I saw shuttles at first but now I don't see any not even the TIE-shuttles?

I hear all about TIE Defenders and they are still being played. Did the TIE-bomber fix fail?

Not at all!

Jonus and Tomax beneifit from the shuttle upgrade, and Tomax is a nice ordnance carrier as well, with a regenerating EPT. (no reason to not take crackshot, wired, etc.).

Deathfire is the Tarn Mission of the box, given time a build will surface that works nicely with him.

The Generic Bomber pilots are worth it on the EPT alone, also the Ps 5.

The TIE shuttle title give the Imps a low-cost, more maneuverable support ship than the Lambda, while also giving Tomax some good options to make him a nasty customer. Right now the Defenders are getting the attention, which is natural given both how good their fixes are and how bad they were before, but we'll see some unique bomber builds come out of this in time.

Bombers are still really squishy.

LRS is pretty much a imperial only mod (only k-wing currently for rebs and only firespray with slave 1 title) and I think can help TIE bombers just as much if not more than chips. Slap on deadeye on gammas and LRS now you can always shoot at something and for things like homing missiles and other ords that doesn't spend the lock/focus you get your re-roll and focus on top of that.

Bombers are squishy but they are reasonably cheap for a ord ship

IMO the "grand meta" hasn't played with bombers enough for them to shine yet so currently they are nitch list out there that use them. Either that or it just isn't their time yet. And for anecdotal thoughts I think bombers 9with homing missiles) are solid counters for x7 defenders. If you have something more threatening than the bombers (Inq, Vader, fel, omega Leader, canor, etc etc), they can usually get their shots off since they become a damned if you do (leaving great late game ships on the board) and damned if you don't (cheap, good ord getting their shots off while everyone else chases the other ships).

I've been running a double bomber/ Tie D defender list with wonderful results.

I've been running a TIE Doomshuttle for several games now and it's worked nicely.

It's makes for a nice ace counter (a crit on Fel is always nice) and can give the opponent something else to think about.

Bombers are still really squishy.

It's more they are crit magnets.

But that gives us a protobiggs if they shoot it before aces.

IMO the "grand meta" hasn't played with bombers enough for them to shine yet so currently they are nitch list out there that use them.

I really agree with this statement. I don't think people have played with Tie Bombers enough. When I brought them up before Imp Vets, people always countered that U-boats were more efficient and would be superior. Not that I agree, but that was the general attitude. Now that U-boats are changed, we could see people trying them out more. I really don't think a lot of people have really tried Tie Bombers much.

Homing Missiles are fantastic for Imp Aces and /X7 title Defenders. It's great for anything without Evade, as well, due to getting the re-roll. Both LRS and Guidance Chips are good on them. People seem to dismiss LRS without really trying them, but I think a mix of both is probably appropriate.

A Gamma Vet w/ Crackshot, LRS, and Extra Munitions costs 27 pts, but has a 98% of doing at least one damage to a tokened up Stealth Soontir Fel. If you are able to use LRS on Soontir and force him out of the fight for even a turn or two due to avoiding firing arc, then he makes up his points as the rest of the list can beat up on the rest of his. In an alpha strike list, sometimes that's all it takes.

Tie Bombers do attract crits a lot, which is why I think Moff Jerrod would be a good addition to any Tie Shuttle....if you have the points for it.

bomber got played a lot when they first came out (6hull was co cool) then died off because ordinance was crap and expensive..... now days they are lots better thanks extra munition and Guidance Chips and a larger choice of bombs/missiles/torpedos etc

there's no real "fix" in vets for bombers, just more toys especially ept Gamma Vets (crackshot? deadeye? pretty big force multipliers on that ship) and the awesome Deathfire

Tie shuttle is about the only thing in the box that actually makes them worse than before, but you don't have to use it

in short, Bombers are very useful. they didn't change as much with vets as they did with extra munitions and g-chips, though, and they're just not as overtly ridiculous as the Tie/x7

there's no real "fix" in vets for bombers, just more toys especially ept Gamma Vets (crackshot? deadeye? pretty big force multipliers on that ship) and the awesome Deathfire

Tie shuttle is about the only thing in the box that actually makes them worse than before, but you don't have to use it

The Bomber has got so many fixes over the lat 2 years it didn'T need anything in the box.IMHO the title isn't a fix more an option opener

bomber got played a lot when they first came out (6hull was co cool) then died off because ordinance was crap and expensive..... now days they are lots better thanks extra munition and Guidance Chips and a larger choice of bombs/missiles/torpedos etc

Don't discount Long Range Scanners.

there's no real "fix" in vets for bombers, just more toys especially ept Gamma Vets (crackshot? deadeye? pretty big force multipliers on that ship) and the awesome Deathfire

Tie shuttle is about the only thing in the box that actually makes them worse than before, but you don't have to use it

I think Long Range Scanners is a fix for low PS Tie Bombers. Oh, the Scimitar Pilot isn't relevant in tournament meta with the U-boats around, but that doesn't mean things won't shift later. Just because it doesn't fit in right this moment doesn't mean it isn't some sort of fix. Then again.....I still think it can work right now, but people seem unwilling to try.

Also, I get that your opinion is that the Tie Shuttle is a bad thing, but I see it as just something different. I don't agree that it makes the Tie Bomber worse. It's a way to make pilots like Jonus useful, since he can't get to use his own ability.

Gamma Vets can be considered a bit of a fix, those guys just rock!

Deathfire is the Tarn Mission of the box, given time a build will surface that works nicely with him.

I'm liking Deathfire. I've been running him with EM and Prox Mines. Doing a Barrel Roll and then dropping the mine is awesome. I wish he there was a title that let him convert missile slots to bomb slots.

I also wish there was a another "Death" ship so I can run him and Deathrain in a total Death list.

Deathfire already has a build that works, just give him conner nets

cheapest net dispenser in the game by far , clocking in the same as a naked warden while packing conners + extras

spice with LRS and a missile of choice and he's good to go

What about this x 4:

Gamma Squadron Veteran — TIE Bomber 19 Deadeye 1 Plasma Torpedoes 3 Extra Munitions 2 Long-Range Scanners 0 Ship Total: 25

LRS targets on turn one, but then Deadeye gives the flexibility to either engage an alternate target you don't have a lock on or ratchet up the damage with a focus to launch and TL to mod dice.

What about this x 4:

Gamma Squadron Veteran — TIE Bomber 19 Deadeye 1 Plasma Torpedoes 3 Extra Munitions 2 Long-Range Scanners 0 Ship Total: 25

LRS targets on turn one, but then Deadeye gives the flexibility to either engage an alternate target you don't have a lock on or ratchet up the damage with a focus to launch and TL to mod dice.

I've thought about this and it might cause one of their ships to veer off....which is a good thing. But is it worth losing the Guidance Chip for it? That's what I'm not sure on. It might be, but might not be.

What about this x 4:

Gamma Squadron Veteran — TIE Bomber 19 Deadeye 1 Plasma Torpedoes 3 Extra Munitions 2 Long-Range Scanners 0 Ship Total: 25

LRS targets on turn one, but then Deadeye gives the flexibility to either engage an alternate target you don't have a lock on or ratchet up the damage with a focus to launch and TL to mod dice.

I've thought about this and it might cause one of their ships to veer off....which is a good thing. But is it worth losing the Guidance Chip for it? That's what I'm not sure on. It might be, but might not be.

Yes the loss of that guaranteed damage from Chimps is a concern. One option would be to run a pair of each.

i ran vader + 2 gammas with Swarm Tactics last night so they all fire at PS9.

Both bombers had homers, seismics, extra muns, and long range scanners.

The alpha strike was utterly devastating. Targetlock turn 1, focus turn 2-3 and fire homing missiles. Homing missiles dont burn the targetlock to fire, so i had both TL and Focus on a 4die attack that denied evade tokens. In the 3 games i played the first thing i locked onto blew up immediately, or vader finished it off next round because it had enough hp to tank it.

The problem was firing the 2nd homing missiles. That **** range 1-2 no TL zone is crippling. I even went 4FWD with them then 5K'd and scraped the edge of the board and i was still JUUUUST in range2 of everything because it was painfully obvious what i had to do to get another TL so everyone just followed them, even ignoring Vader to do so.

I won 2 games, but barely. Third game vader died to early bad green dice and the bombers just couldnt do anything after that.

I knew when i saw that card it was going to be really **** bad. Moving as fast as bombers possibly can, which afaik is the fastest ship that CAN take long range scanners, i still couldnt get away because all you gotta do is tail them. range2 bubble is insanely hard to get away from.

On a side note, i went against a trip defender list with two /ds and fletchette cannons. For the record, F THAT STRESS lol. Only won that one because he clipped a rock and my 2nd bomber got away as a result, and vader 5-hit prockets ftw on top of him rolling full blanks on green. I should have lost that lol.

edit: wow it censored 5-hit if you dont put the - in there.

The problem was firing the 2nd homing missiles. That **** range 1-2 no TL zone is crippling. I even went 4FWD with them then 5K'd and scraped the edge of the board and i was still JUUUUST in range2 of everything because it was painfully obvious what i had to do to get another TL so everyone just followed them, even ignoring Vader to do so.

I won 2 games, but barely. Third game vader died to early bad green dice and the bombers just couldnt do anything after that.

Don't have your Bombers fly in formation. Have them facing slightly different directions if you can. Then, when they zip off to get the range, at least one of them can TL something. The enemy can't have all their ships in R1-2 of both of them. It's like back in Wave 1 when you had to fly X-wings at each other to hit the Tie Fighters that were arc dodging them.

Homing Missiles are fantastic for Imp Aces and /X7 title Defenders. It's great for anything without Evade, as well, due to getting the re-roll. Both LRS and Guidance Chips are good on them. People seem to dismiss LRS without really trying them, but I think a mix of both is probably appropriate.

A Gamma Vet w/ Crackshot, LRS, and Extra Munitions costs 27 pts, but has a 98% of doing at least one damage to a tokened up Stealth Soontir Fel. If you are able to use LRS on Soontir and force him out of the fight for even a turn or two due to avoiding firing arc, then he makes up his points as the rest of the list can beat up on the rest of his. In an alpha strike list, sometimes that's all it takes.

Indeed. Two Focus/Target Locked Homing Missiles are pretty much a death sentence for Fel, and surprisingly easy to set up the shot with.

Guidance Chips are better paired with other ordnance, where you need the modification to hit in the first place.

I find myself considering trying the following:

• Gamma Squadron Veteran, Crack Shot, Homing Missiles, Long Range Scanners x 2
• Gamma Squadron Veteran, Deadeye, Plasma Torpedoes, Extra Munitions, Guidance Chips x 2

The 'Missile Boats' are superb ace hunters. The Torpedo boats aren't quite as lethal but take much less to set up their shot, and, of course, have a second round in the tubes.

Two homing missiles should break pretty much any ace in two, and a plasma torpedo plus two missiles should do the same for a jumpmaster (at PS5). You'll still get eaten up by swarms, but one-to-two missiles should nail Howlrunner before her accompanying PS4 fighters fire, so that at least is in your favour.

The one other thought might be including a 'special purposes' bomber in a set of four - Jonus in TIE shuttle is a good one, but equally something with 'knife-fighting' ability might be a good plan. Maybe equipping one ship with Flechettes and Proton Rockets instead of long-ranged firepower?

I don't hate that list against swarms really. You task one Homing Missile to Howl, the second Homing Missile to a BSP, and the torpedoes to whatever is still alive. There should be two TIEs dead in the opening exchange, maybe 3, and you've got better PS and 24 hull for the ensuing fight. I feel like there are worse matchups in this game.

Honestly wouldn't bother taking a missile to howlie

Just abuse the **** out of your PS advantage and blow up as many PS 4s as possible before they can fire

i'd view howlie as more of a threat than a crackshot. Cracks are one solid damage, howlie can consistantly cause the swarm to hit several attacks. Crack isnt that great if you only hit once to begin with, as if you get more evades its useless.

Than a crackshot tie, you mean?

I'd take the guaranteed loss of attack dice from a Tie that died before it shot over killing Howlrunner after she got her shot off any day

Because what inevitably happens is your opponent rolls perfect hits + focus :/