This sounds amazing. I have one small concern, why Hunters of the Aturi Cluster? I has the same letters as Heroes of the Aturi Cluster, HOTAC. How am I going to tell them apart!?

I think the simplest possible change is HitAC.

Hunters in the Aturi Cluster

IT's Hunters because it sounded more aggressive than Defenders of the Aturi cluster and more Imperial than Villians.

And by the way the Z-95 AI had been made by someone on the vilains or scum thread...it just wasnt colored in. Same thing wth the Firespray.

This sounds amazing. I have one small concern, why Hunters of the Aturi Cluster? I has the same letters as Heroes of the Aturi Cluster, HOTAC. How am I going to tell them apart!?

Exactly what several others of us on the "Villains" thread said. We all were leaning towards Defenders...since its the Imperial perspective.

I think the simplest possible change is HitAC.

Hunters in the Aturi Cluster

IT's Hunters because it sounded more aggressive than Defenders of the Aturi cluster and more Imperial than Villians.

HITAC (Hunters in....) doesnt sound near as good as Defenders or other suggestions.

And by the way the Z-95 AI had been made by someone on the vilains or scum thread...it just wasnt colored in. Same thing wth the Firespray.

People could spend Decades debating this Topic...I am just glad someone solidified something and is making something out of it. I like Hunters!

Rakaydos, how can I help?

This sounds amazing. I have one small concern, why Hunters of the Aturi Cluster? I has the same letters as Heroes of the Aturi Cluster, HOTAC. How am I going to tell them apart!?

Exactly what several others of us on the "Villains" thread said. We all were leaning towards Defenders...since its the Imperial perspective.

I think the simplest possible change is HitAC.

Hunters in the Aturi Cluster

IT's Hunters because it sounded more aggressive than Defenders of the Aturi cluster and more Imperial than Villians.

HITAC (Hunters in....) doesnt sound near as good as Defenders or other suggestions.

And by the way the Z-95 AI had been made by someone on the vilains or scum thread...it just wasnt colored in. Same thing wth the Firespray.

People could spend Decades debating this Topic...I am just glad someone solidified something and is making something out of it. I like Hunters!

Rakaydos, how can I help?

What I really need are battle reports, and followup battle reports with commonsence tweaks. I THINK PS1 tie fighters with 3 xp are worth half a player, (as they have exactly half a starting ship's value) but I have done exactly zero testing in that regard. Also higher PS with upgrades- I dont think I have enough PS adds to threaten even a PTL intercepter, let alone some of the stronger ability combos.

If other people are doing testing, I can work on blocking out the next few missions to get them ready for testing as well.

Game 2, this time 2 players with 25 extra XP each (to simulate an extended game)

Intercepter, PS4, Autothruster, Stealth, Targeting computer, Push the Limit

Tie Defender, PS4, HLC, Tie Mk2

with 2 players at PS4, the new spawn chart says just 1 Xwing in the first wave... but it's an elite. rolled on the elite Xwings, got Tarn with a proton torpedo.

A freak proton hit dropped the defender from full to 1 hp (max proton, blank defence, direct hit) in exchance for a nasty HLC hit, just as the Ywing spawned in the defender's flight path. The PTL intercepter, though, drove off Tarn, out maneuvered the wing and drove it off, and drove off the last Xwing.

Might need a few more spawns and elites keyed to higher pilot skills. We were only PS4, and a no-R7 Tarn was the only threat to us.

This was supposed to be the beginner mission, so why did you play it with super experienced decked out player ships?

As beginning players with 2TIEs there's no way they could have fought Tarn and then a Y Wing and another X Wing.

The Rebel ships get free PTL without penalties and powerful Torpedoes. At a higher PS Elite X Wings are undodgeable because they decide their target and maneuver after the TIEs have already finished their movements and used their actions.

Your starting TIEs have 2 options with only 2 Attack Dice and the only one with 3 is a 3HP arcdodger that can't arc dodge because the Rebel ships are higher PS.

The Imperial ship design doesn't work to directly port this over. In HotAC there were 3 AD X Wings and turreted Y Wings with 5-8 HP facing down equal numbers of 3HP 2 AD TIE Fighters that couldn't normally modify dice.

In tournaments small Imperial squads do well because they use Palpatine as a crutch to force damage or blocking when they're only facing 2-3 models. They can also arc dodge because players only use high PS aces. Plus they are always completely decked out to be as powerful as possible.

Actually playing through the campaign allows none of these things that the tournament lists rely on until late in the game as you showed with your later game list. Due to the rebels HP, low Attack Dice levels, and fleeing AI the Imperials will struggle to be able to gain XP and because they are flying flimsier ships without powerful astromechs to regen or distribute Stress or anything players won't be able to get anywhere without redesigning the XP system for the Imperials.

Game 2, this time 2 players with 25 extra XP each (to simulate an extended game)

Intercepter, PS4, Autothruster, Stealth, Targeting computer, Push the Limit

Tie Defender, PS4, HLC, Tie Mk2

with 2 players at PS4, the new spawn chart says just 1 Xwing in the first wave... but it's an elite. rolled on the elite Xwings, got Tarn with a proton torpedo.

A freak proton hit dropped the defender from full to 1 hp (max proton, blank defence, direct hit) in exchance for a nasty HLC hit, just as the Ywing spawned in the defender's flight path. The PTL intercepter, though, drove off Tarn, out maneuvered the wing and drove it off, and drove off the last Xwing.

Might need a few more spawns and elites keyed to higher pilot skills. We were only PS4, and a no-R7 Tarn was the only threat to us.

This was supposed to be the beginner mission, so why did you play it with super experienced decked out player ships?

As beginning players with 2TIEs there's no way they could have fought Tarn and then a Y Wing and another X Wing.

The Rebel ships get free PTL without penalties and powerful Torpedoes. At a higher PS Elite X Wings are undodgeable because they decide their target and maneuver after the TIEs have already finished their movements and used their actions.

Your starting TIEs have 2 options with only 2 Attack Dice and the only one with 3 is a 3HP arcdodger that can't arc dodge because the Rebel ships are higher PS.

The Imperial ship design doesn't work to directly port this over. In HotAC there were 3 AD X Wings and turreted Y Wings with 5-8 HP facing down equal numbers of 3HP 2 AD TIE Fighters that couldn't normally modify dice.

Did yo notice the mission scaling?

A pair of PS1 tie Fighters would count as a single player, and not get any of the high PS enemy upgrdes.

Wave 1 would consist of a single Xwing... and that would be it

A pair of PS2 starting ships face 1 Xwing in wave 1, 1 Y wing .in wave 2, and 1 Xwing in wave 3.

As an optional starting point. I think 4 TIE Fighters would start well. But 2 PS 2 TIEs as a basic Interceptor, Bomber, or Advanced are bad vs a PS4 Elite X Wing with a Torpedo, Astromech, and Pilot Ability, and both a free Target Lock and Focus every turn.

While it has the ability to always choose it's maneuver after perfect knowledge of where every enemy has moved and it can use K Turns without having to worry about Stress and still perform a free Target Lock action.

Edit: Your campaign design still has starting squads of PS2 "elite" ships as standard but I can't see how that works for the Imperials. The other options are only optional.

Duplicate Post

As an optional starting point. I think 4 TIE Fighters would start well. But 2 PS 2 TIEs as a basic Interceptor, Bomber, or Advanced are bad vs a PS4 Elite X Wing with a Torpedo, Astromech, and Pilot Ability, and both a free Target Lock and Focus every turn.

While it has the ability to always choose it's maneuver after perfect knowledge of where every enemy has moved and it can use K Turns without having to worry about Stress and still perform a free Target Lock action.

Edit: Your campaign design still has starting squads of PS2 "elite" ships as standard but I can't see how that works for the Imperials. The other options are only optional.

PS2 players will not face a PS4 elite Xwing. It's not on the spawn chart.

As for your edit, if you mean thematically, that can be argued ad-nausium. If you mean mechanically, I disagree. You wont be able to KILL them all, but you can survive 10 turns easilly enough.

I think the first mission arc would be better against Scum & Villainy Z95s, HWKs, and maybe one or two Y Wings with the advanced ships that you started out with.

The pre-campaign mission vs Rebels that you built up the deployment for with X and Y Wings would not use the normal starting ships like you tried using in your first two test games but Academy Pilots.

I'd say the campaign starts out with a fight between a large Imperial and Rebel fleet. A wing of rookie TIE Fighters gets isolated in an asteroid belt and ambushed by an Elite X Wing and Y Wing(s).

If the TIEs destroy the Rebels then the imperial commanders recognize that the imperial pilots are special so send them off to the elite Hunters in the Arturi Cluster where they are given their pick of the Interceptor, Bomber, or shielded ships and sent off on missions starting clearing pirates (weaker cheaper ships than Rebels) to establish a new base of operations.

But if you don't reward Imperials for just surviving without killing the enemy then the players won't gain enough XP to progress anywhere and the game will feel stagnant for the players.

Triplicate post

I really should stop using my phone for posting to forums.

But if you don't reward Imperials for just surviving without killing the enemy then the players won't gain enough XP to progress anywhere and the game will feel stagnant for the players.

There's actually people who feel that is an important aspect of an imperial-feeling game. (these are usually the people who want to start in Tie LNs, too)

I look at it like this- each Xwing is worth 2-3 XP in "hit XP" to get it to run away, about the same as a tie fighter in Heros. But if you can finish it off before it hypers, it's worth an extra 2 XP for you plus an XP to the whole table. So small groups are trying to survive, while large groups are focusing down targets.

A single X Wing may give 2-3 XP same as aTIE Fighter but the HotAC starter mission has 3 TIEs plus later waves while the Imperial starter mission only has one X Wing plus a later Y Wing. There's more XP available to the Rebels because there are more ships. And they have higher damage potential so it's easier for them to actually cause damage.

Can you put together a full battle report? I want to see playtest information rather than just theorycraft.

For the Hard Mode players out there...

3 XP each, PS1 (imperials always have init), counts as half a player.

Making a few tweaks to the intro mission spawn:

some tweaks to the rebel spawn rate for "Final Exam"

Enemy spawn
Red Squad: Turn 1, spawn at 3,

1 player: Xwing,

2 player (If players are PS4)replace w/ elite Xwing,

3 player (If players are PS6) Xwing

4 player (if players are PS8) replace w/ elite Xwing,

5 player Xwing

6 player: (if players are PS8) replace with elite Xwing

Green squad: Turn 1, Spawn at 4,

1 player (If players are PS6) Xwing

2 player (if players are PS8) replace w/ elite Xwing,

3 player Xwing,

4 player (If players are PS4) replace w/ elite Xwing,

5 player (If players are PS6) Xwing

6 player Xwing

Gold squad: Turn 4, Spawn d6,

1 player (If players are PS4) Ywing

2 player Ywing,

3 player (If players are PS6) replace w/ Elite Ywing

4 player Ywing,

5 player (If players are PS8) replace w/ Elite Ywing

6 player (If players are PS4) Ywing

(all non elite Ywings have Dorsal Turrets)

Blue squad Turn 7, Spawn d6,

2 player Bwing

3 player (If players are PS8)replace w/ elite Bwing

4 player (if players are PS6) Bwing

6 player Bwing

Premice being that PS4 pilots will have PTL and boost/Autothrusters,

PS6 pilots will have at least 1 advanced craft and a nice ability for their ship (wampa on an advance, ect)

PS8+ pilot will be fully upgraded badasses- 6 autocrit phantoms, say.

What are people's thoughts on making the Tie Advance a starting ship, built in system slot with no discount, Ship+7 XP?

I think the Title should be Auto-Equip and yes, since costs don't matter in the HotAC campaign, leave the discount out. Same goes for the Interceptor Title I'd say, gain an additional modification slot from the start.

So basically you can choose 4 models from the start: Interceptor as arc dodger, Bomber as bomber, Advanced as ... Jouster? not sure, And Bomber with shuttle title as support? Because of crew members?

How do you plan to unlock the additional models? Available for everyone? Or just 1-2 models depending on players? Or depending on how far into the arc you go until you lose? Or directly depending on the last mission in an arc, e.g. "how many tie phantoms can you save from the rebel attack and flee with it"?

Could be incentive for more diversity if only 1-2 players can upgrade to a phantom, maybe only interceptor players? And then let the bombers upgrade to a punisher, and the advanced to a defender?

Looking forward to this, we're having a blast with our HotAC run so far.

What are people's thoughts on making the Tie Advance a starting ship, built in system slot with no discount, Ship+7 XP?

I think the Title should be Auto-Equip and yes, since costs don't matter in the HotAC campaign, leave the discount out. Same goes for the Interceptor Title I'd say, gain an additional modification slot from the start.

So basically you can choose 4 models from the start: Interceptor as arc dodger, Bomber as bomber, Advanced as ... Jouster? not sure, And Bomber with shuttle title as support? Because of crew members?

How do you plan to unlock the additional models? Available for everyone? Or just 1-2 models depending on players? Or depending on how far into the arc you go until you lose? Or directly depending on the last mission in an arc, e.g. "how many tie phantoms can you save from the rebel attack and flee with it"?

Could be incentive for more diversity if only 1-2 players can upgrade to a phantom, maybe only interceptor players? And then let the bombers upgrade to a punisher, and the advanced to a defender?

Looking forward to this, we're having a blast with our HotAC run so far.

Most of the "upgrade ships" in Heros are more of sidegrades- the Bwing or HWK arnt really better, just do things differently.

I'm aiming for the same thing by banning Tie Defender titles and ACD. Reception to the ships dropped dramatically when players were told the ship they really wanted would be stuck at 2 agility if they wanted to use that 4+ attack.

Actually, I'm more afraid of all Intercepter groups. Being such a pure expression of arcdodging, there's a thin line between a misssion that is pathetically easy and a mission that is a party wipe.

After that shuttle tyderian podcast, I'm bumping for more attention. I'm reworking the AI and spawn charts, but the next version of the intro mission should be ready by thursday. I've got a rough start for the first actual campain mission, but for some reason I cant copy it from the text file to the forum, so I'd have to retype it all to post it online.

I've got tough outlines for the mission arc I'm working on. I'll be moving into rudimentary play tests at some point soon.

I've got tough outlines for the mission arc I'm working on. I'll be moving into rudimentary play tests at some point soon.

Got any unlocks planned for yours, or is it just a "normal" mission?

I was planning it to just be a normal mission arc with no unlocks. I'm not sure an unlock makes sense in the story of the arc.

Edit: actually maybe the inquisitor arc would match well with this arc

Gave it a quick go with just models and tablet, the starting players running TIEs against an X-wing with a Y showing up. Hmm.

I like it as an idea a whole bunch, but there's way, way less XP than in heroes - not only fewer ships, but they're harder to kill and more able to run away. The players that lived were earning not even half as much, and that felt just rough - and no successful kills (stupid hyperjumps, especially on a slightly-luckier-than-normal X-wing) made them feel a bit cheated, too. Tricky.

If I were doing it again, I think I'd be inclined to make XP communal and offer a hefty bounty for killing rebel ships - to encourage teamwork focus firing, unlike the rebel glory-mongers.

Thinking on it further: everyone at the same XP shares it. Anyone behind also gets their share, but their achievements are tracked and rewarded separately before the communal share takes place; this helps them catch up easier.

Why? Because greens are fickle, and many player ships will lack hyperdrive to use as a bug out button.

So I expect players to be playing catch up a lot... but then again the idea of imperial squads caring more about their mission (and helping the rookies learn to fly better before they get killed) is certainly a thematically attractive one. They're not heroes, after all; they're there to serve. How very selfless of them.