Character creation question

By turinmacleod, in WFRP Rules Questions

I have noticed that all my players (6 characters created thus far) are spending less points on stats (rarely going to 5, even on primary stats), and more points on action cards and skills (no one has less than 4 action cards, and most of them go to 3+1 on skills).

My concern is that they are basing their stat boundaries on the wargame, where 4 is a **** good stat, and 5 is unheard of, practically supernatural, and that they will somehow gimp themselves down the road. This concern was reinforced when I compared the characters from the intro game (Envoy, Slayer, Roadwarden and Grey Wizard) to their counterparts in our game.

Anyone else have this happen, or have any feedback on what a good balance is, we are going to start a campaign after the holidays, and I would hate to get off on the wrong foot.

T

The mechanics are totally different, so comparing it to the previous 4/5 numbers is a little off, IMO.

The stats will comprise their core dice pool. Thus the number of dice is very important.

I would say that having a 2 stat is gimping your character in a particular area. For a Trollslayer, having a 2 Fellowship might be fine, but I would presume that you will generally fail any non-easy task with only a 2 stat.

3 is your true average. Having a 3 stat gives you some amount of chance.

When you start getting to a 4 (or a 5) you start stacking the odds in your favor.

However, this is only one part of the equation. Expertise dice are without a doubt, the best way to garner successes/boons. Thus, raw talent (stats) is good but skill is better.

Think about down the road: A player who has a 3 stat but has WS trained 3 times is rolling 6 dice. Their results will be exceptional. Their 'average' stat is complimented by their skill.

IMO, you shouldn't have a problem down the road. A player doesn't gimp themselves by buying the more interesting things at first. I think a good guideline is to raise 4 or 5 stats to 3's. Raise one more stat to a 4. Buy everything else that you like.

I think that most everything balances out over time.

As previously mentioned from worst to best: [W], <B>, [Y], <S>

Stance dice are clearly the "best" for generating successes, however they also carry a cost (either stress/fatigue or delay). Whereas, expertise dice (with righteous success) is only slightly worse and carries no possibility of negative consequence. So by having low characteristics they are limiting their potential stance dice, but most starting character's can't max out their conversions anyway.

The other concern is mechanical. Strength, Agility, and Intelligence flow into damage. Toughness and Willpower are required for resistance, and fellowship is needed for social encounters. But IMHO, most of the shortcoming of stats can be overcome by the appropriate action card, not to mention that actions default to Simple if unopposed.

In summary, I don't necessarily think that the decision on how to spend your CPs is an obvious one.

I will point out, though, that it is much easier to later gain additional action cards with experience advances than it is to increase a stat. For wizards Int determines how easily they cast spells and WP determines their Power equilibrium. Both very important to have high even at start. Similarly, for priests, Fel and WP are important for invoking blessings.

Another thing to keep in mind, is that opposed test difficulties are based on the characteristics. If you're running around with all 2's and 3's in stats, chances are good that enemies will have a 4, meaning a difficult <PPP> test and they have an Easy <P> test against you. Even against average Joes with a 3 stat, the difficulty will be Average <PP> (3 vs 3). That extra challenge die can be huge.