve around lists that are frankly very point-and-click. And they will be played, theoretically, in a tournament. So all things should not be equal under any circumstance.

I hear you, but we did have 2000 characters to explain how we thought it might play, and I can tell you I think I used almost every character. No one really and truly understands how these lists will play, we only understand our intentions, and hope that they translate to the table top.

I'll be the first to admit that running the Devastator ultra-heavy has...issues. Typically I run it with the Demolisher, so my opponent has two big threats to pick from. I'm as surprised as anyone it was picked.

But, I'll admit I have a fondness in both Armada and X-Wing for what I refer to as "Gallagher lists", forsaking any pretense of efficiency or subtlety for bone-crushing, ship-splitting firepower. I just find it satisfying, and I enjoy the psychological effect of simply erasing opponents ships. It doesn't win as many tournaments as I'd like, but it never fails to bring a smile to my face. Hopefully it does the same for Alex.

In any case, thanks to all for both the compliments and the critiques, and good luck to all the other finalists!

James L.

Congrats to you too man! Good luck in the tournament.