I remember one game I played a while back, wanting to see how effective Brobots could be ignoring cannons entirely. You could do some funny tricks. I *think* I ran:

IG-C: PtL, AS, Title, AT, Proton Bomb, HotShot Blaster

IG-D: LoneWolf, FCS, Thermals, AT, Title, Hotshot blasters

I do remember the glorious, glorious shining moment of that match was IG-C Boosting using AS, get my evade, reveal dial and drop the proton bomb, 3-sloop off. Then watch my poor target fly into the bomb and get laser blasted to finish him off. The Hotshot blaster is nice, too. But I remember missing the cannon damage, pretty sure I ended up losing.

my biggest concern with brobots atm is how to deal with those tripple Uboats. Could you elaborate on how you think those Epts you are suggesting would improve that match-up?

Ive got one idea thats a bit loopy by these forum standards but could do decent. A+C both with Reinforced Deflectors. Assume the Boats get 4 hits, You roll average of 2 evades, boost gives you 1 evade, So your taking 1 hit, 2 with plasma. Now IF you botch the evade thats 5, down to 4 with the evade token, down to 3 because Reinforced Deflectors. This also doesnt figure in anything like Autothrusters or the like.Against Palp you would run Feedback Arrays so that arc matters less, You still want to shoot but if you have to you can always bug zapper them. Yes I know your having to drop Glitterstim which is amazing for Feedback Array, but this build is more about weathering the storm long term then getting that turn of awesome offence and defense.

my biggest concern with brobots atm is how to deal with those tripple Uboats. Could you elaborate on how you think those Epts you are suggesting would improve that match-up?

Ive got one idea thats a bit loopy by these forum standards but could do decent. A+C both with Reinforced Deflectors. Assume the Boats get 4 hits, You roll average of 2 evades, boost gives you 1 evade, So your taking 1 hit, 2 with plasma. Now IF you botch the evade thats 5, down to 4 with the evade token, down to 3 because Reinforced Deflectors. This also doesnt figure in anything like Autothrusters or the like.Against Palp you would run Feedback Arrays so that arc matters less, You still want to shoot but if you have to you can always bug zapper them. Yes I know your having to drop Glitterstim which is amazing for Feedback Array, but this build is more about weathering the storm long term then getting that turn of awesome offence and defense.

Reinforced Deflectors is a terrible card. More so on the Aggressor.

Huh? you dismiss Push the Limit because you say you shouldn't be stressing, but then suggest Expert Handling, Daredevil which stress you out.

Why do you think Mindlink is good? You need to be able to K turn and S loop with Agressors to beat Aces and the Mindlink just passes that stress around, the focus gain is negligible.

I'm not sure how you think you are getting infinite Sloops by using Wingman either. Wingman doesn't affect yourself. So are you going to keep your 2 88s side by side the whole game?

Intimidation!? wow super lol. You want to stop 50 points worth of ship firing to give out a -1 Agility.

What Drugs are you on PGS?

Exactly. Thinking of it Mindlink is more a "Swarm" EPT than a Duo EPT. In order to get a large enough return on focus, to make up for the shared stress, you really want to be giving out 2-3+ other ships a focus. Which means its only really making it worth it in Swarm.

Also, 4 and 5 ship lists aren't swarms.

I would like to add that I begin every game with a fortress. Each Brobot is placed facing forward with their sides flush against one another. When they do hard 1 turns into each other, they do not bump. As long as you're careful with your templates, they can do the same straight and then fortress further up. Or the inner one can do a 1 bank, and the outer one can do a 3 bank in the same direction and they will not bump. This makes it much harder to screw up.

my biggest concern with brobots atm is how to deal with those tripple Uboats. Could you elaborate on how you think those Epts you are suggesting would improve that match-up?

Poor guys with Crackshot and Glitterstim (for double modified accuracy) are just one damage shy of the goal. Our local Brobot player constantly laments the problematic, 1 extra HP.

Wingman with D sounds interesting.

Intimidation doesn't feel like it does enough for the points/opportunity cost on this chassis to me.

I have seen Expert Handling suggested before, occasionally with Advanced Sensors. Speaking of, you say you don't like PtL on them, but combined with Advanced Sensors Bots gain access to a TON of options.

Daredevil grabs my interest the most, allowing them to simulate hard turn + (regular) boost, like the large Interceptors they kind of are.

my biggest concern with brobots atm is how to deal with those tripple Uboats. Could you elaborate on how you think those Epts you are suggesting would improve that match-up?

Huh? you dismiss Push the Limit because you say you shouldn't be stressing, but then suggest Expert Handling, Daredevil which stress you out.

Why do you think Mindlink is good? You need to be able to K turn and S loop with Agressors to beat Aces and the Mindlink just passes that stress around, the focus gain is negligible.

I'm not sure how you think you are getting infinite Sloops by using Wingman either. Wingman doesn't affect yourself. So are you going to keep your 2 88s side by side the whole game?

Intimidation!? wow super lol. You want to stop 50 points worth of ship firing to give out a -1 Agility.

What Drugs are you on PGS?

Brobots actually do pretty well against U-Boats, your boost shifts you forward an entire range band, so it's real easy to jump from out of range 1 turn to range 1 since both lists have large bases that are jousting. When you're at range 1 of the U-Boats, they have to move first the next turn and their white sloops will be blocked.

Expert Handling and Daredevil allow you better move into a position where the stress is less relevant while still gaining the positional advantage they provide. Often I see bad players using PtL when ships are chasing them, and they never end up turning around. The PtL advanced Sensors combo seems nice, but no double HLC.

I fly my Brobots close already, I start every game with a fortress. So I could actually benefit from Wingman a lot.

If you move in a white, red, green order with Mindlink ships it isn't a problem. You just have to fly them such that they don't both have to sloop on the same turn. I use IG-D & B, so D's Super Segnor makes this even easier. It's not very difficult, and it allows me to put a focus token on a ship that has slooped while still benefitting from FCS, which is too good to give up. That focus token saves me/allows me to deal more extra health/damage than a pair of crackshots would.

Brobots often have to block, or it's just beneficial. Do you just not play Brobots or something?

I play Dual 88s. Its one of my favourite lists.

I run B+C with Predator, Mangler, Adv Sensors, Autothrusters. and use the remaining points for some tweaks.

I'd outfly any of the build concepts you've listed here any day of the week.

I just laugh at players using Mindlink on 88s, because they are just so predictable and cause themselves a disadvantage with the thoughts that they are getting a gain.

Daredevil causes you to miss out on your free evade token and stresses you when you could use adv sensors boost and a sharp for much the same in a stress free result.

If you have to fortress to use your cards you lose the advantage of your manoeuvrability. And sure you block, but you can't block an enemy to death, the better option is to outfly your opponent and shoot them to death.

FCS is great on the Phantom, its pretty negligible on the 88s. Its use is almost exclusively in an attempt to joust using HLC and your just going to get outflown by a higher PS ace. Its the current reason the Crackshot build has come about.

Do you just play with players who don't know how to fly? Any practiced U-boats player knows how to set the advance of their ship so that one will always get torps on you in the joust. While you are at range 1 you lose the gunner effect of 88B on your HLC and the U-boat moving first can either block you or sharp to get range 1 turret on you. Authothrusters might help your dice out of arc but you are still losing out at range 1 with 3 attack from the boat to your 3 agility.

I tried Mindlink on Brobots, and it worked well. (I went 2-0 with it.) However, it's not for me because it adds another level of pre-thinking to playing AdvS Brobots, which are already processor-intensive. It basically is too much work for me.

I've also tried Expert Handling and Daredevil. Both are fun, but neither is worth the cost, both in points and in opportunity.

I haven't tried Intimidation, because ... wut?

my biggest concern with brobots atm is how to deal with those tripple Uboats. Could you elaborate on how you think those Epts you are suggesting would improve that match-up?

Huh? you dismiss Push the Limit because you say you shouldn't be stressing, but then suggest Expert Handling, Daredevil which stress you out.

Why do you think Mindlink is good? You need to be able to K turn and S loop with Agressors to beat Aces and the Mindlink just passes that stress around, the focus gain is negligible.

I'm not sure how you think you are getting infinite Sloops by using Wingman either. Wingman doesn't affect yourself. So are you going to keep your 2 88s side by side the whole game?

Intimidation!? wow super lol. You want to stop 50 points worth of ship firing to give out a -1 Agility.

What Drugs are you on PGS?

Brobots actually do pretty well against U-Boats, your boost shifts you forward an entire range band, so it's real easy to jump from out of range 1 turn to range 1 since both lists have large bases that are jousting. When you're at range 1 of the U-Boats, they have to move first the next turn and their white sloops will be blocked.

Expert Handling and Daredevil allow you better move into a position where the stress is less relevant while still gaining the positional advantage they provide. Often I see bad players using PtL when ships are chasing them, and they never end up turning around. The PtL advanced Sensors combo seems nice, but no double HLC.

I fly my Brobots close already, I start every game with a fortress. So I could actually benefit from Wingman a lot.

If you move in a white, red, green order with Mindlink ships it isn't a problem. You just have to fly them such that they don't both have to sloop on the same turn. I use IG-D & B, so D's Super Segnor makes this even easier. It's not very difficult, and it allows me to put a focus token on a ship that has slooped while still benefitting from FCS, which is too good to give up. That focus token saves me/allows me to deal more extra health/damage than a pair of crackshots would.

Brobots often have to block, or it's just beneficial. Do you just not play Brobots or something?

I play Dual 88s. Its one of my favourite lists.

I run B+C with Predator, Mangler, Adv Sensors, Autothrusters. and use the remaining points for some tweaks.

I'd outfly any of the build concepts you've listed here any day of the week.

I just laugh at players using Mindlink on 88s, because they are just so predictable and cause themselves a disadvantage with the thoughts that they are getting a gain.

Daredevil causes you to miss out on your free evade token and stresses you when you could use adv sensors boost and a sharp for much the same in a stress free result.

If you have to fortress to use your cards you lose the advantage of your manoeuvrability. And sure you block, but you can't block an enemy to death, the better option is to outfly your opponent and shoot them to death.

FCS is great on the Phantom, its pretty negligible on the 88s. Its use is almost exclusively in an attempt to joust using HLC and your just going to get outflown by a higher PS ace. Its the current reason the Crackshot build has come about.

Do you just play with players who don't know how to fly? Any practiced U-boats player knows how to set the advance of their ship so that one will always get torps on you in the joust. While you are at range 1 you lose the gunner effect of 88B on your HLC and the U-boat moving first can either block you or sharp to get range 1 turret on you. Authothrusters might help your dice out of arc but you are still losing out at range 1 with 3 attack from the boat to your 3 agility.

Well that's the point, you joust with them. The idea is that the freebie focuses from the Mindlink benefits you as much, if not more than Crackshot and Glitterstim. You stagger them slightly so that they don't have to sloop simultaneously.

FCS is absolutely great on Aggressors. It has HLC gunner lol, of course it's good with FCS. Oh I'm sorry, your combo doesn't have enough points for HLC, only Mangler.

Here is how many of my turns go:

1.) Brobot #1 does D's Super Segnor, giving both a stress.

2.) Brobot #2 does a green maneuver, clearing the stress it just got.

3. Both ships now have a focus token, even after one has slooped. /And I still have FCS/.

Next turn:

4.) Brobot #2 does a (Super) Segnor or K-Turn. It gets a stress token, and Brobot #1 doesn't because it already has one.

5.) Brobot #1 does a green.

6.) Both ships are now focused.

All the while I'm benefitting from the HLC FCS gunner wombo combo, while also still being able to focus when I sloop or bump, as if I had Advanced Sensors.

It works, just don't put yourself in a position where you both need to segnor simultaneously. It's easier when you stagger them a little bit, one can do a K-Turn and the other can move into a blocking position for example.

my biggest concern with brobots atm is how to deal with those tripple Uboats. Could you elaborate on how you think those Epts you are suggesting would improve that match-up?

Huh? you dismiss Push the Limit because you say you shouldn't be stressing, but then suggest Expert Handling, Daredevil which stress you out.

Why do you think Mindlink is good? You need to be able to K turn and S loop with Agressors to beat Aces and the Mindlink just passes that stress around, the focus gain is negligible.

I'm not sure how you think you are getting infinite Sloops by using Wingman either. Wingman doesn't affect yourself. So are you going to keep your 2 88s side by side the whole game?

Intimidation!? wow super lol. You want to stop 50 points worth of ship firing to give out a -1 Agility.

What Drugs are you on PGS?

Brobots actually do pretty well against U-Boats, your boost shifts you forward an entire range band, so it's real easy to jump from out of range 1 turn to range 1 since both lists have large bases that are jousting. When you're at range 1 of the U-Boats, they have to move first the next turn and their white sloops will be blocked.

Expert Handling and Daredevil allow you better move into a position where the stress is less relevant while still gaining the positional advantage they provide. Often I see bad players using PtL when ships are chasing them, and they never end up turning around. The PtL advanced Sensors combo seems nice, but no double HLC.

I fly my Brobots close already, I start every game with a fortress. So I could actually benefit from Wingman a lot.

If you move in a white, red, green order with Mindlink ships it isn't a problem. You just have to fly them such that they don't both have to sloop on the same turn. I use IG-D & B, so D's Super Segnor makes this even easier. It's not very difficult, and it allows me to put a focus token on a ship that has slooped while still benefitting from FCS, which is too good to give up. That focus token saves me/allows me to deal more extra health/damage than a pair of crackshots would.

Brobots often have to block, or it's just beneficial. Do you just not play Brobots or something?

I play Dual 88s. Its one of my favourite lists.

I run B+C with Predator, Mangler, Adv Sensors, Autothrusters. and use the remaining points for some tweaks.

I'd outfly any of the build concepts you've listed here any day of the week.

I just laugh at players using Mindlink on 88s, because they are just so predictable and cause themselves a disadvantage with the thoughts that they are getting a gain.

Daredevil causes you to miss out on your free evade token and stresses you when you could use adv sensors boost and a sharp for much the same in a stress free result.

If you have to fortress to use your cards you lose the advantage of your manoeuvrability. And sure you block, but you can't block an enemy to death, the better option is to outfly your opponent and shoot them to death.

FCS is great on the Phantom, its pretty negligible on the 88s. Its use is almost exclusively in an attempt to joust using HLC and your just going to get outflown by a higher PS ace. Its the current reason the Crackshot build has come about.

Do you just play with players who don't know how to fly? Any practiced U-boats player knows how to set the advance of their ship so that one will always get torps on you in the joust. While you are at range 1 you lose the gunner effect of 88B on your HLC and the U-boat moving first can either block you or sharp to get range 1 turret on you. Authothrusters might help your dice out of arc but you are still losing out at range 1 with 3 attack from the boat to your 3 agility.

I use one of two builds. IG-B & D each with Mindlink, FCS, HLC, Feedback Array, Autothrusters, and IG-2000. The other build has the Feedback Array swapped for Tractor Beams and Inertial Dampeners and then you run the old damage deck. Depends on if I think I'm going to face aces or not.

Well that's the point, you joust with them. The idea is that the freebie focuses from the Mindlink benefits you as much, if not more than Crackshot and Glitterstim. You stagger them slightly so that they don't have to sloop simultaneously.

FCS is absolutely great on Aggressors. It has HLC gunner lol, of course it's good with FCS. Oh I'm sorry, your combo doesn't have enough points for HLC, only Mangler.

Here is how many of my turns go:

1.) Brobot #1 does D's Super Segnor, giving both a stress.

2.) Brobot #2 does a green maneuver, clearing the stress it just got.

3. Both ships now have a focus token, even after one has slooped. /And I still have FCS/.

Next turn:

4.) Brobot #2 does a (Super) Segnor or K-Turn. It gets a stress token, and Brobot #1 doesn't because it already has one.

5.) Brobot #1 does a green.

6.) Both ships are now focused.

All the while I'm benefitting from the HLC FCS gunner wombo combo, while also still being able to focus when I sloop or bump, as if I had Advanced Sensors.

It works, just don't put yourself in a position where you both need to segnor simultaneously. It's easier when you stagger them a little bit, one can do a K-Turn and the other can move into a blocking position for example.

What happens when you need to do K-turns with both?

Or your 88 that needs to focus but can't because its now blocked?

What happens if you are close together and need to move the 88 doing the green first?

All of these things will be used against you.

Oooooh HLC with TL/Focus must be awesome. Its a top tier joke, you engineer the defence to take 1 hit and deny the 88b gunner effect.

The TL you just acquired will be wasted as I dodge you, making you have to attack another different target. FCS has done nothing but waste your points.

Crack shot gets used to change the damage push. They either have to take 2 hits or waste more tokens to guarantee zero hits.

88s are not Dash. The things you mention are fine against the average player, but have so many weaknesses against real players in any top tier environment as to be laughable.

If you want to play that way, good for you, enjoy. Its not for me tho.

I too thought Push the Limit would be ideal for IGs as they have a lot of green and a long action bar. However, I agree it ends up being sub-par, because as a large-base ship with only a forward arc, you need all your maneuvers open to you as much as possible. I too want them to be able to take Juke so bad as it'd be busted with C, but yeah, small ship only.

I played against someone running Wired on their IGs and it seemed to work pretty well for him (he had B and D) which took a lot of the sting out of being stressed.

Push the limit and advanced sensors on aggressors is so very, very far from sub par. Granted they require more thought than the god awful (by which I mean immensely boring) crackshot, FCS, glitterstim build, but PTL + advs is seriously powerful.