You forgot Saxon, Gadge. It's a but of a moot point really, because if you look back far enough, we ALL share a common heritage.
Unless of course you believe in the Ancient Astronaut, that is.
Edited by FTS GeckoDecision time for the United Kingdom tomorrow.
Britiain is a nation of migrants.
Only the right wing morons dont get that. Essentially they are all a mix of roman, danish, norman, french, german etc etc
Billy Connolly, one of Scotland's most famous 'white' comedians and as Scottish as Scottish gets has Indian grandparentage!
This is the thing that always bugged me. Unless your ancestry is pure Celt (which is something VERY few people can say) you are an immigrant, and even the Celts walked here across a land bridge from Europe.
The rise of casual racism is the thing that worries me most. It smacks desperately concerningly of the rise of nazism in the '30s in Germany. The parallels at all levels of UK society are really, really scary, as is the fact that comparisons to the rise of nazism are no longer a way to joke about the end of arguments, but an actual legitimate argument to make about the likes of Farage and Trump.
You forgot Saxon, Gadge. It's a but of a moot point really, because if you look back far enough, we ALL share a common heritage.
Unless of course you believe in the Ancient Astronaut, that is.
Its a shame we so rarely do look back that far, it would make the world a less hostile place. I find it truly amazing to see how our species conquered the remotest corners of the planet from Africa, ever adapting on the way.
Forgive my ignorance on this matter, but could someone please answer a couple questions for me:
What benefit do people think would come from leaving?
What benefit do people think would come from staying?
If possible, I would appreciate something a little more specific than, "the economy will be bad."
This forum doesn't seem very representative of the UK population does it? the only leave voice I recall reading is a complete anti-government anarchist.
This may sound snobby, but I wonder if it's because X-Wing is quite an expensive hobby, and it was mostly the least affluent in the country who voted leave. I could sound even snobbier and say X-Wing requires a brain...
All those Polish guys who you want to go home? Well first off their grandparents probably settled here after helping fight the battle of Britain. Otherwise... well didn't we go to war with Germany over them being invaded? That's gotta count for something.
That is too easy. I don't know the numbers for the UK, but here in the Netherlands the number of Polish people have exploded in the past ten years from 30.000 to 150.000, most of those being employed at a very low wage, far lower than the minimum here, thanks to some accounting trickery, and housed in terrible circumstances that are inadequately addressed by our government.
One effect is that local people are forced out of their jobs because they are too expensive. Cost of living here is too high to be able to survive on such a low wage (and that is not how we want to run our society, with people working multiple jobs to survive). So they are at home, disregarded and disgruntled, bored and unemployable.
Another effect is that the mistreated Polish employees tend to drink a lot and cause trouble.
Another wonderful effect of Schengen is that here in the Netherlands, and in Germany as well, Eastern European groups roam across the country shoplifting, pickpocketing and blowing up ATMs. Then they get sent back to where they came from, only to return a week later.
And of course the fraud, signing up for subsidies and abusing the social security network through loopholes.
Whereas locals have to wait years to become eligible to rent a house, the average wait for a house if you can't get a mortgage is about 8 years countrywide. Thanks to the EU though, refugees have to get priority and are assigned houses straightaway.
The EU has also interfered in the housing market by decreeing wage limits, if you make more than 33.000 you can't rent what's called social housing and you have to rent in the free sector or buy a house. But you won't get a mortgage that can buy you a house at that wage and the free sector will take up 50% or more of your income.
So what you get is a large group of people with lower incomes unable to find employment, pushed out by foreigners, suddenly confronted with people not really interested in becoming part of the community or learning the language and not having to, thanks to European rules. And the politicians ignoring those people, calling them ignorant, racist, not taking them seriously.
That is why, over the past few days, here the debate has raged in parliament that the EU does need to be restructured. Suddenly they've seen how much anger and resentment there is.
Yes, a lot of racists have now crawled from out under their rocks, but I'm willing to bet that a lot of it is venting anger that's not necessarily caused by the immigrants.
Of course, now you get the push to ignore the referendum and vote it down in parliament. Such an arrogant move would be playing with matches in a gunpowder factory located in the middle of a lake of gasoline.
Britiain is a nation of migrants.
Only the right wing morons dont get that. Essentially they are all a mix of roman, danish, norman, french, german etc etc
Yeah, but nobody goes back a thousand years or more, and the only people who seem obsessed with knowing where their great-great grandparents were born are, in my experience, USAians.
After a generation or three, four, you cease to be an immigrant.
Forgive my ignorance on this matter, but could someone please answer a couple questions for me:
What benefit do people think would come from leaving?
What benefit do people think would come from staying?
If possible, I would appreciate something a little more specific than, "the economy will be bad."
Since staying would simply be the status quo, I'll answer in the form of what both parties thought would happen in the event of leaving:
- Leavers thought it would let them stop dirty foreigners entering the country and stealing their jobs by working harder than they do (and yes, by working for less money, which is a fair point given the UK has higher wages than many EU countries).
- Leavers thought it would save us money because the money we pay into the EU (which is in part a pooling of resources to help everybody and part redistribution from rich to poor, both good things in my book) could be spent on the NHS (National Health Service - our socialised healthcare).
- Leavers thought there'd be a bonfire of red tape (the red tape imposed by the EU)
- Remainers thought it would mean we'd send the same amount of money to the EU and obey the same red tape, but without have a vote on the rules
- Remainers thought it would mean multinationals move their HQs out of the UK
- Remainers thought it would mean the breakup of the UK as Scotland leaves in order to remain in the EU
- Remainers thought it would leave England with perpetual Tory governments, resulting in the destruction of human rights and the welfare state
- Remainers thought it would mean what's left of the UK scrapping any pretence at green policies
- Remainers thought it would be symbolic of a Britain turning it's back on progressive politics, on co-operation with friends, and towards nationalism, xenophobia and racism.
This forum doesn't seem very representative of the UK population does it? the only leave voice I recall reading is a complete anti-government anarchist.
This may sound snobby, but I wonder if it's because X-Wing is quite an expensive hobby, and it was mostly the least affluent in the country who voted leave. I could sound even snobbier and say X-Wing requires a brain...
- Remainers thought it would mean multinationals move their HQs out of europe
Out of the UK perhaps, but they'll just move to a different part of Europe.
And not just the HQ's though. A lot of production plants might well be transferred, just to make it easier to operate in the EU.
See for instance:
- Remainers thought it would mean multinationals move their HQs out of europe
Out of the UK perhaps, but they'll just move to a different part of Europe.
Sorry, typo - edited.
Edited by mazz0And not just the HQ's though. A lot of production plants might well be transferred, just to make it easier to operate in the EU.
Ah yes, there's that too.
Forgive my ignorance on this matter, but could someone please answer a couple questions for me:
What benefit do people think would come from leaving?
What benefit do people think would come from staying?
If possible, I would appreciate something a little more specific than, "the economy will be bad."
Since staying would simply be the status quo, I'll answer in the form of what both parties thought would happen in the event of leaving:
- Leavers thought it would let them stop dirty foreigners entering the country and stealing their jobs by working harder than they do (and yes, by working for less money, which is a fair point given the UK has higher wages than many EU countries).
- Leavers thought it would save us money because the money we pay into the EU (which is in part a pooling of resources to help everybody and part redistribution from rich to poor, both good things in my book) could be spent on the NHS (National Health Service - our socialised healthcare).
- Leavers thought there'd be a bonfire of red tape (the red tape imposed by the EU)
- Remainers thought it would mean we'd send the same amount of money to the EU and obey the same red tape, but without have a vote on the rules
- Remainers thought it would mean multinationals move their HQs out of the UK
- Remainers thought it would mean the breakup of the UK as Scotland leaves in order to remain in the EU
- Remainers thought it would leave England with perpetual Tory governments, resulting in the destruction of human rights and the welfare state
- Remainers thought it would mean what's left of the UK scrapping any pretence at green policies
- Remainers thought it would be symbolic of a Britain turning it's back on progressive politics, on co-operation with friends, and towards nationalism, xenophobia and racism.
The big thing though is that should remain have won they didnt really need a 'plan', we would just continue to enjoy the most prosperous and safe period of european history since WWII. Most people wanted to fix any inequalities from within the system or accept that in a truly 'fair deal' both sides often feel hard done by.
In contrast the leave campaign was largely shackled to jingoism and lies that we would be 'free' (we're not we just no longer have a say in things for along time to come), that we'd have a better ecomomy (well its currently tanking and effecting the rest of the world with it) and that we could have tighter borders (we wont because the 'crossing over points' between Britain and EU member states will only be policed by us now...
So its a lose lose 'win' for 'leave'.
As an added bonus Britain is currently looking like Munich circa 1923 with the far right feeling 'britain is behind them' and attacking people who 'look foreign' in the street.
Here a disgusting verbal attack on an American citzen by a mindless english yob... he's too stupid to realise that America has *nothing* to do with the EU!
Forgive my ignorance on this matter, but could someone please answer a couple questions for me:
What benefit do people think would come from leaving?
What benefit do people think would come from staying?
If possible, I would appreciate something a little more specific than, "the economy will be bad."
Since staying would simply be the status quo, I'll answer in the form of what both parties thought would happen in the event of leaving:
- Leavers thought it would let them stop dirty foreigners entering the country and stealing their jobs by working harder than they do (and yes, by working for less money, which is a fair point given the UK has higher wages than many EU countries).
- Leavers thought it would save us money because the money we pay into the EU (which is in part a pooling of resources to help everybody and part redistribution from rich to poor, both good things in my book) could be spent on the NHS (National Health Service - our socialised healthcare).
- Leavers thought there'd be a bonfire of red tape (the red tape imposed by the EU)
- Remainers thought it would mean we'd send the same amount of money to the EU and obey the same red tape, but without have a vote on the rules
- Remainers thought it would mean multinationals move their HQs out of the UK
- Remainers thought it would mean the breakup of the UK as Scotland leaves in order to remain in the EU
- Remainers thought it would leave England with perpetual Tory governments, resulting in the destruction of human rights and the welfare state
- Remainers thought it would mean what's left of the UK scrapping any pretence at green policies
- Remainers thought it would be symbolic of a Britain turning it's back on progressive politics, on co-operation with friends, and towards nationalism, xenophobia and racism.
The big thing though is that should remain have won they didnt really need a 'plan', we would just continue to enjoy the most prosperous and safe period of european history since WWII. Most people wanted to fix any inequalities from within the system or accept that in a truly 'fair deal' both sides often feel hard done by.
In contrast the leave campaign was largely shackled to jingoism and lies that we would be 'free' (we're not we just no longer have a say in things for along time to come), that we'd have a better ecomomy (well its currently tanking and effecting the rest of the world with it) and that we could have tighter borders (we wont because the 'crossing over points' between Britain and EU member states will only be policed by us now...
So its a lose lose 'win' for 'leave'.
As an added bonus Britain is currently looking like Munich circa 1923 with the far right feeling 'britain is behind them' and attacking people who 'look foreign' in the street.
Here a disgusting verbal attack on an American citzen by a mindless english yob... he's too stupid to realise that America has *nothing* to do with the EU!
I wish I had a real life HK-47...
I've read that the vote was split on both age and wealth.. Yet the ballot itself doesn't seem to record any of that information (see below). How do they know the age and wealth of those who voted? Anyone from UK care to elaborate? Did the ballots identify the voters in some way?
Forgive my ignorance on this matter, but could someone please answer a couple questions for me:
What benefit do people think would come from leaving?
What benefit do people think would come from staying?
If possible, I would appreciate something a little more specific than, "the economy will be bad."
Since staying would simply be the status quo, I'll answer in the form of what both parties thought would happen in the event of leaving:
- Leavers thought it would let them stop dirty foreigners entering the country and stealing their jobs by working harder than they do (and yes, by working for less money, which is a fair point given the UK has higher wages than many EU countries).
- Leavers thought it would save us money because the money we pay into the EU (which is in part a pooling of resources to help everybody and part redistribution from rich to poor, both good things in my book) could be spent on the NHS (National Health Service - our socialised healthcare).
- Leavers thought there'd be a bonfire of red tape (the red tape imposed by the EU)
- Remainers thought it would mean we'd send the same amount of money to the EU and obey the same red tape, but without have a vote on the rules
- Remainers thought it would mean multinationals move their HQs out of the UK
- Remainers thought it would mean the breakup of the UK as Scotland leaves in order to remain in the EU
- Remainers thought it would leave England with perpetual Tory governments, resulting in the destruction of human rights and the welfare state
- Remainers thought it would mean what's left of the UK scrapping any pretence at green policies
- Remainers thought it would be symbolic of a Britain turning it's back on progressive politics, on co-operation with friends, and towards nationalism, xenophobia and racism.
The big thing though is that should remain have won they didnt really need a 'plan', we would just continue to enjoy the most prosperous and safe period of european history since WWII. Most people wanted to fix any inequalities from within the system or accept that in a truly 'fair deal' both sides often feel hard done by.
In contrast the leave campaign was largely shackled to jingoism and lies that we would be 'free' (we're not we just no longer have a say in things for along time to come), that we'd have a better ecomomy (well its currently tanking and effecting the rest of the world with it) and that we could have tighter borders (we wont because the 'crossing over points' between Britain and EU member states will only be policed by us now...
So its a lose lose 'win' for 'leave'.
As an added bonus Britain is currently looking like Munich circa 1923 with the far right feeling 'britain is behind them' and attacking people who 'look foreign' in the street.
Here a disgusting verbal attack on an American citzen by a mindless english yob... he's too stupid to realise that America has *nothing* to do with the EU!
I wish I had a real life HK-47...
what on earth for?
I've read that the vote was split on both age and wealth.. Yet the ballot itself doesn't seem to record any of that information (see below). How do they know the age and wealth of those who voted? Anyone from UK care to elaborate? Did the ballots identify the voters in some way?
Polling.
Forgive my ignorance on this matter, but could someone please answer a couple questions for me:
What benefit do people think would come from leaving?
What benefit do people think would come from staying?
If possible, I would appreciate something a little more specific than, "the economy will be bad."
Since staying would simply be the status quo, I'll answer in the form of what both parties thought would happen in the event of leaving:
- Leavers thought it would let them stop dirty foreigners entering the country and stealing their jobs by working harder than they do (and yes, by working for less money, which is a fair point given the UK has higher wages than many EU countries).
- Leavers thought it would save us money because the money we pay into the EU (which is in part a pooling of resources to help everybody and part redistribution from rich to poor, both good things in my book) could be spent on the NHS (National Health Service - our socialised healthcare).
- Leavers thought there'd be a bonfire of red tape (the red tape imposed by the EU)
- Remainers thought it would mean we'd send the same amount of money to the EU and obey the same red tape, but without have a vote on the rules
- Remainers thought it would mean multinationals move their HQs out of the UK
- Remainers thought it would mean the breakup of the UK as Scotland leaves in order to remain in the EU
- Remainers thought it would leave England with perpetual Tory governments, resulting in the destruction of human rights and the welfare state
- Remainers thought it would mean what's left of the UK scrapping any pretence at green policies
- Remainers thought it would be symbolic of a Britain turning it's back on progressive politics, on co-operation with friends, and towards nationalism, xenophobia and racism.
The big thing though is that should remain have won they didnt really need a 'plan', we would just continue to enjoy the most prosperous and safe period of european history since WWII. Most people wanted to fix any inequalities from within the system or accept that in a truly 'fair deal' both sides often feel hard done by.
In contrast the leave campaign was largely shackled to jingoism and lies that we would be 'free' (we're not we just no longer have a say in things for along time to come), that we'd have a better ecomomy (well its currently tanking and effecting the rest of the world with it) and that we could have tighter borders (we wont because the 'crossing over points' between Britain and EU member states will only be policed by us now...
So its a lose lose 'win' for 'leave'.
As an added bonus Britain is currently looking like Munich circa 1923 with the far right feeling 'britain is behind them' and attacking people who 'look foreign' in the street.
Here a disgusting verbal attack on an American citzen by a mindless english yob... he's too stupid to realise that America has *nothing* to do with the EU!
I wish I had a real life HK-47...
what on earth for?
So I could say to him "go forth and do as I say!", to which he would reply with something amazingly crude and insulting, then he would go and terminate those obnoxious meatbags on the tram (well, he'd want to, but I'd order him just to forcefully hand them over to the police).
Having your own HK-47 would be positively priceless!
And not just the HQ's though. A lot of production plants might well be transferred, just to make it easier to operate in the EU.
Ah yes, there's that too.
Tata steel in Wales has already put their operation up for sale back in march, but they've also today announced a further investment of a couple hundred million on their Dutch operations.
So that's 6.600 jobs in the balance if they can't find buyers there.
Toyota and Honda are very likely to pack up and leave, that's another 10, 12.000 jobs.
They're not going to wait two or three years of debating who will invoke Article 50 and the resulting negotiations to see what the result will be.
There will be no talks until the UK has invoked 50. And until they do, they've been completely sidelined in the EU.
And Jeremy Corbyn has just been kicked to the curb so the UK opposition is leaderless as well.
Right im off to an anti racism rally in the city now.
I have a feeling it might 'kick off' so i've got a stab vest under my hoody and a ressie in my daysack.
Call me paranoid but i've been in a riot or two already and i'd rather have them and not need them then need them and not have them.
Hopefully it will be a peaceful protest
Take care, stay safe and wtf is a ressie?
Take care, stay safe and wtf is a ressie?
A ressie - a resurrection potion. Like a Pheonix Down in Final Fantasy.
Right?
Right on. I just was making sure you were being consistent in your desire to use violence against people who disagree with your opinion.
Or rather ....have robots and police use violence against people for disagreeing your opinion.
But really there is no fundamental difference between the two other than one let's you pretend your hands are clean.
Right on. I just was making sure you were being consistent in your desire to use violence against people who disagree with your opinion.
Or rather ....have robots and police use violence against people for disagreeing your opinion.
But really there is no fundamental difference between the two other than one let's you pretend your hands are clean.
Nonsense, it's nothing to do with pretending my hands are clean; it's about keeping my life safe and easy; HK47 does all the work and takes all the risk.
Right on. I just was making sure you were being consistent in your desire to use violence against people who disagree with your opinion.
Or rather ....have robots and police use violence against people for disagreeing your opinion.
But really there is no fundamental difference between the two other than one let's you pretend your hands are clean.