Hello!

Last night my group was playing and we came accross a situation where a player wanted to use Force Move to deflect or repel a grenade thrown by an opponent. This obviously not during the players turn since the opponent was using their attack to throw it. Should the PC be able to use force powers like this during combat? Seems a little overpowered was our main concern.

is there anything in the rules about this?

Thanks

I'd say no. Unless the character throwing the grenade specifically sets it on a timer, grenades go off and cause damage when they hit just like any other weapon. Since there's no way for anyone to declare a ready action or similar in this system there's no way in RAW to perform this particular trick in combat.

Seems like the type of thing two destiny points could allow. It's exciting and narrative and makes the game more fun to do things like this, the important thing is making sure it doesn't become too common or abused by the players.

If you were to houserule "Ready" actions, then yes and it would consume their action that turn as it is a action. Which is fine and dandy as the player would be preoccupied with turning the barrage of grenades back.

Otherwise no because it's an abstract system.

Well, considering there is a picture in one of the Force and Destiny books that shows someone doing basically exactly that (but with a rocket projectile from a gun), I would say yes. I would say that since it's technically outside the RAW, it's not going to be easy.

My house rule would be:

1. Flip a Destiny Point and take 2 strain just to attempt it.

2. It uses up an action for the turn. If the player has already acted that turn, then he can't do it. If he hasn't gone, then that is his action that turn.

3. He would have to have the Hurl Objects upgrade. To justify being able to fling it fast enough away to not hurt the party.

4. If he uses a Dark Side pip to do it, he earns an additional point of conflict, especially if he does the "I throw it back at my enemies!" approach.

The Protect power is also a RAW way of doing this, but that's for higher XP characters

Alternately, the player using the move power could be the narrative excuse for the grenade either missing entirely, or the blast not triggering...

i.e.

Stormtrooper throws grenade, rolls no successes, no advantages

Describe - The trooper throws a grenade at you, you quickly react using the Force and knock the grenade into a corner, where it detonates harmlessly.

If he wants active defenses, you would have to house rule "readied actions". Which I do allow, but most people reserve for I shoot the first stormtrooper through the door. I have also had players use move (with the fine control upgrade) to activate an enemy's grenade on his belt.

Per RAW, there's no way to mechanically use Move to hurl a grenade/explosive back at the attacker when it's not your turn, specifically as there's no such thing as "readied" or "held" actions in this system.

Back in WotC's Saga Edition, it was discovered that a Jedi PC could be quite potent simply by using a readied action to intercept an incoming grenade and hurl it back at the attacker, with a later book even introducing a talent to let the PC do that trick as a reaction.

As for how to go about allowing it in FFG's system... that sounds like it'd be more the purview of the Protect power. Move in and of itself is already very powerful and very versatile, especially as the PC increases both their Force Rating and the Move upgrades they've purchased.

My thought as to how to handle this would be to have the PC commit a Force die on their action, and at some point before their next turn, then they can intercept a single thrown weapon as an Out-of-Turn Incidental, and could send it to any location within short range as part of that response. GM may or may not want to require a contested roll between the Force user and the original attacker to keep this from being too useful/reliable a trick on the PC's part.

I was going to suggest handling it in a way similar to KungFuFerret.

If the PC hasn't acted yet that round, I'd allow them to forgo their turn that round, to make a check to do it. I wouldn't require the Control upgrade, but I would require them to have at least the Medium Range upgrade to get it out of harms way. Also flipping a chip and taking Strain just to attempt sounds good to me, as well.

I would treat it as a really cool Reflect/Improved Reflect.

By raw rules you can use a light saber to reflect any ranged light, ranged heavy or gunnery attack.

If the player had the Fine Manipulation upgrade for Move I would let him reflect non energy attacks using move.

If he seriously wanted to go down that kind of road I would let him find a Holocron which let him learn a new Force Talent called deflect/Improved Deflect/Superior Deflect. Which would be treated exactly like Reflect only requiring the player to know move instead of having a lightsaber.

Well, considering there is a picture in one of the Force and Destiny books that shows someone doing basically exactly that (but with a rocket projectile from a gun), I would say yes. I would say that since it's technically outside the RAW, it's not going to be easy.

My house rule would be:

1. Flip a Destiny Point and take 2 strain just to attempt it.

2. It uses up an action for the turn. If the player has already acted that turn, then he can't do it. If he hasn't gone, then that is his action that turn.

3. He would have to have the Hurl Objects upgrade. To justify being able to fling it fast enough away to not hurt the party.

4. If he uses a Dark Side pip to do it, he earns an additional point of conflict, especially if he does the "I throw it back at my enemies!" approach.

This picture was described as a narrative use of improved reflect. You could narrate this witha grenade if the Pc had move and the attacker rolled significant threat or at least one despair on a missed roll.

As others have said the RAW doesn't allow for this specifically. However some Force Powers, Talents and Destiny Points do, but not as others have suggested...
When you Flip A Destiny Point and/or upgrade the Attack Difficulty with Sense, and your Opponent misses you can describe it as deflecting the grenade using Move if you wish without having to actually roll the Activate the power. You can also use this narrative to guid how to adjudicate Despair results this roll might generate as well.

Reflect also can fall under this as the GM can allow it to be used if it makes sense at the time and describing the reduction in damage as the result of the grenade being further away when it went off.

In any case I would recommend against making a House Rule that allows for an out of turn use of Move. If a Player must have it to be happy then follow Protect as a guide and add a top tier ability on the left Magnitude/Strength side of the tree that copies the Protect Control that allows an out of turn incidental currently.

Well, considering there is a picture in one of the Force and Destiny books that shows someone doing basically exactly that (but with a rocket projectile from a gun), I would say yes. I would say that since it's technically outside the RAW, it's not going to be easy.

My house rule would be:

1. Flip a Destiny Point and take 2 strain just to attempt it.

2. It uses up an action for the turn. If the player has already acted that turn, then he can't do it. If he hasn't gone, then that is his action that turn.

3. He would have to have the Hurl Objects upgrade. To justify being able to fling it fast enough away to not hurt the party.

4. If he uses a Dark Side pip to do it, he earns an additional point of conflict, especially if he does the "I throw it back at my enemies!" approach.

This picture was described as a narrative use of improved reflect. You could narrate this witha grenade if the Pc had move and the attacker rolled significant threat or at least one despair on a missed roll.

Yes it was described as a narrative use of Improved Reflect, however what you are actually seeing is someone using Force Move. The lightsaber isn't implemented at all in the picture, and would in fact make little since, hitting an explosive projectile with a tube of contained plasma to try and reflect it. So either is viable in my opinion, since there isn't really a rule about it in the books directly. That suggestion was on a podcast (a very good one mind you), and was theorized by a few people on how you could assign some kind of mechanic to describe the action. But that's hardly the same as "officially sanctioned ruling on the action" by FFG.

If I see a Force user doing something that involves them holding out their hand, and this seems to be pointed in the direction of something that has a change in velocity, I personally call it a depiction of Move. Besides, in the Jedi games, you don't bounce back rockets with your saber, you bounce them back with well timed usages of Move, so again, I would make the house ruling about it being Move, not Improved Reflect.