I'm liking Mon Karren, Overload Pulse and Gunnery teams as a set up for the rest of my fleet. I love forcing bad choices on my opponent.

That's exactally the build I am thinking of testing.

Mon Karren prefers to push for damage and crits. With all the focus on other aspects a nice side note is that it can allow you to sneak standard crits through a ship. I have been looking at ion cannon batteries and fire-control team to help push damage up and slip a face up on the Star Cruiser which Mon Karren would be interested in.

Mon Karren prefers to push for damage and crits. With all the focus on other aspects a nice side note is that it can allow you to sneak standard crits through a ship. I have been looking at ion cannon batteries and fire-control team to help push damage up and slip a face up on the Star Cruiser which Mon Karren would be interested in.

That's a good point, and one I don't think I've seen someone directly make: Mon Karren is particularly good at preventing contain.

Mon Karren prefers to push for damage and crits. With all the focus on other aspects a nice side note is that it can allow you to sneak standard crits through a ship. I have been looking at ion cannon batteries and fire-control team to help push damage up and slip a face up on the Star Cruiser which Mon Karren would be interested in.

That's a good point, and one I don't think I've seen sometime directly make: Mon Karren is particularly good at preventing contain.

MK+Intell Officer can offer up a hard choice for your opponent:

Loose the one Brace you have.

Or have alot or all of your shields stripped away on one or two sides.

Something to keep in mind is that mon Karen limits ONE defense token, but the defender still chooses what token. So even if Mk+Io fires at a vsd, the vsd can still blow a redirect to live for another turn.

Something to keep in mind is that mon Karen limits ONE defense token, but the defender still chooses what token. So even if Mk+Io fires at a vsd, the vsd can still blow a redirect to live for another turn.

Yes but you have still denied the defender to use his Defence tokens effectively.

This is why i'm advocating for the MK+IO+XI7 combo, yes its 21 pts, but you will effectively lock down the most efficient use of any Defence token combo on any type of ship you may encounter.

Throw in XX-9 into the mix and see your opponent weep when he has to choose between having his ship blown away, or receive a whole bunch of Face up damage cards for the one or more hits you land on his hull.

Some may say its overkill, but overkill is usually the thing that is needed to take out an enemy ship as fast as possible or render it useless for further use.

Something to keep in mind is that mon Karen limits ONE defense token, but the defender still chooses what token. So even if Mk+Io fires at a vsd, the vsd can still blow a redirect to live for another turn.

Can he really though? Give it X1-7 Turbolasers, and before an accuracy you've still completely nullified non-brace defenses on most ships with a single accuracy or Intel officer. And don't forget that this also applies to side attacks, so a double arc will do severe damage by locking down those tokens twice.

Something to keep in mind is that mon Karen limits ONE defense token, but the defender still chooses what token. So even if Mk+Io fires at a vsd, the vsd can still blow a redirect to live for another turn.

Can he really though? Give it X1-7 Turbolasers, and before an accuracy you've still completely nullified non-brace defenses on most ships with a single accuracy or Intel officer. And don't forget that this also applies to side attacks, so a double arc will do severe damage by locking down those tokens twice.

WITHOUT MK:

XI7, no accuracy: redirects are shut down, defender braces and contain/evades.

XI7 + accuracy: brace and redirect are shut down, defender contains/evades.

WITH MK:

XI7, no accuracy: redirects are shut down, defender braces. No contain/evade.

XI7 + accuracy: brace and redirect are shut down, defender contains or evades.

You're gaining almost nothing from MK here.

The only thing you get by stacking XI7 and MK is the ability to shut down contain/evade if you didn't get an accuracy. Because the defender gets to choose which token he can use, accuracies gain you nothing but the ability to choose which token that will not be.

What MK does do for you is allow you to drop XI7, meaning you can fill that second turbolaser slot with something else. XX9+SA? H9+QLT?

I'm thinking Quad Turbolasers with H9s for double accuracy, selecting redirects. With Intel officer onboard and MK, you choose the Brace token. Either you're sniping Brace off in that initial shot or they're doing nothing against the incoming damage.

Something to keep in mind is that mon Karen limits ONE defense token, but the defender still chooses what token. So even if Mk+Io fires at a vsd, the vsd can still blow a redirect to live for another turn.

Can he really though? Give it X1-7 Turbolasers, and before an accuracy you've still completely nullified non-brace defenses on most ships with a single accuracy or Intel officer. And don't forget that this also applies to side attacks, so a double arc will do severe damage by locking down those tokens twice.

I think some of you guys are not really thinking this through.

WITHOUT MK:

XI7, no accuracy: redirects are shut down, defender braces and contain/evades.

XI7 + accuracy: brace and redirect are shut down, defender contains/evades.

WITH MK:

XI7, no accuracy: redirects are shut down, defender braces. No contain/evade.

XI7 + accuracy: brace and redirect are shut down, defender contains or evades.

You're gaining almost nothing from MK here.

The only thing you get by stacking XI7 and MK is the ability to shut down contain/evade if you didn't get an accuracy. Because the defender gets to choose which token he can use, accuracies gain you nothing but the ability to choose which token that will not be.

What MK does do for you is allow you to drop XI7, meaning you can fill that second turbolaser slot with something else. XX9+SA? H9+QLT?

I see where you're coming from here, but lets look at it a different way:

X17 Turbolasers are really good against ships with multiple redirects, because they can effectively knock those out and essentially defeat all the points spent on them.

X17s are not as good against ships with lots of other options for defense tokens. A ship with 3 or more different tokens is much more effective, especially when none of those tokens is a contain.

Mon Karren is far more effective against those ships, such as the Assault Frigate, MC30, CR90, Interdictor and Gladiator. And as I noted above, the MK is most effective against Rebel ships, because more Rebel ships have that particular setup for resilience.

I think something people are missing is that Mon Karren might not be a huge boost over most Imperial ships, but it's a massive boost in lethality against Rebel ships.

Exactly the discussion I had last night.

Perhaps? Right now, I'm leaning towards trying to out Mon Karren a Mon Karren in the "mirror" match.

I'm thinking Quad Turbolasers with H9s for double accuracy, selecting redirects. With Intel officer onboard and MK, you choose the Brace token. Either you're sniping Brace off in that initial shot or they're doing nothing against the incoming damage.

Now that, to me, is pretty much the text-book case for not needing MK. QTL + H9 means the majority of targeted ships will only have one un-accuracied defense token.

From strictly a tactical point of view Mon Karren seems like a risky choice. It doesn't fit with the other Rebel ships as it focuses on blasting up things ahead of it. As it generates a huge threat, the Imp player is going to focus on eliminating it while Mon Karren MUST go into battle heads-on, otherwise it will be weak. Therefor it will most likely serve as a bait (that can bite itself) but may be too costly to play that role. We still have to play a few rounds with it though to see how it works out.

It definitely stirs up the pond, but I think that Mon Karren would make any battle for the Rebels more risky on the long run.

Mon Karren was AMAZING in my test game today. I flew it off but when it attacked the Xi7's and Mon Karren did work!

My question is simple enough if using MK on the cheaper (star cruiser) varient with gunnery would you be better to go spinal lasers for the 4th red or Intel officer? Thinking about hitting say a flotilla here, less dice lowers odds of accuracy but you get the Intel ? Worth it?

Also who is considering engine techs? I ran it first time round and thought it was great for the turning circle but I could probably go without if I got more hitting power?

Remember that with Mon Karren, they get to pick their crit, so you can use Intel Officer as a soft Accuracy. Maybe they use it, maybe they don't. You are forcing decisions on your opponent. More choices mean more mistakes.

Speaking of. Does Madines extra clicks work on an engine tech move?

Speaking of. Does Madines extra clicks work on an engine tech move?

No. They are used during the move that you spent them on and that is the first move not the Engine Techs move.

The better question is, can you use a Madine navigate command with a Madine navigate token to get three extra clicks. My reading is yes.

The better question is, can you use a Madine navigate command with a Madine navigate token to get three extra clicks. My reading is yes.

We all agree on that in the rules forum.

Cant wait to fly a Madine fleet. Heaven

The better question is, can you use a Madine navigate command with a Madine navigate token to get three extra clicks. My reading is yes.

We all agree on that in the rules forum.

Cant wait to fly a Madine fleet. Heaven

I need to pay more attention to that forum. Heaven is indeed the word I would use.