"'It was not the fault of the Dwarves that the friendship waned,' said Gimli.

'I have not heard that it was the fault of the Elves,' said Legolas.

'I have heard both,' said Gandalf; 'and I will not give judgement now. But I beg you two, Legolas and Gimli, at least to be friends, and to help me. I need you both.'"

...you know, I'm sure there's a deep, philosophical lesson about international politics somewhere in there.

The entire LOTR is about WWII, altough Tolkien denied Sauron was Adolf...

But Look at Mordor, that's basically a WWI battlefield. (okay there were no volcanoes on the western front, or fell beast, or- you know what I'm trying to say!)

It would have been interesting if the ground had opened up and swallowed the German army when Adolf killed himself.

It would have been better if it had done so when adolf said: "right boys, let's invade poland!"

"'It was not the fault of the Dwarves that the friendship waned,' said Gimli.

'I have not heard that it was the fault of the Elves,' said Legolas.

'I have heard both,' said Gandalf; 'and I will not give judgement now. But I beg you two, Legolas and Gimli, at least to be friends, and to help me. I need you both.'"

...you know, I'm sure there's a deep, philosophical lesson about international politics somewhere in there.

No worries! The Netherlands and Belgium relatively recently have, after a fallout in the 1830's, put their navies under a joined command so when we substract the ships in repair, patroling the North Sea, sweeping mines of wars long passed, and patroling the caribean we can aid our allies with probably 3 ships and 1 helikopter

He's lying folks, our Belgian navy isn't much. Enough to protect shipping agains pirates. But the dutch actualy have submarines.

Belgian minesweepers are much requested though. Thanks to 100 years of never-ending exersize due to both great wars.

Therefore three ships; 1 is the Belgian minesweeper

As said I do expect other means first.

But when the bill got passed and news reached the small nation, there was a short upheavel of jokes about US invasion.

Would be funnier if it was the other way around: The Netherlands invading Statten Island in order to reclaim New York, or as it was once called, New Amsterdam.

And Belgium could help and invade Florida, capture Baton Rouge and New Orléans (you know, 'cus we speak frensh )

"'It was not the fault of the Dwarves that the friendship waned,' said Gimli.

'I have not heard that it was the fault of the Elves,' said Legolas.

'I have heard both,' said Gandalf; 'and I will not give judgement now. But I beg you two, Legolas and Gimli, at least to be friends, and to help me. I need you both.'"

...you know, I'm sure there's a deep, philosophical lesson about international politics somewhere in there.

The entire LOTR is about WWII, altough Tolkien denied Sauron was Adolf...

But Look at Mordor, that's basically a WWI battlefield. (okay there were no volcanoes on the western front, or fell beast, or- you know what I'm trying to say!)

There's no doubt that Tolkien's experiences in World War I influenced his work, but I think you really have to stretch the text to get it to fit around World War II, specifically. I think Tolkien himself said something to the effect of, "If LotR were about WWII, it would have had the Fellowship following Borimir's plan to take the Ring to Gondor and use it, rather than attempting to destroy it." Also, we know LotR is rather idealized, as he also stated that in real war, "there are orcs on both sides," (and how horribly true that is!)

He's lying folks, our Belgian navy isn't much. Enough to protect shipping agains pirates. But the dutch actualy have submarines.

Indeed! The Walrus-class diesel-electric submarines. Famous for fictively destroying nine ships, including a US aircraft carrier during an exersize.

Belgian minesweepers are much requested though. Thanks to 100 years of never-ending exersize due to both great wars.

Therefore three ships; 1 is the Belgian minesweeper

With luck the eney might get confused and think the Marie-Louise is actually two ships

Atleast Belgium has a somewhat descent airforce.

So.... the UK....it left us.... now we citizens of small nations are left to talk about ourselves....

Wait....What?

Boris bails out of the race for prime-minister?

I'm not suggesting it leads directly to war. I am suggesting that it might well lead to the further rise of the far right, further divisions between the member states, etc etc etc.

It's a tough thing to discuss, because it makes you sound paranoid and godwinny when you compare things to Hitler, but... there are disturbing parallels between the political and economic situations in Europe in the twenties and thirties and today, and to the rise of right-wing thinking, the rise of hate speech and persecution of minorities, the denigration of intellectuals and experts, and the rise of elitist politicians leading to an isolated political class and the majority searching for an alternative voice which is being provided by the right because the politicians are also rightist so they're more interested in quashing the left than the further right.

It's really, really worrying; that's what's scaring me more than any economic consequences of the decision. That ten years from now I'll be living in V For Vendetta.

Well, I doubt it's as bad as all that. If it is, however, I wonder if this is a lead in to the events described in Revelation, or merely another speed bump along our way there...

Obama already had his seven years and according to republicans he's the antichrist, so I think we are safe.

According to which Republicans? This one never thought that (and neither did any of the others with whom I regularly converse).

year

Oh, please.

Sorry, I should have said: Well then, we're all VERY lucky that the rest of your party-mates are as reasonable as you, because the Republican party have done NOTHING to vilify him in the last 7 years.

guessing these were mostly democrats?

(Actually, most likely they were just NUTS...)

because the Republican party have done NOTHING to vilify him in the last 7 years.

Saddly, vilifying the president has become major part of american culture lately. It doesn't matter who the president is, the other side will vilify him or her.

With which ever side doing it, believing they are completely justified in doing so. Yet all they really accomplish is set up the next person to be as big if not bigger target in the name of 'getting even'.

So.... the UK....it left us.... now we citizens of small nations are left to talk about ourselves....

Wait....What?

Boris bails out of the race for prime-minister?

Eeee-yup! Not even surprised at this point. He's stupid but not that stupid.

The way I see it Britain has been united by the brexit:

Remain: What did you do? Now what will we do?

Leave: Dafuq did we do? Now what will we do?

Nobody has a clue what to do.

Except that Scotish lady. She might have what it takes to fix this.

I actually want to expound on what I said above...

I remember people in the media referring to Pres Bush as just Bush, and the same goes for Pres Obama. It seems to me, that he was always referred to as Pres Clinton however... I mean some people may of used some nick names... But the media by and large used his title, at least that's how I remember it.

I don't care what you think about a given President's policies or plans, they at the least deserve the respect due the office, but that seems to be something we've lost.

Likely it all started with Nixon, and the Vietnam war. But it has gotten to the point in which party has become more important than anything else, and even if one side makes a fairly reasonable suggestion, the kneejerk reaction by the other party is to say no. And to be completely clear, that's true of both parties in the US right now, the only difference is which party is in control.

Even the fact that the US has a law on the books to invade not just a friendly country and trusted ally, but one that was instrumental in it gaining its independence, is dumbfounding and characteristic of a country that is used to gunboat diplomacy and getting their way.

All because they're afraid of allowing other people judge USAians of war crimes.

I actually want to expound on what I said above...

I remember people in the media referring to Pres Bush as just Bush, and the same goes for Pres Obama. It seems to me, that he was always referred to as Pres Clinton however... I mean some people may of used some nick names... But the media by and large used his title, at least that's how I remember it.

I don't care what you think about a given President's policies or plans, they at the least deserve the respect due the office, but that seems to be something we've lost.

Likely it all started with Nixon, and the Vietnam war. But it has gotten to the point in which party has become more important than anything else, and even if one side makes a fairly reasonable suggestion, the kneejerk reaction by the other party is to say no. And to be completely clear, that's true of both parties in the US right now, the only difference is which party is in control.

That two party system is what's bad. There's no down side to mudslinging at your opponent. If you have multiple parties and you spend all your time going: "candiate A is bad" and "candidate B is bad", there's a good chance candidate C wins because nobody focused on him/her and candidates A and B made each other out to be complete idiots. A third dog runs away with the bone type of scenario if you will.

I'm not suggesting it leads directly to war. I am suggesting that it might well lead to the further rise of the far right, further divisions between the member states, etc etc etc.

It's a tough thing to discuss, because it makes you sound paranoid and godwinny when you compare things to Hitler, but... there are disturbing parallels between the political and economic situations in Europe in the twenties and thirties and today, and to the rise of right-wing thinking, the rise of hate speech and persecution of minorities, the denigration of intellectuals and experts, and the rise of elitist politicians leading to an isolated political class and the majority searching for an alternative voice which is being provided by the right because the politicians are also rightist so they're more interested in quashing the left than the further right.

It's really, really worrying; that's what's scaring me more than any economic consequences of the decision. That ten years from now I'll be living in V For Vendetta.

Well, I doubt it's as bad as all that. If it is, however, I wonder if this is a lead in to the events described in Revelation, or merely another speed bump along our way there...

Obama already had his seven years and according to republicans he's the antichrist, so I think we are safe.

According to which Republicans? This one never thought that (and neither did any of the others with whom I regularly converse).

Fox news, rush Limbaugh and all talk radio, every major republican website...No one major.

I mean no one compared the president to the devil when that bible show had an actor who looked like him, oh no wait everyone did.

And not for a few days either it was weeks.

So.... the UK....it left us.... now we citizens of small nations are left to talk about ourselves....

Wait....What?

Boris bails out of the race for prime-minister?

Eeee-yup! Not even surprised at this point. He's stupid but not that stupid.

The way I see it Britain has been united by the brexit:

Remain: What did you do? Now what will we do?

Leave: Dafuq did we do? Now what will we do?

Nobody has a clue what to do.

Except that Scotish lady. She might have what it takes to fix this.

Nah, she can't. She's just using it to leverage an independence. But I doubt they could leave the UK and move straight into the EU, that would take years, if they are even moved to the front of the line. And the greatest portion by far of the Scottish trade is with the rest of the UK.

Even the fact that the US has a law on the books to invade not just a friendly country and trusted ally, but one that was instrumental in it gaining its independence, is dumbfounding and characteristic of a country that is used to gunboat diplomacy and getting their way.

All because they're afraid of allowing other people judge USAians of war crimes.

Keep your friends close...

guessing these were mostly democrats?

(Actually, most likely they were just NUTS...)

"While 20% of Republicans [polled?] believed Obama is the antichrist heralding the End Times, only 13% of independents did and just 6% of Democrats."

Assuming the poll was representative of the entire population (who knows, maybe people who hold such beliefs may be more likely to volunteer information for a poll), I still have two questions to ask:

1. 20% believing vs 80% not believing...which is more indicative of the party as a whole?

2. A not-wholly-insignificant percentage of Independents and Democrats believed the same thing, so why single out the small subset of Republicans?

I understand the whole thing was meant as a joke, and I can understand generalizing on views that are actually representative of most of the party (e.g. "Republicans oppose gun control." Maybe not 100% of them do, but the vast majority seem to align with this statement, so the dissenters would be the exception rather than the rule). However, to generalize by taking a fringe view and attributing it to the whole population is not only a bit insulting, but also significantly undermines whatever joke was being made (unless it was intended as satire, but that can be really tough to pull off on a message board).

So.... the UK....it left us.... now we citizens of small nations are left to talk about ourselves....

Wait....What?

Boris bails out of the race for prime-minister?

Eeee-yup! Not even surprised at this point. He's stupid but not that stupid.

The way I see it Britain has been united by the brexit:

Remain: What did you do? Now what will we do?

Leave: Dafuq did we do? Now what will we do?

Nobody has a clue what to do.

Except that Scotish lady. She might have what it takes to fix this.

Nah, she can't. She's just using it to leverage an independence. But I doubt they could leave the UK and move straight into the EU, that would take years, if they are even moved to the front of the line. And the greatest portion by far of the Scottish trade is with the rest of the UK.

I also heard something about ruleslawyering so scotland could stop the brexit by voting against it or something.

Best thing would be to just not go trough with the brexit, make a big show about how it's actualy about the need for european reforms and keep buisness as usuall.

Ofcourse that asshat of my PM has to go all "Britain can leave now and they should get on with it!" I swear the retards we got for goverment in Belgium...

I mean, who wants a coastal city that sits below sea level?! (No offense, Amsterdam!)

Hey, at least we know how to protect our cities against water. Our dikes are built to last a thousand years or more. The last large flood we had came on the heels of WW2 and before that in the 1500s.

?

I also heard something about ruleslawyering so scotland could stop the brexit by voting against it or something.

Best thing would be to just not go trough with the brexit, make a big show about how it's actualy about the need for european reforms and keep buisness as usuall.

Even if she could, it would only be for a very short while, until the relevant part is rewritten. Not going through would be as much of a big mistake. The UK will be made to pay, and pay again, whether they leave or not. Better to leave and pull others with them so the EU can't act too harshly.

So.... the UK....it left us.... now we citizens of small nations are left to talk about ourselves....

Wait....What?

Boris bails out of the race for prime-minister?

Eeee-yup! Not even surprised at this point. He's stupid but not that stupid.

The way I see it Britain has been united by the brexit:

Remain: What did you do? Now what will we do?

Leave: Dafuq did we do? Now what will we do?

Nobody has a clue what to do.

Except that Scotish lady. She might have what it takes to fix this.

Nah, she can't. She's just using it to leverage an independence. But I doubt they could leave the UK and move straight into the EU, that would take years, if they are even moved to the front of the line. And the greatest portion by far of the Scottish trade is with the rest of the UK.

I also heard something about ruleslawyering so scotland could stop the brexit by voting against it or something.

Best thing would be to just not go trough with the brexit, make a big show about how it's actualy about the need for european reforms and keep buisness as usuall.

Ofcourse that asshat of my PM has to go all "Britain can leave now and they should get on with it!" I swear the retards we got for goverment in Belgium...

What makes you think that's unique to Belgium?

I mean, who wants a coastal city that sits below sea level?! (No offense, Amsterdam!)

Hey, at least we know how to protect our cities against water. Our dikes are built to last a thousand years or more. The last large flood we had came on the heels of WW2 and before that in the 1500s.

Yeah, we really should have kept the warranty on those levees...

I actually want to expound on what I said above...

I remember people in the media referring to Pres Bush as just Bush, and the same goes for Pres Obama. It seems to me, that he was always referred to as Pres Clinton however... I mean some people may of used some nick names... But the media by and large used his title, at least that's how I remember it.

I don't care what you think about a given President's policies or plans, they at the least deserve the respect due the office, but that seems to be something we've lost.

Likely it all started with Nixon, and the Vietnam war. But it has gotten to the point in which party has become more important than anything else, and even if one side makes a fairly reasonable suggestion, the kneejerk reaction by the other party is to say no. And to be completely clear, that's true of both parties in the US right now, the only difference is which party is in control.

Couldn't disagree more. People don't deserve respect just for acheieving political office. Also, referring to someone by title suggests more than respect to me, it smacks of deference.

So.... the UK....it left us.... now we citizens of small nations are left to talk about ourselves....

Wait....What?

Boris bails out of the race for prime-minister?

Eeee-yup! Not even surprised at this point. He's stupid but not that stupid.

The way I see it Britain has been united by the brexit:

Remain: What did you do? Now what will we do?

Leave: Dafuq did we do? Now what will we do?

Nobody has a clue what to do.

Except that Scotish lady. She might have what it takes to fix this.

Nah, she can't. She's just using it to leverage an independence. But I doubt they could leave the UK and move straight into the EU, that would take years, if they are even moved to the front of the line. And the greatest portion by far of the Scottish trade is with the rest of the UK.

I also heard something about ruleslawyering so scotland could stop the brexit by voting against it or something.

Best thing would be to just not go trough with the brexit, make a big show about how it's actualy about the need for european reforms and keep buisness as usuall.

Ofcourse that asshat of my PM has to go all "Britain can leave now and they should get on with it!" I swear the retards we got for goverment in Belgium...

What makes you think that's unique to Belgium?

It isn't. But When charles-michel (that's our PM) does it it really pissess me off! That whole "I'm the lord of europe and the brits dissed us, so now we're gonna harras them to leave quickly" is something I expected from those martinets of junker and hollande, not him! Hes the youngest PM inour history, still wet behind his ears and he's gonna start telling people who's boss, while the brits are trying to backpedal out of the mess they made? Not when I can get my hands on him.

So.... the UK....it left us.... now we citizens of small nations are left to talk about ourselves....

Wait....What?

Boris bails out of the race for prime-minister?

Eeee-yup! Not even surprised at this point. He's stupid but not that stupid.

The way I see it Britain has been united by the brexit:

Remain: What did you do? Now what will we do?

Leave: Dafuq did we do? Now what will we do?

Nobody has a clue what to do.

Except that Scotish lady. She might have what it takes to fix this.

Nah, she can't. She's just using it to leverage an independence. But I doubt they could leave the UK and move straight into the EU, that would take years, if they are even moved to the front of the line. And the greatest portion by far of the Scottish trade is with the rest of the UK.

I also heard something about ruleslawyering so scotland could stop the brexit by voting against it or something.

Best thing would be to just not go trough with the brexit, make a big show about how it's actualy about the need for european reforms and keep buisness as usuall.

Ofcourse that asshat of my PM has to go all "Britain can leave now and they should get on with it!" I swear the retards we got for goverment in Belgium...

What makes you think that's unique to Belgium?

I mean, who wants a coastal city that sits below sea level?! (No offense, Amsterdam!)

Hey, at least we know how to protect our cities against water. Our dikes are built to last a thousand years or more. The last large flood we had came on the heels of WW2 and before that in the 1500s.

Yeah, we really should have kept the warranty on those levees...

A few concrete walls, whoever thought that would be enough should be made to drink the floods.

The average dike here is a wall made of dirt and rocks, covered with grass and a road on top wide enough for a few car lanes.

The main one is 300 feet wide at the top, with a highway. During WW2 heavy fighting, including artillery, occured without seriously damaging it. .

Even if she could, it would only be for a very short while, until the relevant part is rewritten. Not going through would be as much of a big mistake. The UK will be made to pay, and pay again, whether they leave or not. Better to leave and pull others with them so the EU can't act too harshly.

Maybe we (the Benelux) should get out to.

I actually want to expound on what I said above...

I remember people in the media referring to Pres Bush as just Bush, and the same goes for Pres Obama. It seems to me, that he was always referred to as Pres Clinton however... I mean some people may of used some nick names... But the media by and large used his title, at least that's how I remember it.

I don't care what you think about a given President's policies or plans, they at the least deserve the respect due the office, but that seems to be something we've lost.

Likely it all started with Nixon, and the Vietnam war. But it has gotten to the point in which party has become more important than anything else, and even if one side makes a fairly reasonable suggestion, the kneejerk reaction by the other party is to say no. And to be completely clear, that's true of both parties in the US right now, the only difference is which party is in control.

Couldn't disagree more. People don't deserve respect just for acheieving political office. Also, referring to someone by title suggests more than respect to me, it smacks of deference.

You say that as if deference is a bad thing.