Was going over some "unused" older cards and thinking about how to try and find some use for them with the newer stuff coming out. Got to looking at Isard and was thinking that her and Slicers might be a fun combo. It's been discussed how slicers can troll (give Demo a squad command). Would it be useful to combine with Isards ability to look before you trigger slicers?

Question:

Can you not just counter the slicer tools for Demo with Wulff Yularen? Take a nav token on turn one, and you have one for the rest of the game?

Now we are building a tractor beams / interdictor / slicer tools / isard mouse trap worth 10x the points of just one upgrade on Demo to stop it.

I believe the answer is actually just blocking with a flotilla since they can scatter all black rolls with 100% probability.

Question:

Can you not just counter the slicer tools for Demo with Wulff Yularen? Take a nav token on turn one, and you have one for the rest of the game?

Now we are building a tractor beams / interdictor / slicer tools / isard mouse trap worth 10x the points of just one upgrade on Demo to stop it.

I believe the answer is actually just blocking with a flotilla since they can scatter all black rolls with 100% probability.

I agree with you, however a Demo with Wulff is a Demo without Intel which makes it much less scary.

Its not awful if you have three pts tou cant figure out what to do with, but honestly I dont care what my opponenet has lined up before I pop slicer tools. I know what I dont want him to have, and more importantly, I can look at the baord and figure out what the most suboptimal choice is, and thats what hes getting. Really, its only useful in situations where you could effect two ships and you want to check one out. Highly situational but a cheap enough investment to be possibly worthwhile.

Question:

Can you not just counter the slicer tools for Demo with Wulff Yularen? Take a nav token on turn one, and you have one for the rest of the game?

Now we are building a tractor beams / interdictor / slicer tools / isard mouse trap worth 10x the points of just one upgrade on Demo to stop it.

I believe the answer is actually just blocking with a flotilla since they can scatter all black rolls with 100% probability.

I agree with you, however a Demo with Wulff is a Demo without Intel which makes it much less scary.

Its funny wulf got a lot of demo play in wave one but now i prefer intel or monty.

I think Wulf might get some new life on the Interdictor for engineering, possibly. I personally think the problem with Isard is if there are squadrons, I know what will be spamming squadron commands, and if there aren't, It'll usually be navigate or CF. If the ship has some passy-ony shenanigans with shields (projection experts or that one neb title) then I also know what it will be doing, probably. If Madine or Ozzel is the commander, it will almost certainly be navigates. I think her utility is more limited the more one plays and gets used to what commands are typically tossed. I would probably just opt for the slicer tools and go after stuff that likes navigating or doesn't have Wing Commander and will be pushing squadrons. Your friend and mine Yavaris is the first one that leaps to mind.

Ya, forcing Yavaris to get engi/Nav would be a fun troll

I was thinking along the same lines as the people already posting, just slow fingers and a busy day meant that others got in before I could post

It's true in many cases the target for slicer tools is going to be the ship that provides the greatest threat, regardless of what command it is going to show. This would mean a lot of times whether you Isard the Demo or not, you are still going to want to change that top command to mess up it's flow.

That said I think another use for Isard may be as a tie breaker- IE you can slice either their Yavaris, or their MC80. Both are threats that can be mitigated well by slicer tools, and normally you would have to read your opponent and guess what they are going to do with their next turn. Yavaris is mainly dangerous if it is going to pop squadron dial, otherwise you will want to slice the MC80, so you Isard the Yavaris, see that it is showing navigate, and then slice the MC80 and give it something that won't help it. Thus you have guaranteed that the threat you will face from those two ships this turn will be minimal.

I guess the question then is how many times in a game do you face a situation where Isard would be beneficial, and then is it worth the (albeit tiny) 3 point investment.

Yep, all of those ships who absolutely have to have a certain command will have to start looking at either the Captains/Officers for 6 points to guarantee it, or the Liasons to aim to keep a token to have it when they need it...

But this comes with the total opportunity cost of the other officers that are generally so good in those slots...

Yavaris without Antilles.

Demolishers without Intel or Wulff

MC80s without Walex (Brace, Brace, Brace it off!)

All of these things.