My opponent has the initiative. On one turn a ship moves into my ion projector ship. With the natural roll or Palpatine I successfully ionize the ship.

Next turn the ionized ship is forced to do its white one ion straight maneuver right back into my ion projector ship.

Since he has initiative, he clears his ion token first before getting another one from projectors, correct? Is it just that simultaneous game effects are triggered in order of initiative, and the ion token clear after the forced ion maneuver and the new ion token that projectors gives you happen simultaneously?

I just want to make sure before I start running this with Palp Aces. Has the potential to make someone super angry and I need to make sure I'm correct.

I believe that is the case but I've never been able to get FFG to confirm that clearing Ion tokens counts as an effect of the player that is clearing them.

This is a really good question, scratching my head hard on it, I think the precedence should come from a stressed dauntless making a green move into a bump - Start executing green maneuver, clear stress, bump, trigger dauntless, take action, receive stress....Start executing 1 white, clear ion, bump, trigger Ion proj. But I could be wrong.

This is a really good question, scratching my head hard on it, I think the precedence should come from a stressed dauntless making a green move into a bump - Start executing green maneuver, clear stress, bump, trigger dauntless, take action, receive stress....Start executing 1 white, clear ion, bump, trigger Ion proj. But I could be wrong.

They aren't really the same though. Clearing stress happens as part of the maneuver. Clearing Ion Tokens and Anti-Pursuit Lasers are both after Executing a Maneuver triggers.

Didn't we settle this back in the day with Boinkin' Oicunn?

I believe that is the case but I've never been able to get FFG to confirm that clearing Ion tokens counts as an effect of the player that is clearing them.

It should count as an effect of the ship executing the maneuver. After all it is the active ship, and no other ships are involved when the ion effect happens.

I believe that is the case but I've never been able to get FFG to confirm that clearing Ion tokens counts as an effect of the player that is clearing them.

It should count as an effect of the ship executing the maneuver. After all it is the active ship, and no other ships are involved when the ion effect happens.

Having the bumped ship through the red die for the effect of the modification attached to it does kind of involve the bumped ship though. The instructions on APL and Ion Projector are for the bumped ship, not the bumper.

So we have, Ion Projector

"After an enemy ship executes a maneuver that causes it to overlap your ship, roll 1 attack die. On a HIT or CRITICAL HIT result, the enemy ship receives 1 ion token."

And Ion Tokens (p13)

"Activation Phase: The owner moves the ship as if it were assigned a white [ 1] maneuver. After executing this maneuver, remove all ion tokens from the ship. It may perform actions as normal."

And initiative (p12)

"If both players have effects that resolve at the same time, the player with initiative resolves all of his effects first."

It sounds like if the bumpER has initiative, then they would clear the ion tokens, then the ion projector could add a token.

But if the bumpED has initiative, the ion projector could add a token but then the bumped ship would clear the new token along with the old.

Which sounds like it you want to be multi block/ioning a ship then you would want to give away initiative.

That's the way I see it too. It's clearly two things happening at the same time, so initiative decides the order. And if you look at the FAQ entry for Conner Nets, it states:

If a ship is ionized, executes its [1-str] maneuver, and overlaps a Conner Net, all ion tokens are discarded at the end of the maneuver (including those received from Conner Net).

Which also sets the precedent that an ionized ship that gets hit an Ion Projector immediately after it's forced move, gets to remove all ion tokens for no ongoing effect.

But the Connor Nets are static objects without initiative.

I got this email a while ago:

In response to your rules question:

Rules Question:
After an ionized ship executes the mandatory white 1 straight maneuver, if it overlapped a ship equipped with an Ion Projector, is the new ion token from the Ion Projector assigned before or after the ion tokens are removed for executing the maneuver?

Ion Projector triggers after a ship executes a maneuver. Ion tokens are removed after an ionized ship performs its mandatory white 1 straight. Since both abilities trigger at the same timing, the player with initiative gets to choose the order in which they are resolved.

Thanks for playing,

Frank Brooks

Associate Creative Content Developer

Fantasy Flight Games

[email protected]

I got this email a while ago:

In response to your rules question:

Rules Question:

After an ionized ship executes the mandatory white 1 straight maneuver, if it overlapped a ship equipped with an Ion Projector, is the new ion token from the Ion Projector assigned before or after the ion tokens are removed for executing the maneuver?

Ion Projector triggers after a ship executes a maneuver. Ion tokens are removed after an ionized ship performs its mandatory white 1 straight. Since both abilities trigger at the same timing, the player with initiative gets to choose the order in which they are resolved.

Thanks for playing,

Frank Brooks

Associate Creative Content Developer

Fantasy Flight Games

[email protected]

That seems like a very strange ruling. The player with initiative doesn't normally get to choose whether or not his effects trigger before or after his opponent's. Their effects are resolved first.

"If both players have effects that resolve at the

WWHSD, I think that this is exactly what Frank Brooks meant, however used other wording..

I got this email a while ago:

In response to your rules question:[/size]

Rules Question:

After an ionized ship executes the mandatory white 1 straight maneuver, if it overlapped a ship equipped with an Ion Projector, is the new ion token from the Ion Projector assigned before or after the ion tokens are removed for executing the maneuver?

Ion Projector triggers after a ship executes a maneuver. Ion tokens are removed after an ionized ship performs its mandatory white 1 straight. Since both abilities trigger at the same timing, the player with initiative gets to choose the order in which they are resolved.

Thanks for playing,

Frank Brooks

Associate Creative Content Developer

Fantasy Flight Games

[email protected]

That seems like a very strange ruling. The player with initiative doesn't normally get to choose whether or not his effects trigger before or after his opponent's. Their effects are resolved first.

RRG, pg. 8:

"If multiple abilities resolve at the same time, the

player with initiative chooses which of his abilities

to resolve and resolves them in the order of his

choosing. Then the opposing player does the

same for his own abilities."

RRG, pg. 12

"If both players have effects that resolve at the

same time, the player with initiative resolves all

of his effects first."

"If both players have effects that resolve at the

same time, the player with initiative resolves all

of his effects first."

Yup - Frank is certainly contradicting a fairly clearly spelled out rule here- and it's not as if this is an FAQ clarification either - it's straight from the rules reference and written unambiguously.

Until the day comes when we bow to our infallible robot overlords, stuff like this is going to happen from time to time.

In short - Frank's wrong - the rules references that WWHSD supplied are right.