Hey everyone, I'm posting a new healer class with credit going to Zaltyre for originally coming up with the class in his thread on boardgamegeek:

https://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1413048/custom-healer-class-martyr

I loved the idea of it and, quite frankly, I've had trouble in the past making a healer. So I took it upon myself to make cards for it, with my own little tweaks. Hopefully Zaltyre doesn't have a problem with me working with his stuff. I'm not trying to take credit for his work or anything, far from it, just really wanted to use his class in a campaign. Here's a link to the cards:

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/odx5l47ypog6y89/AABZJBksn4UcH94OYT9lxhFSa?dl=0

The cards look very nice, thank you! Let me first say that I think you made interesting and balanced changes to some of the skills, and I'm glad you made the class you own.

However, I wonder if we couldn't find a way to tweak them just a little more. The whole drive behind creating the class was to make a hero who spent his own health instead of suffering fatigue to activate abilities. It would be nice (though you're not obligated) if we could find a way around those fatigue costs.

For example, the prophet never uses an action for his abilities, the Bard (almost) never exhausts cards- I thought it would be fun to make a class who never spends fatigue to activate cards.

The cards look very nice, thank you! Let me first say that I think you made interesting and balanced changes to some of the skills, and I'm glad you made the class you own.

However, I wonder if we couldn't find a way to tweak them just a little more. The whole drive behind creating the class was to make a hero who spent his own health instead of suffering fatigue to activate abilities. It would be nice (though you're not obligated) if we could find a way around those fatigue costs.

For example, the prophet never uses an action for his abilities, the Bard (almost) never exhausts cards- I thought it would be fun to make a class who never spends fatigue to activate cards.

Oh I agree that the class could be balanced while spending no fatigue. Personally I tried to follow that ideology by way of lower average fatigue costs but with comparable strength to other classes' abilities. For example, only 3 of the class cards have a direct fatigue cost at costs of 1,1, and 2. The Descent classes available seem to be very fatigue-heavy by nature (Bard's fatigue costs on all skill cards total a whopping 12 fatigue!).

I was actually under the impression that the class wasn't 'finished'. If it was then my bad.

I was actually under the impression that the class wasn't 'finished'. If it was then my bad.

I was actually under the impression that the class wasn't 'finished'. If it was then my bad.

The class wasn't entirely finished, but it was in a fairly happy place. I hdn't altered it in months.

Right on. If you ever want cards done up for them just let me know and I can whip em up. (albeit not the most professionally)

For example, the prophet never uses an action for his abilities, the Bard (almost) never exhausts cards- I thought it would be fun to make a class who never spends fatigue to activate cards.

Spending health instead of fatigue to heal others (healer class) seems a bit unreasonable to me, unless person is a badass blood donator on battlefield.

I would recommend this technique more for some kind of nuker. For example Blood mage , similar to Dragon Age series.

For example, the prophet never uses an action for his abilities, the Bard (almost) never exhausts cards- I thought it would be fun to make a class who never spends fatigue to activate cards.

Spending health instead of fatigue to heal others (healer class) seems a bit unreasonable to me, unless person is a badass blood donator on battlefield.

I would recommend this technique more for some kind of nuker. For example Blood mage , similar to Dragon Age series.

Why not? It is of course a risky strategy, because you are often low on health. But you have fatigue to spend on movement points. A nice trade-off if you want to play something different.

For example, the prophet never uses an action for his abilities, the Bard (almost) never exhausts cards- I thought it would be fun to make a class who never spends fatigue to activate cards.

Spending health instead of fatigue to heal others (healer class) seems a bit unreasonable to me, unless person is a badass blood donator on battlefield.

I would recommend this technique more for some kind of nuker. For example Blood mage , similar to Dragon Age series.

Why not? It is of course a risky strategy, because you are often low on health. But you have fatigue to spend on movement points. A nice trade-off if you want to play something different.

Don´t know really... it just doesn´t feel right to me that medic is sacrificing himself to heal others. Spending fatigue? Yes. But hurting himself? Not really...

The class name ended up as martyr, but the other name I was considering was zealot- I do in fact think of thia character as a sort of blood ritual healer- what he is doing is redirecting wounds omto himself- but also gaining benefits from being wounded. The class was intentionally designed to function differently than your typical class- it's ok that it feels strange.

The class name ended up as martyr, but the other name I was considering was zealot- I do in fact think of thia character as a sort of blood ritual healer- what he is doing is redirecting wounds omto himself- but also gaining benefits from being wounded. The class was intentionally designed to function differently than your typical class- it's ok that it feels strange.

The only reason I kept it as Martyr is that Zealot sounds 'inherently' evil. I'm sure there's lots of well meaning good Zealots out there of course!

I've got the same problem with another idea I've got. A Scout with vampire-like traits. I just dont want it to be a bloody vampire!

Edit: Now that I think about it, I made a Blood Mage custom class of all things! *shrugs*

After reading the above comment about wound suffering being too far, I realized that the bottom part of the base skill "After performing a stand up action, you may perform one additional action before your turn ends" was gone. I feel that's a really important counterbalance to the fact that the martyr will be getting KO'ed more often.

After reading the above comment about wound suffering being too far, I realized that the bottom part of the base skill "After performing a stand up action, you may perform one additional action before your turn ends" was gone. I feel that's a really important counterbalance to the fact that the martyr will be getting KO'ed more often.

I think my reasoning of removing it was the it would make Divine Intervention pretty powerful then, the skill that essentially lets you take a KO in place of another hero. Of course if that's not just me and it was the case, all it would take would be to reword Divine Intervention and I would put the addition to the base skill back in. But thats just me.

Edit: I must've had a lot on my mind when going over the class cause I do agree it's a pretty important counter-balance to the fact that you'll probably be getting knocked out more often. I'll put it back in and reword Divine Intervention.

Edit: I must've had a lot on my mind when going over the class cause I do agree it's a pretty important counter-balance to the fact that you'll probably be getting knocked out more often. I'll put it back in and reword Divine Intervention.

You can obviously do whatever you'd like with your rework. However, I'll just tell you what I was thinking with the base skill and "Far Better Rest" which you renamed "Divine intervention". The idea was sort of the inverse of the Stand-up/revive mechanic. That is, a stand up, which a hero does himself, essentially takes 2 actions. A revive, on the other hand, only takes one. By the same token, instead of a hero getting KO by an attack, the martyr volunteers to take all of that damage instead, but he can use his base skill to make that a 1 action sacrifice (rather than 2 for a normal stand up.)

Also, consider that if the martyr is being active, he probably won't be able to help the other hero heal TOO much, since he'll be relatively depleted from his other abilities.

Edit: I must've had a lot on my mind when going over the class cause I do agree it's a pretty important counter-balance to the fact that you'll probably be getting knocked out more often. I'll put it back in and reword Divine Intervention.

You can obviously do whatever you'd like with your rework. However, I'll just tell you what I was thinking with the base skill and "Far Better Rest" which you renamed "Divine intervention". The idea was sort of the inverse of the Stand-up/revive mechanic. That is, a stand up, which a hero does himself, essentially takes 2 actions. A revive, on the other hand, only takes one. By the same token, instead of a hero getting KO by an attack, the martyr volunteers to take all of that damage instead, but he can use his base skill to make that a 1 action sacrifice (rather than 2 for a normal stand up.)

Also, consider that if the martyr is being active, he probably won't be able to help the other hero heal TOO much, since he'll be relatively depleted from his other abilities.

I guess my main concern was that with both your Blood for Blood and Far Better Rest, then essentially most defeats would only result in a 1 action deficit for the heroes (i.e. each turn a hero is about to be defeated, use Far Better Rest since there's no cost except for health, then Stand-Up for one action on your turn with Blood For Blood). I like the idea of Blood for Blood giving the Stand Up bonus to himself, but with Far Better Rest it indirectly gives the ability to everyone since you're just going to use the ability to block the KO for another hero. And coupled with Perseverance, you'll probably stand up with a good amount of health anyways. I'm not sure on it yet but thats my thinking.

That's a valid concern. It may require too much text, but perhaps the secondary ability of "Blood for Blood" could be tacked onto "Divine Intervention" instead. Something like, "This card does not refresh as normal. Refresh this card when you perform a stand up action to immediately perform another action."

That way, the benefit is only given if the card had been exhausted first.

The gray die bonus could be moved to a different skill.

Just a couple of changes (some personal preference, some just better wording) and I'll have the cards changed later today to reflect it.

Blood Ties

I really like the concept about having a hero class that suffers damage instead of fatigue to trigger the abilities. However, I think (and agree with JTSleep) that the Healer archetype isn't the best to fit to this theme. This because as we know, in Descent a healer that heals (despite the redundancy) is a must have during a game. While I was reading the original class, I find that the healing ratio is low but none of the skill heal at all.

Now, with BJZSN modifications I think it looks more as a healer, but then it losses the main idea by using health instead of fatigue.

Lastly, if I recall correctly, there is already a fan made class on BGG that touches this healing via suffering damage called Blood Mage. While I don't remember the author, I do have the class saved in my Drop Box: here is the link to the preview of the class.

Therefore, may I suggest changing the archetype to a Mage instead? And, to suffer damage to trigger the abilities (as first intended).

Maybe the starting skills could say something like this:

[starting skill]

You gain HP according to your stamina value.

Each time you perform an attack, after rolling dice, you may suffer up to 3 [hearts] to add the same amount to the result. Additionally, you may suffer 1 Condition of your choice, to inflict the same condition to the target, even if the attack didn't do any damage. Limit once per attack.

+As a mage, you will be able to deal great amount of damage by the expenses of your life.

+The sum of stamina to HP will prevent low HP mages to get along with the class.

+Suffering the same condition as the target will prevent abusing from it, I think.

And after that, skills thematically and focused to the archetype and the idea:

1 Exp Bone spikes

Exhaust this card to suffer up to 3 [hearts]. Then, each figure adjacent to you suffer the same amount of [hearts].

1 Exp Meatshield

Exhaust this card during your turn to suffer up to 3 [hearts] and to place the same amount on this card. This card cannot hold more than 10 [hearts].

Each time you would suffer any damage, you may discard a damage token from this card instead (even when exhausted).

1 Exp Bloodcall

Exhaust this card to test [knowledge] before rolling dice for an attack. If passes, you recover [hearts] equal to the amount of [hearts] dealt to your target.

2 Exp Blood Pool

Exhaust this card to suffer up to 3 [hearts] and to place the same amount of [hearts] on this card. While this card is exhausted, any figure within 3 spaces of you needs X additional movement points to enter a space within 3 spaces of you, where X is the number of damage tokens on this card.

Discard the tokens from this card when refreshing it.

2 Exp Sacrifice

Exhaust this card and target a hero figure adjacent to you. The hero suffers up to 3 damage and you recover the same amount of damage.

3 Exp Martyr

Exhaust this card to suffer any number of damage. Then, target a monster within 3 spaces of you, that monster suffers the same amount of damage.

3 Exp Hermoplague

[Action]: Exhaust this card and choose monsters within 5 spaces of you and in your line of sight that have at least one damage on them. Then, perform an attack targeting each monster chose, this attack ignores range. After the attack is resolve, each target become bleeding and diseased and you suffer damage equal to the monsters targeted from this attack.

Some changes will have to be made to balance the class, but I think this way you get the main idea of using health to trigger abilities.

P.S. Now that I’m reading, I think the idea have changed from “suffering damage to trigger abilities” to “absorb the damage dealt to your partners instead of healing them”. Anyway, this is what I think about this concept.

I really like the concept about having a hero class that suffers damage instead of fatigue to trigger the abilities. However, I think (and agree with JTSleep) that the Healer archetype isn't the best to fit to this theme. This because as we know, in Descent a healer that heals (despite the redundancy) is a must have during a game. While I was reading the original class, I find that the healing ratio is low but none of the skill heal at all.

Now, with BJZSN modifications I think it looks more as a healer, but then it losses the main idea by using health instead of fatigue.

Lastly, if I recall correctly, there is already a fan made class on BGG that touches this healing via suffering damage called Blood Mage. While I don't remember the author, I do have the class saved in my Drop Box: here is the link to the preview of the class.

Therefore, may I suggest changing the archetype to a Mage instead? And, to suffer damage to trigger the abilities (as first intended).

Maybe the starting skills could say something like this:

[starting skill]

You gain HP according to your stamina value.

Each time you perform an attack, after rolling dice, you may suffer up to 3 [hearts] to add the same amount to the result. Additionally, you may suffer 1 Condition of your choice, to inflict the same condition to the target, even if the attack didn't do any damage. Limit once per attack.

+As a mage, you will be able to deal great amount of damage by the expenses of your life.

+The sum of stamina to HP will prevent low HP mages to get along with the class.

+Suffering the same condition as the target will prevent abusing from it, I think.

And after that, skills thematically and focused to the archetype and the idea:

1 Exp Bone spikes

Exhaust this card to suffer up to 3 [hearts]. Then, each figure adjacent to you suffer the same amount of [hearts].

1 Exp Meatshield

Exhaust this card during your turn to suffer up to 3 [hearts] and to place the same amount on this card. This card cannot hold more than 10 [hearts].

Each time you would suffer any damage, you may discard a damage token from this card instead (even when exhausted).

1 Exp Bloodcall

Exhaust this card to test [knowledge] before rolling dice for an attack. If passes, you recover [hearts] equal to the amount of [hearts] dealt to your target.

2 Exp Blood Pool

Exhaust this card to suffer up to 3 [hearts] and to place the same amount of [hearts] on this card. While this card is exhausted, any figure within 3 spaces of you needs X additional movement points to enter a space within 3 spaces of you, where X is the number of damage tokens on this card.

Discard the tokens from this card when refreshing it.

2 Exp Sacrifice

Exhaust this card and target a hero figure adjacent to you. The hero suffers up to 3 damage and you recover the same amount of damage.

3 Exp Martyr

Exhaust this card to suffer any number of damage. Then, target a monster within 3 spaces of you, that monster suffers the same amount of damage.

3 Exp Hermoplague

[Action]: Exhaust this card and choose monsters within 5 spaces of you and in your line of sight that have at least one damage on them. Then, perform an attack targeting each monster chose, this attack ignores range. After the attack is resolve, each target become bleeding and diseased and you suffer damage equal to the monsters targeted from this attack.

Some changes will have to be made to balance the class, but I think this way you get the main idea of using health to trigger abilities.

P.S. Now that I’m reading, I think the idea have changed from “suffering damage to trigger abilities” to “absorb the damage dealt to your partners instead of healing them”. Anyway, this is what I think about this concept.

I just glanced over it. But Martyr is very op, especially in scenario's where the heroes need to defeat a lieutenant. Maybe limiting it to X(stamina value)?

You're correct that he is a little light on the healing- but he's heavy on damage prevention. He protects and/or soaks up damage from other heroes, and then heals himself (or gets KO, and is able to mitigate that).

You're correct that he is a little light on the healing- but he's heavy on damage prevention. He protects and/or soaks up damage from other heroes, and then heals himself (or gets KO, and is able to mitigate that).

Agreed, it's like he's funneling damage to himself. Any healing stuff he has generally benefits himself but that's really the idea, redirection.

I just glanced over it. But Martyr is very op, especially in scenario's where the heroes need to defeat a lieutenant. Maybe limiting it to X(stamina value)?

Yeah, I though the same when I re-read it, anyway, I just did it quickly, so I didn't pay too much attention.

You're correct that he is a little light on the healing- but he's heavy on damage prevention. He protects and/or soaks up damage from other heroes, and then heals himself (or gets KO, and is able to mitigate that).

Agreed, it's like he's funneling damage to himself. Any healing stuff he has generally benefits himself but that's really the idea, redirection.

I see, I might have missunderstood the propuse of the class, I though it was for damage input, but now I see what you are planning. It would be very interesting to try it out.

Gonna make some changes to the Martyr. Most of the work is done, but like the other classes it may be today or tomorrow before I get around to finishing it.