also becomes really expensive if you do that, and slightly easier to kill.

He costs around ~42pts when you do that too. After bringing palpy you dont have enough points left even for Omega Leader unless you dump something you normally dont want to (electronic baffles for instance). Thats bringing him way too close to the only ship you have thats going to do work, meaning hes going to be focus fired immediately and w/o an evade even with palpy hes going to go down fairly quick. Defenders excel at shrugging off 1-2 hits, not 4-6.

I'd much rather the /d title but unless im doing it on a Glaive or Ryad its just too expensive imo.

Ryad is a budget defender when you cant fit Stele, Vessery, or Brath in there. Shes infinitely better than a Glaive but the other 3 will cause more pain majority of the time. Problem is theyre rather pricy and usually those 3-6pts are what makes your list too expensive.

Personally i hate the inquis. I'd rather have omega leader over him. Playstyle differences, i absolutely hate sniper play and the inquis is a **** sniper.

I'm not sure about this. Right now, I have Ryad as the hardest hitting x7 Defender because of the frequency with which she has TL/Focus and the short K-turns allowing her to stay in closer range bands.

Nah, chewie/Leebo would still wreck it. PWT's for the win!

BBBBZ crushes this list

Ha.

Premise: Palp Aces is the best list in the game.

Your premise is incorrect, therefore the following statements are incorrect.

How that? I think it is hard to find a list that is more flexible and dominating. Stress controll popular? Upgrade the Omicron to Yorr. Regen ships popular? Wampa has you covered. Anything that needs to point an arc at you for shooting? Don't worry, you can chose a second manouver in the activation phase if you screwed up. Turrets? Just use more Autothrusters. Lots of Palpaces? Be greedier than them!

I honestly am considering getting a Raider soon, because they are just that much more reliable than any other tournament list. Sucks, because I'd rather fly an ordnance based list using my TIE Bomber. Maybe with Veterans...

Green K-Turn still of no value. Vessery can just not stress himself and do a white K-Turn. Vessery still gets 3 actions a turn, 2 if he bumps.

As long as the red 1 or 2 turn is never the right option. And you never hit a debris field, and you never run into anyone with stress mechanics (though those at least are rare atm)

They'd have to have something that could kill the shuttle within a turn or two. Not many lists can do that, and generally if they're going after the shuttle my aces are punishing them. Even if they kill it in 3 turns I've gotten at least 8 points of value out of Palpatine, and 21 points of value by saving my aces from shots with the shuttle. That's their best option for taking me out, their only option really. That doesn't mean it's a good option, with most lists going after the Palp Shuttle it still sucks for them, just less so than going after the aces.

MOST lists can kill the shuttle in a couple rounds. 10 health behind 1 agility is not that much. And my aforementioned 3 x7 defender list can easily kill the shuttle in 2 rounds. In which case palpatine really only saved you 1 health. MAAAAYBE an extra shot on the second round if the health works out exactly right. And odds are you probably aren't killing any of my 3 ships before I can kill the shuttle since I have my own ships with 6 health behind 3 agility and focus/evade.

Colonel Vessery (40) - TIE Defender

Veteran Instincts (1), Ion Cannon (3), TIE/D (0), Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (1)

The Inquisitor (31) - TIE Adv. Prototype

Push The Limit (3), TIE/v1 (1), Autothrusters (2)

Omicron Group Pilot (29) - Lambda-Class Shuttle

Emperor Palpatine (8), Emperor Palpatine (8)

I've been running this list, like it a lot and have had pretty good success with it.

Green K-Turn still of no value. Vessery can just not stress himself and do a white K-Turn. Vessery still gets 3 actions a turn, 2 if he bumps.

As long as the red 1 or 2 turn is never the right option. And you never hit a debris field, and you never run into anyone with stress mechanics (though those at least are rare atm)

They'd have to have something that could kill the shuttle within a turn or two. Not many lists can do that, and generally if they're going after the shuttle my aces are punishing them. Even if they kill it in 3 turns I've gotten at least 8 points of value out of Palpatine, and 21 points of value by saving my aces from shots with the shuttle. That's their best option for taking me out, their only option really. That doesn't mean it's a good option, with most lists going after the Palp Shuttle it still sucks for them, just less so than going after the aces.

MOST lists can kill the shuttle in a couple rounds. 10 health behind 1 agility is not that much. And my aforementioned 3 x7 defender list can easily kill the shuttle in 2 rounds. In which case palpatine really only saved you 1 health. MAAAAYBE an extra shot on the second round if the health works out exactly right. And odds are you probably aren't killing any of my 3 ships before I can kill the shuttle since I have my own ships with 6 health behind 3 agility and focus/evade.

And you know what happens when Vessery is stressed? He still gets an evade token and a target lock.

Nah, your list really can't. You get one round of firing, then the shuttle bumps and survives another turn, then I maybe survive another and then die. 3 turns. I can kill one of your x7 defenders by the time you've killed the shuttle.

Then it's the Inquisitor and Acewing Vessery against your x7 Defender that I out PS and whatever else ace you've brought.

Even if palp never triggered, I've still traded a 29 point shuttle for your 28 point minimum ship. I'm winning that trade.

Colonel Vessery (40) - TIE Defender

Veteran Instincts (1), Ion Cannon (3), TIE/D (0), Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (1)

The Inquisitor (31) - TIE Adv. Prototype

Push The Limit (3), TIE/v1 (1), Autothrusters (2)

Omicron Group Pilot (29) - Lambda-Class Shuttle

Emperor Palpatine (8), Emperor Palpatine (8)

I've been running this list, like it a lot and have had pretty good success with it.

The weakness with this list (not that it's bad) is that Vessery us the clear first target. He has massive offense, and no extra defensive kick like x7 Vessery. You get in a damage race, which can be good or bad, depending on the opponent's list.

And you know what happens when Vessery is stressed? He still gets an evade token and a target lock.

Assuming he still has friends around, and they aren't bumped or stressed themselves.

Nah, your list really can't. You get one round of firing, then the shuttle bumps and survives another turn, then I maybe survive another and then die. 3 turns. I can kill one of your x7 defenders by the time you've killed the shuttle.

Then it's the Inquisitor and Acewing Vessery against your x7 Defender that I out PS and whatever else ace you've brought.

Even if palp never triggered, I've still traded a 29 point shuttle for your 28 point minimum ship. I'm winning that trade.

I'm not going to get just one round of firing. Depending on range of the first round of shooting, I either block with the delta and still have shots with the other 2, or I just k-turn behind the shuttle. Still gonna kill it in 2 rounds (I've played against palp aces. Shuttle dies easy).

i think ive had my shuttle survive being focused down once, and i contribute that to my opponent's dice hating him. 4 dice attacks 3 turns in a row on a 1agi ship, even with palp guaranteeing one evade, that shuttle should have been dead between that and the other 3die ship hitting him too. Managed to get away somehow with 1hp. Usually he dies in 2-3 rounds, but i usually take out something pretty important by the time he goes.

Colonel Vessery (40) - TIE Defender

Veteran Instincts (1), Ion Cannon (3), TIE/D (0), Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (1)

The Inquisitor (31) - TIE Adv. Prototype

Push The Limit (3), TIE/v1 (1), Autothrusters (2)

Omicron Group Pilot (29) - Lambda-Class Shuttle

Emperor Palpatine (8), Emperor Palpatine (8)

I've been running this list, like it a lot and have had pretty good success with it.

The weakness with this list (not that it's bad) is that Vessery us the clear first target. He has massive offense, and no extra defensive kick like x7 Vessery. You get in a damage race, which can be good or bad, depending on the opponent's list.

I will listen to your advice Biophysical, the king of defenders. I recently ran a two defender list with the X/7 and they impressed me with how difficult they were to hit. So I may tweak the list with that title like the OP. Which title do you like more? And, what type of lists will you be running? Defenders and palp? Triple defenders? Double defenders?

Colonel Vessery (40) - TIE Defender

Veteran Instincts (1), Ion Cannon (3), TIE/D (0), Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (1)

The Inquisitor (31) - TIE Adv. Prototype

Push The Limit (3), TIE/v1 (1), Autothrusters (2)

Omicron Group Pilot (29) - Lambda-Class Shuttle

Emperor Palpatine (8), Emperor Palpatine (8)

I've been running this list, like it a lot and have had pretty good success with it.

The weakness with this list (not that it's bad) is that Vessery us the clear first target. He has massive offense, and no extra defensive kick like x7 Vessery. You get in a damage race, which can be good or bad, depending on the opponent's list.

I will listen to your advice Biophysical, the king of defenders. I recently ran a two defender list with the X/7 and they impressed me with how difficult they were to hit. So I may tweak the list with that title like the OP. Which title do you like more? And, what type of lists will you be running? Defenders and palp? Triple defenders? Double defenders?

Listening is fine, but I wasn't trying to get you to change your list, just consider circumstances. It may be fine that Vessery gets targeted first if you have plans to make use of that.

I haven't settled on anything yet, really. I want to do double Defenders, because I ran that last year with some success, these new ones are different beasts. I've had about half a dozen lists I've tinkered with that I'd love to run seriously, but I haven't had the chance.

Colonel Vessery (40) - TIE Defender

Veteran Instincts (1), Ion Cannon (3), TIE/D (0), Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (1)

The Inquisitor (31) - TIE Adv. Prototype

Push The Limit (3), TIE/v1 (1), Autothrusters (2)

Omicron Group Pilot (29) - Lambda-Class Shuttle

Emperor Palpatine (8), Emperor Palpatine (8)

I've been running this list, like it a lot and have had pretty good success with it.

The weakness with this list (not that it's bad) is that Vessery us the clear first target. He has massive offense, and no extra defensive kick like x7 Vessery. You get in a damage race, which can be good or bad, depending on the opponent's list.

I will listen to your advice Biophysical, the king of defenders. I recently ran a two defender list with the X/7 and they impressed me with how difficult they were to hit. So I may tweak the list with that title like the OP. Which title do you like more? And, what type of lists will you be running? Defenders and palp? Triple defenders? Double defenders?

There's only one king and that's me the tie defender ace, accept no substitutes.

Green K-Turn still of no value. Vessery can just not stress himself and do a white K-Turn. Vessery still gets 3 actions a turn, 2 if he bumps.

As long as the red 1 or 2 turn is never the right option. And you never hit a debris field, and you never run into anyone with stress mechanics (though those at least are rare atm)

They'd have to have something that could kill the shuttle within a turn or two. Not many lists can do that, and generally if they're going after the shuttle my aces are punishing them. Even if they kill it in 3 turns I've gotten at least 8 points of value out of Palpatine, and 21 points of value by saving my aces from shots with the shuttle. That's their best option for taking me out, their only option really. That doesn't mean it's a good option, with most lists going after the Palp Shuttle it still sucks for them, just less so than going after the aces.

MOST lists can kill the shuttle in a couple rounds. 10 health behind 1 agility is not that much. And my aforementioned 3 x7 defender list can easily kill the shuttle in 2 rounds. In which case palpatine really only saved you 1 health. MAAAAYBE an extra shot on the second round if the health works out exactly right. And odds are you probably aren't killing any of my 3 ships before I can kill the shuttle since I have my own ships with 6 health behind 3 agility and focus/evade.

Actually, the shuttle can just leave a TL on something for Vessery yo use. So can the Inquisitor.

Vessery's ability triggered pretty much every turn that I had a shot with him. The Inquisitor target locks so often that you end up doing it even when you already have a TL up just to get the evade token.

I understand that Vessery's ability no longer triggers when he's the only ship left, but then I have a PS 8 Defender with Engine Upgrade and a 2 point initiative bid in the end game, it's not really relevant then. I'm better off with that PS in the end game than Ryad's PtL and K-Turn shenanigans.

You get one round of firing, then I bump you and you lose at least one shot and I probably survive that round of shooting, then I probably die next turn.

I've probably killed a Defender of yours by then. While you're focusing the shuttle down, your Defender is tasting it from Vessery and the Inquisitor with full token stacks, and possibly a shuttle shot.

Green K-Turn still of no value. Vessery can just not stress himself and do a white K-Turn. Vessery still gets 3 actions a turn, 2 if he bumps.

As long as the red 1 or 2 turn is never the right option. And you never hit a debris field, and you never run into anyone with stress mechanics (though those at least are rare atm)

They'd have to have something that could kill the shuttle within a turn or two. Not many lists can do that, and generally if they're going after the shuttle my aces are punishing them. Even if they kill it in 3 turns I've gotten at least 8 points of value out of Palpatine, and 21 points of value by saving my aces from shots with the shuttle. That's their best option for taking me out, their only option really. That doesn't mean it's a good option, with most lists going after the Palp Shuttle it still sucks for them, just less so than going after the aces.

MOST lists can kill the shuttle in a couple rounds. 10 health behind 1 agility is not that much. And my aforementioned 3 x7 defender list can easily kill the shuttle in 2 rounds. In which case palpatine really only saved you 1 health. MAAAAYBE an extra shot on the second round if the health works out exactly right. And odds are you probably aren't killing any of my 3 ships before I can kill the shuttle since I have my own ships with 6 health behind 3 agility and focus/evade.

Actually, the shuttle can just leave a TL on something for Vessery yo use. So can the Inquisitor.

Vessery's ability triggered pretty much every turn that I had a shot with him. The Inquisitor target locks so often that you end up doing it even when you already have a TL up just to get the evade token.

I understand that Vessery's ability no longer triggers when he's the only ship left, but then I have a PS 8 Defender with Engine Upgrade and a 2 point initiative bid in the end game, it's not really relevant then. I'm better off with that PS in the end game than Ryad's PtL and K-Turn shenanigans.

You get one round of firing, then I bump you and you lose at least one shot and I probably survive that round of shooting, then I probably die next turn.

I've probably killed a Defender of yours by then. While you're focusing the shuttle down, your Defender is tasting it from Vessery and the Inquisitor with full token stacks, and possibly a shuttle shot.

Sure the shuttle can leave a TL up insead of using it. If you don't mind the shuttle basically doing no damage on it's own. The Inquis will TL every round, but that's where you get back to the "bumped, multi-stressed or dead".

I'd be perfectly happy to have a PS5 PTL ryad left against your PS8 vessery with engine in the end game. Sure, you can reposition a little, but you don't have PTL to double reposition so it's not nearly as scary as a soontir. And while you have focus/evade, I'll have focus/evade/TL, so even if I spend both tokens on defense, I'll still have a TL for offense. And in this case shooting second coudl actually work in my favor, since it means you havae to decide whether to spend the focus on offense. If so, I still have good odds of evading between focus/evade, but you now only have evade for defense.

As for the shuttle, in 2 rounds of shooting, even if the delta blocks so doesn't get a shot round 2, you're still taking 5 3-dice attacks. Probably at least 2 of those are actually 4 dice. So that's 15+ attack dice coming at you. If you palp for defense both times, you've stopped 2 hits. So I have to roll at least 3 blanks in those attacks, more if I have range 1 shots. And 4 of those shots will have target locks (and focus if not needed for defense against your aces). Odds are definitely in my favor of killing it in 2 rounds.

And as I've arleady pointed out, I've gone up against palp aces before. Wampa + OL I would argue probably has offense against a single target at least as good as vessery does (especially given that OL stops me from modifying), and he had the PTL inquisitor and shuttle as usual. I didn't lose a defender before I killed the shuttle (and wampa).

It also depends on approach angles. If I have good shots at the inquis or vessery after they've spent focus tokens (or if the shuttle hangs bout out of range), I can always shoot them isntead of th shuttle.

Heck, I can jus tblow right past the shuttle if I want so it doesn't get to shoot, and then it essentially becomes 3v2

Colonel Vessery (40) - TIE Defender

Veteran Instincts (1), Ion Cannon (3), TIE/D (0), Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (1)

The Inquisitor (31) - TIE Adv. Prototype

Push The Limit (3), TIE/v1 (1), Autothrusters (2)

Omicron Group Pilot (29) - Lambda-Class Shuttle

Emperor Palpatine (8), Emperor Palpatine (8)

I've been running this list, like it a lot and have had pretty good success with it.

The weakness with this list (not that it's bad) is that Vessery us the clear first target. He has massive offense, and no extra defensive kick like x7 Vessery. You get in a damage race, which can be good or bad, depending on the opponent's list.

I will listen to your advice Biophysical, the king of defenders. I recently ran a two defender list with the X/7 and they impressed me with how difficult they were to hit. So I may tweak the list with that title like the OP. Which title do you like more? And, what type of lists will you be running? Defenders and palp? Triple defenders? Double defenders?

There's only one king and that's me the tie defender ace, accept no substitutes.

If you're the king of Defenders, I'm Littlefinger.

I can do a 3 hard turn and get 3 actions. No stress involved.

Ryad gets 3 actions and then is tied to banks and straights/K-Turns. If you don't have Engine Upgrade you miss out on the ability to K-Turn + boost which is very strong. If you don't have TIE MK II then you're tied to traveling in a straight line to de-stress.

I can do a 3 hard turn and get 3 actions. No stress involved.

Ryad gets 3 actions and then is tied to banks and straights/K-Turns. If you don't have Engine Upgrade you miss out on the ability to K-Turn + boost which is very strong. If you don't have TIE MK II then you're tied to traveling in a straight line to de-stress.

Straights banks and kturna are plenty of options to clear stress.

So I've updated this squad.

OGP with Palpatine, FCS

31 point Inquisitor

Vessery with x7, Juke, Stealth Device

This squad is very, very good. It's very hard for my opponent to deal with it if I don't make blunders.

So trying to turn Vessery into a Boostwing was a mistake. Just joust with him. With your white 4k you can often just blast in with a 5 straight the turn before, and then 4K and they're isn't much they can do about it.

I saw today someone posted this as an idea for a ship,

Glaive Squadron Pilot — TIE Defender 34

Wired 1

Stealth Device 3

TIE/x7 -2

Ship Total: 36

See now you have a 3/4/3/3 with an evade which is really tough to kill. IDK just a thought.

Wired? THe only way it's getting stressed is by enemy action or by NOT using /x7 which it should almost never need to avoid using.

I've said it before, building antisynergistically is a dumb idea build to make your trick better - it makes it more obvious what you're going to do, which in turn makes it easier to fox your opponent by doing a red hard 1 if that's your jam.

/x7s with Stealth Device are certainly annoyingly hard to kill, but Wired doesn't help them much compared to e.g. Crack Shot for the same points.

Also, Ryad would be better for the same points. Brobots excepted, PS6 isn't exacty congested, so going down to PS5 is a mostly ignorable change, and her ability is just SO good for a jouster.

So I've updated this squad.

OGP with Palpatine, FCS

31 point Inquisitor

Vessery with x7, Juke, Stealth Device

This squad is very, very good. It's very hard for my opponent to deal with it if I don't make blunders.

So trying to turn Vessery into a Boostwing was a mistake. Just joust with him. With your white 4k you can often just blast in with a 5 straight the turn before, and then 4K and they're isn't much they can do about it.

Yup along my lines of thinking with a Palp Defender list. I had hull but I can see stealth with palp is a good shout

Meh, five Cartel Marauders would wreck it.

Wired? THe only way it's getting stressed is by enemy action or by NOT using /x7 which it should almost never need to avoid using.

I've said it before, building antisynergistically is a dumb idea build to make your trick better - it makes it more obvious what you're going to do, which in turn makes it easier to fox your opponent by doing a red hard 1 if that's your jam.

/x7s with Stealth Device are certainly annoyingly hard to kill, but Wired doesn't help them much compared to e.g. Crack Shot for the same points.

Also, Ryad would be better for the same points. Brobots excepted, PS6 isn't exacty congested, so going down to PS5 is a mostly ignorable change, and her ability is just SO good for a jouster.

I don't really like Wired all that much. Focuses are already only 25% of dice results, and from there you have a 50% chance of hit/crit or a 3/8ths chance of an evade.

On a Defender occasionally there will be a turn where a red turn is the correct maneuver. Then you're just stuck with the stress for multiple turns sometimes. I'd rather just use Adrenaline Rush and never pick up that stress in the first place, or use Lightning Reflexes in order to do Segnors Loops or super Segnors loops and then set up a proper angle where a green straight next turn is viable. Crackshot is always good. You may also want to run no EPT/Adaptability and spend those points on TIE MK II.

Wired has its applications on ships that use Zuckuss like a HWK, and a friend uses the stressbot on a T-70 with Wired, but even then I think I'd go for Adrenaline Rush so that you can flip around while stressed and apply more stress. That's one of the problems with stressbot carriers, once they apply stress and fly past they're out of the fight for a few turns as they have to do multiple hard turns to turn back around.