Mon Karren seems to be the hot MC80 title du jour, but my own interest lies with the possibilities of the Liberty title. Now, it may seem like a suboptimal use of your MC80 star/battle cruiser as the ship lends itself so well to a pure firepower build, but for the first time, we have a Rebel cap ship (with significant firepower), that has a support team slot and a weapons team slot.

Amongst the new squadron-specific upgrade cards the combination of FCT and Flight Commander seems to be a winning team, available for the Yavaris and other Neb-B escorts. The Liberty can field this combination as well, and can add in Flight Controllers, helping up to four squadrons win the space superiority battle. Previously to run Flight Controllers the rebels depended on the AF2b, which in my mind has always had a somewhat anemic level of firepower (on its own). Now we have a true capital ship that can put out a decent amount of dice on its own, as well as really contribute to the squadron battle.

There are downsides of course. To name a few:

1) You can only have one. Without the Liberty title, your Flight Controllers bonus is less effective, though perhaps still a possibility if you're intent on winning the squadron battle.

2) you're giving up gunnery teams or any of the other ship-focused weapons team upgrades. Gunnery teams on this ship was hoped for by many, with good reason. Still, leaving it out gives you the option of selecting Advanced Gunnery as a mission. Ruthless Strategists is also possible but the black dice range limitation makes it less attractive.

3) you need a steady token source to capitalize on Liberty's effect, at least until you've won the squadron superiority game. This likely means a Comms transport, or Tantive IV. (Possibly Garm +/- vet captain, for a more limited effect). These ships can serve other purposes, but there's no question this is a resource intensive build.

With the anticipated increase in squadrons for wave 3/4 lists I think the Liberty has a role. However I wonder if the opportunity cost is too great? Do you see Liberty pushing squadrons in your future lists?

Easiest way to do that would be to bring Raymus Antilles along for the ride. I have had success in the past running an MC80 Assault as a squadron activater, so I wouldn't discount a 4 squadron activation ship from being a good option, especially if it could convert from squadron duty to heavy repairs or ridiculous maneuvers (see Gen Madine) as the turns dragged on.

Liberty Carrier: http://armadawarlords.hivelabs.solutions/view_list.php?token=32700

I quite like this on paper!

I definately see it being a thing. One of the better aspects of Imp carriers is i) strong front battery ii) strong front shields iii) flight controllers. The liberty has all of these.

The only thing the Liberty lacks is Boosted Comms/Offensive Retro (which is a big hit) but Flight Coordinator makes up for this with foward placing squadrons. You can't corner up but not every Imp carrier list does this anyway.

You're right, a carrier layout is going to be one real possibility. Even if it is suboptimal (I'm not sure it is yet), the concept of trade-offs is absolutely critical to the game. What else are you getting in your fleet as a result of not having to dedicate another ship to being a carrier? In some fleet, I think a carrier layout is going to turn out to be a good design.

The one option I'm very curious to try is that if you can feed a steady supply of tokens to the ship, you can pretty much always activate two squadrons regardless of your dial. That little bit of a boost to the squadron game in an otherwise gun list will be nice.

Raymus on Liberty

Comms net or Tantive nearby.

But then I just think, why not just use the flotilla as a carrier?

BTW, so far I'm noticing one particular thing: there is no ship with all three crew slots (Officer, Weapons Team, Support Team) AND an Offensive Retrofit. This may go for several waves before we ever see that in a ship.

Raymus on Liberty

Comms net or Tantive nearby.

But then I just think, why not just use the flotilla as a carrier?

I had overlooked Raymus as a token-generating possibility because that's a highly coveted upgrade spot for rebel squadrons, between flight coordinator, Toryn Farr, and Adar. Especially Adar, if you include Yavaris in your fleet and some Aces. But if you can fit those guys elsewhere then yes he's a great solution!

I too wonder about a strictly token-only activation build. Maybe a dual Liberty build, one as the gunship and the other as the "light carrier"? A squadron escort of a couple of X-wings and a couple of YT-2400's could do some mean work...

I like the idea.

The only issues I have are that at flat stick rebel fighters (other than A wings) can't keep up with the liberty. So you might have a situation where your Liberty's tactical options are restricted because it needs to keep the fighters close. And with command 3 you probably want some sort of command manipulation so you can time your squadron commands - running nothing but squadron commands will restrict your manouvering even more.

I like the idea.

The only issues I have are that at flat stick rebel fighters (other than A wings) can't keep up with the liberty. So you might have a situation where your Liberty's tactical options are restricted because it needs to keep the fighters close. And with command 3 you probably want some sort of command manipulation so you can time your squadron commands - running nothing but squadron commands will restrict your manouvering even more.

True but the Yavaris has a similar speed 3 also with the option of engine techs to get effectively speed 4, and I run it all the time with B-Wings in a wave 2 (Pre FCTs) environment.

Just because a ship can go speed 3 doesn't mean it usually does. Front firepower ships like Liberty, Nebs and many Imperials know that fast speed and overshoots can often result in you playing the rest of the game using your flank and rear arcs if you aren't careful.

Liberty+Garm+Wing Commander+Flight Controllers+ A-wing swarm = Very nice Alpha Strike, at the right time

BTW, so far I'm noticing one particular thing: there is no ship with all three crew slots (Officer, Weapons Team, Support Team) AND an Offensive Retrofit. This may go for several waves before we ever see that in a ship.

It would be a VERY powerful ship to get all slots. . . I can only think of the SSD as big enough to do so.

If you could have a rebel ship with all that they could do obscene things with that. . .

Might be an interesting choice, an under armed dedicated squadron carrier for example might justify this configuration. Maybe an Arquitens?

Might be an interesting choice, an under armed dedicated squadron carrier for example might justify this configuration. Maybe an Arquitens?

So a ship could have Flight Controllers, Flight Coordination Team, Flight Commander, and Expanded Hangerbay.

That is the supreme list of upgrades I think.

On topic though, I can easily see Liberty in a Garm fleet without Raymus so you can have your Flight Commander. The fact that you can have Flight Coordination Teams, Flight Controllers, and Flight Commander is the ultimate in Flightiness!

It is an amazing set up to use with 4 Squadrons! Keep a Leia Transport in distance 1-5 with Bomber COmmand Center and you have a SERIOUSLY potent threat. . . *EYES LIGHT UP*

Might be an interesting choice, an under armed dedicated squadron carrier for example might justify this configuration. Maybe an Arquitens?

So a ship could have Flight Controllers, Flight Coordination Team, Flight Commander, and Expanded Hangerbay.

That is the supreme list of upgrades I think.

On topic though, I can easily see Liberty in a Garm fleet without Raymus so you can have your Flight Commander. The fact that you can have Flight Coordination Teams, Flight Controllers, and Flight Commander is the ultimate in Flightiness!

It is an amazing set up to use with 4 Squadrons! Keep a Leia Transport in distance 1-5 with Bomber COmmand Center and you have a SERIOUSLY potent threat. . . *EYES LIGHT UP*

Speaking of which, we gotta come up with separate abbreviations for Flight Commander and Flight Controllers. FC just ain't gonna cut it anymore.

FliCom vs FliCon? Probably still too similar

FCom vs FliCTRLs?

FCom vs FCTRL?

Also confusion between FCTs and FCTs (Fire Control Team & Fighter Coordination Team).

Also confusion between FCTs and FCTs (Fire Control Team & Fighter Coordination Team).

Might be an interesting choice, an under armed dedicated squadron carrier for example might justify this configuration. Maybe an Arquitens?

So a ship could have Flight Controllers, Flight Coordination Team, Flight Commander, and Expanded Hangerbay.

That is the supreme list of upgrades I think.

On topic though, I can easily see Liberty in a Garm fleet without Raymus so you can have your Flight Commander. The fact that you can have Flight Coordination Teams, Flight Controllers, and Flight Commander is the ultimate in Flightiness!

It is an amazing set up to use with 4 Squadrons! Keep a Leia Transport in distance 1-5 with Bomber COmmand Center and you have a SERIOUSLY potent threat. . . *EYES LIGHT UP*

No No Use Leia with Coms Nets on the Transport, You more or less get a 2pts cheaper Raymus out of it + the flexibility of altering the top command of the ship receiving the token. it will go so nice with the Liberty Title, and you wont tie up the officer slot on the Liberty with Raymus.

There's a - people aren't using...

FCT - Fighter Coordination Team

F-CT - Fire-Control Team.

I doubt we'll ultimately see much of either upgrade anyway

but def more Coordination Teams over Fire Control; Yavaris loves em

How about, crazy concept here,

we just type out their full names... no confusion.

My Surname is 9 letters long as has no Vowels...

I hate Typing Names out In Full.....

I built a carrier list!

http://armadawarlords.hivelabs.solutions/view_list.php?token=32951

It's kind of a pity that Liberty-types don't have access to hangar bay upgrades, given that the sister ship of the Liberty itself had them:

Justice

But I suppose taking the dedicated carrier options other than actual bays sort of represents it, even if the squadron value itself remains low.

It's kind of a pity that Liberty-types don't have access to hangar bay upgrades, given that the sister ship of the Liberty itself had them:

Justice

But I suppose taking the dedicated carrier options other than actual bays sort of represents it, even if the squadron value itself remains low.

Rebels have always had it a bit harder to activate as many squadrons in a single activation as the Imperials.

I believe that this is two-fold though. First because Imperial squadrons are cheaper, and second because the ISD is a BEAST of a ship, representing the biggest ship currently out to date.

It's kind of a pity that Liberty-types don't have access to hangar bay upgrades, given that the sister ship of the Liberty itself had them:

Justice

But I suppose taking the dedicated carrier options other than actual bays sort of represents it, even if the squadron value itself remains low.

Rebels have always had it a bit harder to activate as many squadrons in a single activation as the Imperials.

I believe that this is two-fold though. First because Imperial squadrons are cheaper, and second because the ISD is a BEAST of a ship, representing the biggest ship currently out to date.

well, now they get the cheaper gr-75 for all their squadron activating needs

+/- the cost effectiveness of squadron token spam tarkin