One thing I think Mon Karren does that's neat, and I know I'll draw ire from the blue crit naysayers, is it makes overload pulse kind of awesome. My biggest problem with OP is most tokens are spent anyway.
Liberty article is up
Actually that is not a bad point. Overload Pulse on Mon Karren is an interesting idea. . . Hmmm
Is it a good idea tho? it would have to be on a double arc then? What is the overall benefit over just overload pulse?
OP -> I use X tokens and exhaust the rest -> all tokens exhausted
OP + Title -> I use 1 token and exhaust the rest -> all tokens exhausted
All it really does is control X to reduce the number of tokens you can use before they get exhausted which isn't exactly super-powered over just using OP or just using the tite. Is there any real synergy here other than if you manage a double arc?
Is it a good idea tho? it would have to be on a double arc then? What is the overall benefit over just overload pulse?
OP -> I use X tokens and exhaust the rest -> all tokens exhausted
OP + Title -> I use 1 token and exhaust the rest -> all tokens exhausted
All it really does is control X to reduce the number of tokens you can use before they get exhausted which isn't exactly super-powered over just using OP or just using the tite. Is there any real synergy here other than if you manage a double arc?
Yea I was thinking more of opening with Mon Karren, OP everything, and then any token useage by further attacks from other vessels/squadrons mean that tokens will either get burned quick or let full damage through.
Hang on, spreadsheet nearly done!
I'm curious what you notice
Mon Karren + Overload Pulse + Gunnery Team isn't too expensive either.
Yea I was thinking more of opening with Mon Karren, OP everything, and then any token useage by further attacks from other vessels/squadrons mean that tokens will either get burned quick or let full damage through.
I still don't see how this is any different from JUST using overload pulse. I'm seeing 2 separate, decent upgrades doing their own thing separately rather than any sort of synergy.
I mean, it's identical to any "overload pulse" then shoot with another ship except that now opponent gets to use 1 token rather than more than 1 token. Seems meh.
It's no Overload pulse/avenger.
Edited by HastatiorI still don't see how this is any different from JUST using overload pulse. I'm seeing 2 separate, decent upgrades doing their own thing separately rather than any sort of synergy.Yea I was thinking more of opening with Mon Karren, OP everything, and then any token useage by further attacks from other vessels/squadrons mean that tokens will either get burned quick or let full damage through.
I mean, it's identical to any "overload pulse" then shoot with another ship except that now opponent gets to use 1 token rather than more than 1 token. Seems meh.
It's no Overload pulse/avenger.
Normally isd and mc80s don't pair well with OLP because the tokens get spent on their attacks anyway, brace+redirect+evade if applicable
With Mon Karen it limits it further so they are only able to effectively spend 1 token during the turn
Its actually pretty similar to Avenger+olp
Yeah if you read before responding, I did say the difference is they only get to use 1 token.
Big whoop.
if you get a pair of accuracies or whatever its virtually the same thing sans title
If anything, you would get more milage by having the OP on a ship different than the title ship and then have LS or SW7 on the title ship to fish for max damage.
IMO the main thing about this title is that it acts like a mittful of undirectable accuracies, it makes anything more than 2 accuracies useless (blocking a specific double token type) and often it makes more than 1 accuracy useless and there are plenty of things that would make the title ship more powerful against an already OPd ship (such as SW7 and LS) that don't require a blue crit to go off, either
I did read what you said, I tried to explain why it is valuable
You obviously don't see it
I don't see how it's more valuable than something else, which is what i subsequently explained.
If you are bringing an 8 point title and an 8 point upgrade card with this particular mechanic in mind you are cheating yourself and wasting the Ion slot on the Titled liberty.
You could literally put the OP on a 38 point CR90 and then put a 4 or 5 point ion cannon upgrade on the title ship that gives it utility in far more situations and doesn't rely on a blue crit gimmick. If you are running the cheap version you will have 4 blue dice anyway. It sounds to me like this title and SW7s would be a cheaper and MUCH more consistently effective synergy.
I don't think anyone said it was better then anything else.
Just that it was an interesting synergy
The reason it might be good is because it forces the opponent to only use 1/3rd of his tokens. This is powerful. Putting olp on the Liberty is much less gimmicky then OLP+avenger which requires a very specific activation order. Doing it in reverse makes it much easier since you can attack with your big hitter FIRST then follow up with your little guys.
On its own Yes Leading shots or sw-7 would be better options for the liberty but the point of OLP is to help the REST OF THE FLEET.
Is it better? Probably not
Will many people try it to see if it works? Yes, and they may prove that it is effective
I still don't see how this is any different from JUST using overload pulse. I'm seeing 2 separate, decent upgrades doing their own thing separately rather than any sort of synergy.Yea I was thinking more of opening with Mon Karren, OP everything, and then any token useage by further attacks from other vessels/squadrons mean that tokens will either get burned quick or let full damage through.
I mean, it's identical to any "overload pulse" then shoot with another ship except that now opponent gets to use 1 token rather than more than 1 token. Seems meh.
It's no Overload pulse/avenger.
Well, they can only use 1 token so you have more damage going into a single arc. That in itself can be huge.
I don't think anyone said it was better then anything else.
Just that it was an interesting synergy
The reason it might be good is because it forces the opponent to only use 1/3rd of his tokens. This is powerful. Putting olp on the Liberty is much less gimmicky then OLP+avenger which requires a very specific activation order. Doing it in reverse makes it much easier since you can attack with your big hitter FIRST then follow up with your little guys.
On its own Yes Leading shots or sw-7 would be better options for the liberty but the point of OLP is to help the REST OF THE FLEET.
Is it better? Probably not
Will many people try it to see if it works? Yes, and they may prove that it is effective
Clontroper5 is on the right track I think.
To me it is a Fleet synergy concept. You use OLP to bit a ship and let your other ships come in and do there thing on a ship with exhausted defense tokens and more damage than if it was able to use all of its tokens. You are setting up the rest of your turn.
OLP + Avenger requires that you set up Avenger which is usually inefficient.
Something else to consider with OLP and Mon Karren is what Defense tokens your opponent spends. You are now creating another decision point for them. The answer most times will be that brace which can be hit by Intel Officer or an Accuracy but there are times when you only have a single blue crit. If the ship has an evade at Medium Range, they may risk it (or Mon Mothma it) becuase they believe they can take your attack with no issues or at least survive and have time to recoup but they want to keep their tokens for the rest of your ships.
Creating decision points will lead to mistakes, mistakes lead to openings, and openings can lead to victory
Let's say you have Mon Karren with Overload Pulse - does Fire-Control Team guarantee the OP crit effect will trigger?
Let's say you have Mon Karren with Overload Pulse - does Fire-Control Team guarantee the OP crit effect will trigger?
Having a Blue Crit garentees OLP
no...Let's say you have Mon Karren with Overload Pulse - does Fire-Control Team guarantee the OP crit effect will trigger?
Having a Blue Crit garentees OLP
So FCT would only come into play if you had 1 blue crit plus one other (whatever) crit?
no...Let's say you have Mon Karren with Overload Pulse - does Fire-Control Team guarantee the OP crit effect will trigger?
Having a Blue Crit garentees OLP
So FCT would only come into play if you had 1 blue crit plus one other (whatever) crit?
FCT allows you to trigger multiple crit effects, it doesnt mean that it automatically happens.
I should have read it more carefully... thanks.
So FCT would only come into play if you had 1 blue crit plus one other (whatever) crit?no...Let's say you have Mon Karren with Overload Pulse - does Fire-Control Team guarantee the OP crit effect will trigger?
Having a Blue Crit garentees OLP
For example I roll 2 red/2 blue and get 1 red crit, 1 blue crit, and 2 hits
I activate OP to exhaust the enemies tokens the I use FCT to use the red crit to flip a card as well
A interesting question is does FCT need multiple crit faces to proc multiple crits? Like could you activate OP and the default with just 1 blue crit or do you need 2? Hmmm
Definetely needs multiple faces.
do you want salt for your steak?
Nope I'm reading this thread it has all the salt I need!
Definetely needs multiple faces.
but why?Definetely needs multiple faces.
"A critical effect... Can resolve if there is at least one [crit] icon in the attack pool"
The 2nd bullet point says, The Attacker does not spend a die icon to resolve a crit unless otherwise stated