Mace LIVES

By Arrakus, in Star Wars: Edge of the Empire RPG

George said it. Therefore it's canon. Oh it doesn't work like that, anymore? Ah shucks. :P

Mace is super dead though.

Mace is super dead though.

Nah...Storytelling 101: If you don't see a dead body, they can always come back.

Comics/SF Storytelling 102: Even if you see a dead body, they can still come back.

I had him show up in a game a couple years ago, living as a hermit on a planet in Wild Space called Talsor. He had a cybernetic arm and a bad attitude.

I had him show up in a game a couple years ago, living as a hermit on a planet in Wild Space called Talsor. He had a cybernetic arm and a bad attitude.

I've got an eyepatch-wearing Sam Jackson slated to show up starting next session, to soon be joined by a Nautalan, a Zabrak, and an Iktochi. But it's not Mace and company. They're clones, the first of an experimental line created by Palpatine. ("Mace" was grown using source DNA from his severed hand.) Their cloned nature prevents them from fully accessing the Force in the same ways their "donors" did, so they're out to get hold of the new spice that the group has been smuggling...spice which, unknown to the crew, causes brief, often powerful, sometimes fatal, outbursts of Force power in users.

So, even when there are bodies... ;)

Edited by Nytwyng

I had him show up in a game a couple years ago, living as a hermit on a planet in Wild Space called Talsor. He had a cybernetic arm and a bad attitude.

Yup.. in MY Star Wars Universe Mace survived by landing in a passing garbage scow.. and fleeing to a planet I haven't thought of yet.

Reason 2) SLJ IS TOO F****** COOL TO HAVE CHARACTERS BEING KILLED OFF. I'm looking at you, Marvel Film Franchise :D Cheers, JW!

What he should've done, instead of asking George, was simply say "Help me mother f****** Dave Filoni! You're my only mother f****** hope!"

Mace is super dead though.

Mace falls from a super crazy height: Anakin did this intentionally and survived.

Mace didn't really take a lethal strike, no reason he couldn't use the Force to control his fall like Luke did in Cloud City to escape Vader.

Darth Maul got cut in half as well as fell down a bottomless pit and somehow "He Got Better".

No reason based on precedents in the canon that Mace couldn't also survive and make a surprise return in some campaign.

I mean it's not even really stretching the bounds of believability for the setting. Each one of the things that happened to him, some other character survived, sometimes multiple things at once.

So yeah, Mace could surely be alive if someone wanted him to be.

Yes and in my game he's super dead. Clones are a good idea that I might steal but the original got his hand cut off, a full blast of force lightning enough to show his skeleton (only ever happened to Vader as well in the Canon and he died from it), force pushed like kilometers away (going off of canon, there's no defense against force move so you just get thrown about) and one only survives a huge fall if they have prepared themselves with enhance imo. Fall damage can still happen to force users the same as regular people.

Yes and in my game he's super dead. Clones are a good idea that I might steal but the original got his hand cut off, a full blast of force lightning enough to show his skeleton (only ever happened to Vader as well in the Canon and he died from it), force pushed like kilometers away (going off of canon, there's no defense against force move so you just get thrown about) and one only survives a huge fall if they have prepared themselves with enhance imo. Fall damage can still happen to force users the same as regular people.

Vader also wore electronic life support gear that was shorted out by the Force lightning and no longer working, a drawback not faced by Mace.

Then, as already mentioned, there's Maul...cut in half at the waist, yet still alive and kicking as of approx 4 BBY, at least.

Just sayin'...it's not out of the realm of possibility, all using canon as a basis.

Yes and in my game he's super dead.

Perfectly fine. Your table, your canon. That being said, I'm going to nitpick a bit. :D

Clones are a good idea that I might steal but the original got his hand cut off, a full blast of force lightning enough to show his skeleton (only ever happened to Vader as well in the Canon and he died from it),

Luke had both those things happen to him, and while they didn't show his skeleton, he sat there getting pounded by force lightning for WAAAAY longer than Vader did, and he survived just fine. The Emperor wasn't holding back with his lightning on Luke, he was gleefully unloading on him. You could say, he went midevil on his as*. :D

force pushed like kilometers away (going off of canon, there's no defense against force move so you just get thrown about) and one only survives a huge fall if they have prepared themselves with enhance imo.

Don't think Maul prepared himself with Enhance before being cut in half and falling to his death. He in fact looked quite surprised by what happened. And actually your Discipline is defense against Move, but regardless, simple acceleration due to gravity would override any damage from the Move out the window he suffered. And again, Anakin did a nose dive intentionally for probably a mile down at least, so he hit terminal velocity, and he just grabbed a passing car and was fine. And Luke didn't grab anything when he fell, he just aimed for a shute and dove in, then slowed down as he slid down the slide.

Fall damage can still happen to force users the same as regular people.

Very true, but we also see evidence that fall damage can be ignored by force users, unlike regular people, more than once in the canon.

Again, if you want him to be dead in your canon, that's perfectly fine, I'm just saying that the reasons you are using to support your claim, have been shown multiple times to not kill Jedi/Force Users, so the possibility of him surviving is entirely plausible.

Edited by KungFuFerret

Yes and jedi are great at blocking blaster shots and can sense incoming dangers seconds ahead which allow them to react... except when it comes to Order 66 and all the jedi suddenly just lose all their powers for the sake of the plot.

Darth Maul only came back due to being a fan favorite... you could say his revival only happened due to popularity. It's kind of like "The Death of Superman" comic back in 1992. Due to popularity, they could never truly kill off Superman or they'd lose a lot of readers so they reversed the decision almost immediately.

Same goes for Boba Fett.

Also, George "The Maker" Lucas is known to reverse previously established decisions on a whim. It's entirely possible he originally meant for Mace to die in that scene, which is how it seems. Nobody in Disney has reversed that decision as far as I know and even in the Legends material he never came back, so Mace is canonically dead/his legends end there (until said otherwise).

If you really want to nitpick, maybe the character lived but the persona and identity of Mace Windu is in fact dead. If anyone ever recognized him he would be gunned down or turned per the Emperor's orders. He lives off on some backwater world, influencing the lives of other force sensitive people to train them for threats outside of the Skywalker family drama....

...or he's just dead. :D

Darth Maul only came back due to being a fan favorite... you could say his revival only happened due to popularity. It's kind of like "The Death of Superman" comic back in 1992. Due to popularity, they could never truly kill off Superman or they'd lose a lot of readers so they reversed the decision almost immediately.

That's not why, it's that George regretted having to kill him off for the sake of the movie (the minor villain must die, otherwise the main plot threads become too confusing) because he felt the character had a lot more stories to tell. Never mind the hostility (in some places, continuing) at the idea that Maul survived. He might have been a fan favourite, but few thought his revival was going to work. I thought it was going to be pretty lame too, until I saw the treatment.

Darth Maul only came back due to being a fan favorite... you could say his revival only happened due to popularity. It's kind of like "The Death of Superman" comic back in 1992. Due to popularity, they could never truly kill off Superman or they'd lose a lot of readers so they reversed the decision almost immediately.

Bad example there. It wasn't "reversed almost immediately." Bringing him back was a foregone conclusion before the issue hit the stands. The original plan for Superman v2 #75 was the Clark/Lois wedding. But the decision was made up the corporate ladder to sync the wedding in both the comics and on Lois & Clark. So, a big event was needed. But his return was inevitable from moment 1 of the story's genesis.

Also, George "The Maker" Lucas is known to reverse previously established decisions on a whim. It's entirely possible he originally meant for Mace to die in that scene, which is how it seems. Nobody in Disney has reversed that decision as far as I know and even in the Legends material he never came back, so Mace is canonically dead/his legends end there (until said otherwise).

If we really want to be nitpicky and accurate, he's canonically presumed dead. No body, and last seen in circumstances that do not necessarily call for death in the canon. ;)

Darth Maul only came back due to being a fan favorite... you could say his revival only happened due to popularity. It's kind of like "The Death of Superman" comic back in 1992. Due to popularity, they could never truly kill off Superman or they'd lose a lot of readers so they reversed the decision almost immediately.

That's not why, it's that George regretted having to kill him off for the sake of the movie (the minor villain must die, otherwise the main plot threads become too confusing) because he felt the character had a lot more stories to tell. Never mind the hostility (in some places, continuing) at the idea that Maul survived. He might have been a fan favourite, but few thought his revival was going to work. I thought it was going to be pretty lame too, until I saw the treatment.

Minor villain should be killed off (except in attack of the clones when Dooku survives and it's a-ok.) What would it have been like though, if Maul was Palpatine's apprentice until the end of RotS? Or if during the Clone Wars, his apprentices were vying for top spot and he had Vader come in and take them both out? That would have been neat.

If Boba Fett can live and the Emperor can come back as clones and Maul can survive being cut in half then ..... Mace Windu can still be alive. I'm not sure why anyone would be so invested in this one character being dead when others have come back from far worse (and it be made canon).

I'm fine with Mace being alive. I imagine he'd have to do some rethinking and lay low. He ran pretty close to the dark side himself, he's probably need a lot of time to reassess. He was ready to kill Palpatine because he saw that there was no way to leave him alive and bring him to justice...but it was still going to be a dark act. In TCW, he's not the most compassionate, e.g.: how he treats the young Boba Fett. Boba actually gives him an opening ("I see now I've done terrible things"), and Mace just pulls the authoritarian card. In the Dark Disciple novel, he goes along with the plot to assassinate Dooku. And it's telling that Yoda doesn't share with him what he learned in the last arc of TCW Season 6.

A living Mace would make for some great stories.

If Boba Fett can live and the Emperor can come back as clones and Maul can survive being cut in half then ..... Mace Windu can still be alive. I'm not sure why anyone would be so invested in this one character being dead when others have come back from far worse (and it be made canon).

Only one of the things you mentioned is canon. That would be Maul.

Why I'm so invested in him being dead is because a character like him is a man of action. If he were alive enough to continue the fight he would have. Someone would have written even back during the Legends material that he was still alive and wrote some cool adventures.

Now that old canon that kinda ruined the magic of the movies is gone and GL is out of the way there's a fresh, clean slate and still, Mace is not among the living.

It makes sense. Yoda and Obi-Wan seemed to have way more patience than he did. If he were alive he'd either be fighting the good fight still (which he isn't) or he'd be a shell of his former self; broken and crippled, no longer the Mace Windu of the Jedi order.

Alas, he's in the same state as Boba Fett is at the moment. Both alive and dead until Disney Canon confirms one of the two. The difference between the two is there are at least "Legends" of Boba Fett surviving the Sarlacc... There are no Legends of Mace Windu after his fall.

All that and I think Mace is an incredibly overrated character that showed just how far the Jedi had gotten from their true purpose. He tried to assassinate Supreme Chancellor Palpatine!

That said, I am not trying to tell you how to view anything or what to believe. I'm just stating the character is canonically dead until more stories about him post RotS are made. Also that I personally would prefer him to stay dead.

Actually... Now I kind of want to put him in my rpg at some point just so the party can face a dark side corrupted Mace Windu (and if he's placed in there with stats, he's going to get killed at some point, knowing some of my groups). I'd probably make him a clone though, just in case they ever decide to say "Mace survived" and drop him in Rebels or something. I tend to avoid all main characters from the canon/legends on purpose.

Like I said ...... other characters have survived worse. There is no logical reason to be so invested in seeing this one character dead. I get how in your games he's dead. But dude seriously you are putting a lot of time and thought into proving to people that they too should think he's dead in a setting that has proved that far worse fates are survivable.

mace.png

Mace secretly gathers together a group of Force-users to work with the Rebellion.

If Boba Fett can live and the Emperor can come back as clones and Maul can survive being cut in half then ..... Mace Windu can still be alive. I'm not sure why anyone would be so invested in this one character being dead when others have come back from far worse (and it be made canon).

[snippage]

That said, I am not trying to tell you how to view anything or what to believe. I'm just stating the character is canonically dead until more stories about him post RotS are made. Also that I personally would prefer him to stay dead.

As noted earlier, that's not quite accurate. Canonically, he is presumed dead. No one has ever confirmed his death, there's been no body, and, as has been pointed out, there are other examples in canon demonstrating that the circumstances under which we last saw him would not necessarily lead to death for someone of Mace's skills.

Someone from Deviantart used the same animation technique like in TCW/Rebels to create an old man Mace Windu:

crazy_old_man_windu__rebels_fan_art__by_

I like the idea of Mace lives. In my many campaign side-plots, I had an idea for Asajj Ventress, but Dark Disciple changed that. Mace could replace her in that particular role easily enough and allow for an additional story in which the PCs are instrumental in his restoration.

Boba Fett is dead.

Edited by RLogue177

Someone from Deviantart used the same animation technique like in TCW/Rebels to create an old man Mace Windu:

And that artwork right there cements my idea for my campaign.