Question: Can the "suffer damage effect" from using the Darth Vader crew upgrade be absorbed by the discard function of an Integrated Astromech? It seems clear to me from the wording below that the answer is "NO," but a good friend of mine thinks otherwise. Any thoughts...?

Rules Reference p. 9 - Damage:
If an effect instructs a player to deal a Damage card to a ship, this is different from the ship suffering damage. The card is dealt to the ship regardless of whether the ship has any shield tokens remaining.

FAQ p. 13 - IA Upgrade Card:
When you are dealt a Damage card, you may discard 1 of your {astromech} Upgrade cards to discard that Damage card (without resolving its effect).

FAQ p. 12 Darth Vader Upgrade Card:
After you perform an attack against an enemy ship, you may suffer 2 damage to cause that ship to suffer 1 critical damage.

So if the the ship that suffers critical damage from Vader has no shields, what happens?

It is dealt a (face-up) damage card.

When does integrated astromech trigger?

when the ship is dealt a damage card (either face up of face down)

So the answer is both yes and no - IA won't trigger if Vader's critical damage is absorbed by shields (because no damage card is dealt) - if Vader's critical damage is not absorbed by shields and results in a damage card being dealt then you can trigger it

You can toss the Integrated Astromech to avoid Darth Vader's crit.

Your ship is suffering one critical damage (so it should, it's a terrorist ship) and being dealt a face-up damage card. That triggers the Integrated Astromech's effect.

The FAQs regarding the difference between being dealt a damage card and suffering damage were the result of people getting confused about how Vader's ability worked.

A lot of people assumed the "suffer 1 critical damage" implied that the damage would bypass shields.

This is not the case - Critical damage is always applied the same way as any other damage - shields first - then hull.

In contrast an instruction to deal a damage card will ignore the presence of shields.

So while the instruction to deal critical damage can result in a damage card being dealt - it is not the same thing as an instruction to deal a damage card.

make sense?

Thanks for the quick turn-around on answering!

But to help me/us fully understand, let's apply this to our actual dogfight last week:

- Biggs loses both shields, and is attacked on the next turn by Deci-Vader.

- Vader causes Biggs to "SUFFER" 1 critical damage.

Even though the Rules Reference says that "SUFFERING" damage is NOT the same as being "DEALT" a damage card, the IA trigger of being "DEALT a damage card" somehow still triggers when Biggs' "SUFFERS" damage from Vader..??

Could you help understand how that is? -- thx again!

To add even more detail:

"Deal a damage card" is the action of putting the damage card on the ship.

There is currently two way to be Dealt a damage card.

1 - When you have no more shield, and you suffer damage.

2 - When a card directly instruct it.

Deal a damage card action bypass by default shield. but in the first case you already have no shield.

Even though the Rules Reference says that "SUFFERING" damage is NOT the same as being "DEALT" a damage card, the IA trigger of being "DEALT a damage card" somehow still triggers when Biggs' "SUFFERS" damage from Vader..??

Could you help understand how that is? -- thx again!

They are not the same but suffer end up as dealt when no more shield, see my previous post.

It would be the same thing as:

Go buy something

Take possession of something

They are not the same action first, but with the Go buy you still Take possession after the act.

Thanks for the quick turn-around on answering!

But to help me/us fully understand, let's apply this to our actual dogfight last week:

- Biggs loses both shields, and is attacked on the next turn by Deci-Vader.

- Vader causes Biggs to "SUFFER" 1 critical damage.

Even though the Rules Reference says that "SUFFERING" damage is NOT the same as being "DEALT" a damage card, the IA trigger of being "DEALT a damage card" somehow still triggers when Biggs' "SUFFERS" damage from Vader..??

Could you help understand how that is? -- thx again!

Suffering damage is not the same as being instructed to deal a damage card because suffering damage is handled differently depending on whether you have shields or not.

If you suffer damage and you have shields you lose a shield token.

if you suffer damage and you do not have shields then you resolve it by dealing a damage card

Okay, thanks guys! I'll inform my now much-happier friend!

Basically, you are dealt a (face up) damage card when you suffer (critical) damage without shields remaining . The 'dealt a card' rule activates at that point.

the reason they put so much emphasis on dealt vs suffered a crit is because there are some ways to force a target to draw a card without being hit by an attack. For instance, Wampa's ability. He cancels all dice to give you a facedown damage card. Because you arent actually taking any damaging hits, you are dealt the card and not suffered a hit. There are some upgrades based on suffered where this would bypass as well.

However the inverse doesnt work that way as others have said. if you draw a damage card period then you are dealt a card.

An odd thing about Wampa is that using his ability actually causes the attack to MISS although it still deals a card to the target.

In the Biggs questions from above I'll assume the shieldless Biggs gets hit by this: hit-hit which the cause two damage cards to be dealt (assuming no negation used or results cancelled) and the attack triggers Vader allowing Biggs to suffer a crit. This crit then get converted into a card (face-up even) which leads to the IA on Biggs deciding to trigger and pop the droid to avoid getting that card.