I'm really interested in playing a Seeker Navigator, but I'm worried that the talents will be rarely used and it's gonna be a huge waste of XP. So i've got a few questions to see if some talents are more useful then they look at first glance.

Question #1 :

Planet Mapper : Remove setback per rank of Planet Mapper from Streetwise or Survival checks used for navigation on a world.

Let's say that I'm trying to find the local arms dealer or the "Bantha Tracks" cantina, would this count has navigating a world ? or navigating a world is just trying to find the fastest way from point A to point B ???

Question #2 and #3

Holistic Navigation : When making an Astrogation skill check, the character may spend one Destiny Point to remove a Despair, or to remove Threat equal to his ranks in Perception.

Galaxy Mapper : Remove Setback per rank of Galaxy Mapper from Astrogation checks. Astrogation checks take half normal time.

Intuitive Navigation : When performing an Astrogation or Knowledge (Outer Rim) skill check, the character may roll Force Dice no greater than his Force Rating. The character may spend Force Pip to add Success or Advantage (character's choice) to the result.

Master Starhopper : Once per round, the character may suffer 2 strain to decrease the difficulty of his next Astrogation check by one, to a minimum of Easy.

One with the Universe : Once per session, meditate, then perform One With The Universe action; make Average Astrogation check. If successful, add Light Force Pip to all Force power checks in the next encounter. If successful with Threat, add Dark Force Pip instead.

Even if One with the Universe isn't tied to navigating and plotting an Hyperspace jump, Holistic Navigation , Intuitive Navigation and Master Starhopper could be used with it right ?!?

The question might have already been answered, but how long should it take to meditate ? Is it an entire encounter ? Is it one round ? something in between ? Could a character do like Qui-Gon in Episode 1 and meditate during the fight and then gain the bonus from One with the Univers e ?!? Thinking about it, if trying to meditate in the middle of combat, the master could add Setbacks, but they would be removed with Galaxy Mapper ... and the meditate would take half normal time ???

If most of these talents work with One With The Universe, then the character will really shine when he gets that talent.

Do you guys consider the Navigator spec worthwhile ?!?

Thanks in advance.

I like the spec personally. It is one that requires the GM to work a bit harder to integrate their speciality into the system.

I look at Navigator like the Intellectual explorer rather than the Cunning one, so high Intelect low Cunning.

Q1: up to the GM but to me that sounds reasonable, your trying to get from point A to point B, that's navigating. I also think that Studious Plotting would apply, allowing you to use your Intelect instead of Cunning (did I mention this is the smart explorer not the cunning one?)

Q2a: the long description of "One with the Universe" says it takes a couple of minutes, to me that says it's an out of combat check... But since Galaxy Mapper halves the time it takes to perform Astrogation checks I would say the two combined would let it be done as an action during structured time. Now as GM I would be upgrading that check, a couple of times if your engaged with a hostile NPC, adding setback for the environment etc.

Q2b: I think it's reasonable to assume all those talents can be used with OwtU, I think it's part of the reason they are even in the tree, it's the characters shtick.

I'll say it again Intelect should be high with this character, it boosts your knowledge skills, improves Astrogation, and with Studious Plotting can be applied to Streetwise/Survival when navigating. This spec really lets you be something different to all the other wilderness characters, make use of it!

I like the spec personally. It is one that requires the GM to work a bit harder to integrate their speciality into the system.

The issue with the Navigator is that if you use the standard rules for Astrogation, the spec's talents aren't really all that needed. If you instead go with ramped-up difficulties and lots of setbacks on your Astrogation checks in order to make the Navigator feel like his talents are useful, then you run into a conundrum of how ships without Navigators (possibly including that of the PCs if the Navigator is incapacitated or otherwise not with the group) can get anywhere at all.

The issue with the Navigator is that if you use the standard rules for Astrogation, the spec's talents aren't really all that needed. If you instead go with ramped-up difficulties and lots of setbacks on your Astrogation checks in order to make the Navigator feel like his talents are useful, then you run into a conundrum of how ships without Navigators (possibly including that of the PCs if the Navigator is incapacitated or otherwise not with the group) can get anywhere at all.

With a Navigator, you can try to do the Kessel run in less then 12 parsecs.... plot the best routes to make the fastest run...

"You know the Millenium Falcon, well our team does the job better"

With a Navigator, you can also try to find those lost worlds of Legends or find new worlds in uncharted regions...

Like Richard said... the GM has to work a little harder to make them work since you know have a kick ass navigator... so let's go off the beaten path

Yeah that's true, but without spelling it out I was thinking that a GM will need to find "other" uses for Astrogation than the simple plot a Hyperspace route. This is the first Spec that truly focuses on Astrogation, and most campaigns the only use of that skill is getting from point A to point B through Hyperspace. Hence my comment that a GM will have to work harder than normal on including that skill in particular.

"Ancient ruins, old star map, X marked on it" Daunting Astrogation to quickly figure out where its pointing to. Add 2 setback for the dark, Upgraded twice for that pack of Rakghouls running at you.

"You need a particular rare species of plant for this food your preparing to sweet talk the governor, Hard Astrogation with 3 setback for time pressure to think of a nearby system that you could have what you need."

"This ship your just got running in a junk yard to escape this planet has really out of date charts. Hard Astrogation upgrade once for these charts, with 2 setback for a reluctant droid brain. I'm flipping a DP as well so make that 2 upgrades".

"The Corporate Executive your group is negotiating with just dropped the name of a planet, you feel like you have heard it before, Average Astrogation, Upgraded 3 times due to immense time pressure, 2 setback for the distractions of conversation going on around you, but add Boost because of the particulars of your background that I'll explain later."

People forget that Astrogation has more uses than just programming a navicomputer. It also covers "a character's basic knowledge galactic geography" and "may be checked any time a character wonders what other systems are nearby." It also allows a character to "use a navicomputer and their Astrogation skill to identify their location" when in an unknown system, and covers "familiarity with the galaxy's hyperspace routes and the types of craft and comemrce most common along those routes."

It is a truth that using a Navigator requires the group to be willing to focus on traveling, which contributes to world building and immersion, but that is often a part of the game that is pushed to the side.

In Legends, there are some planets that are so concealed by stellar phenomena, that only Force sensitives would be able to navigate the dangers to get there. That's where I see a Navigator coming into play. But this spec is try to have shine often enough for me to want to take it.

This specialization is definitely quite specific in its skills. Starhopping would have to be quite central to the theme of the campaign in order for a Navigator to get a fair shake. It might not be exceptional outside of a seeker-based campaign, but in a campaign where wanderlust guides the party's hopes and ambitions, the Navigator will be quite handy.

Here are some examples or situations where the navigator can be quite useful in a group of force sensitives.

1. Perhaps the party needs to go to Ilum. All of the main hyperlanes are monitored by the imperials. Finding an off-the-charts route will take someone who is not only force sensitive, but exceptional at navigating the stars.

2. The party is lost in space, but fear not! Our party Navigator can pinpoint our position by using knowledge of physics combined with data from the navicomputer to gain a hint at where they are. Our expert navigator can then use the force to guide the party to a safe hyperlane.

3. Short of credits? The Navigator can use prior knowledge of secret hyperlanes and sell this exclusive hyperspace data to groups of friendly (and nice, make sure they aren't despicable) merchants or smugglers. You get credits and now beneficial goods can be spread throughout the galaxy thanks to your PC's knowledge of space.

4. The Navigator is likely a well-travelled individual. There are many benefits to having a well-travelled PC in the party. The PC could be a well-seasoned veteran of exploration, with knowledge of many exotic things than can cure or kill. A PC has been infected by a strange bacterium? (PC succeeds on a knowledge (outer rim) check.) "I know of a specific plant that has antibacterial properties."

5. You will never have to worry about seriously messing up an astrogation check again. Most parties do not have an individual that is even mildly at astrogation. One of my PCs was a smuggler and had two ranks in astrogation. The chance for a triumph is nothing to play with. I would reward triumphs with lucrative things like secret hyperspace routes and faster lanes. In a party of smugglers having trouble making ends meet, any extra credits are more than welcome.

The list can go on for a while, but remember this. Everyone likes having a person around that knows their way. It's like traveling to a big city and having a person that is a native guide you to the best spots. While you are in the city you will almost never get lost and you have access to places only veterans of the system know of.

Also worth remembering the Seekers Career skills of both Piloting Skills and Ranged Heavy. With a decent Agility this character has no trouble being the groups Pilot and a decent combatant. This makes for a very broad character who is an intelligent pilot and gets you where you want to go faster than anyone else in the galaxy on planet and in space.

Then with a high Intelect and Agility you can branch out so easily; a Knowledge character, Tech, Medic, Ranged anything, Gunnery, Pilot anything, it can go so far. So many stories could come from it.

At first I was kinda "meh!" about the spec....
I was thinking of abandoning my character concept but after a few posts, I will probably give it a try.

Astrogation, Perception, both Piloting, Survival, Vigilance, Ranged (Heavy), Outer Rim and Xenology.

You've got a character that can hold it's own in ranged and space combat, with some tools to survive on hostile worlds. Main weakness of this career/spec is tech and face mostly.

I was thinking of buying into Ataru Striker to give some punch to this character.

What other spec do you think would complement Navigator ? Either to answer his main weaknesses or to exploit it's strengths.

Pathfinder, for Keen Eyed, Forager, Outdoorsman, Sleight of Mind, Natural Outdoorsman, and Quick Movement.

At first I was kinda "meh!" about the spec....

I was thinking of abandoning my character concept but after a few posts, I will probably give it a try.

Astrogation, Perception, both Piloting, Survival, Vigilance, Ranged (Heavy), Outer Rim and Xenology.

You've got a character that can hold it's own in ranged and space combat, with some tools to survive on hostile worlds. Main weakness of this career/spec is tech and face mostly.

I was thinking of buying into Ataru Striker to give some punch to this character.

What other spec do you think would complement Navigator ? Either to answer his main weaknesses or to exploit it's strengths.

I think your choice of Species, or more specifically the Characteristics you choose to focus on, will be the guiding factor. Personally i would be focusing on Intellect and Agility, with Willpower the third. I think it pairs beautifully (although differently obviously) with all 5 other Seeker Specialisations;

• Ataru, your nimble and it allows you to focus on Agility since you can do so much with that Characteristic.
• Hunter, you find beasts and bring them down. you likely wont be great at Stealth, but most else will be fantastic, especialy that right hand side down to Intuitive Shot.
• Pathfinder and Navigator is like peas and carrots, 2 of the cheapest FR talents and Quick Movement to make you uncatchable.
• Executioner lets you find places and Kill, efficiently. This is close to a Bounty Hunter with a broad expertise, your that one that just wont go away, always appearing when your quarry thinks they have finally gotten away.
• Hermit is probably the least connected, but i still think it works, your Cunning will likely be low so being able to add your Force Rating to Survival and Xenology checks is great, not to mention the FR4 your going to end up with... I think this could be lots of fun if you went with Intellect and Presence then picked up influence, your never going to get a triumph but people just tend to always agree with you, ALWAYS! The animal companion would help with your ranged combat skills, and at FR4 you can bond a riding animal to be a mounted navigator

outside of career i think:

• Artisan and Armourer could be fun if Intellect is your focus.
• Healer with that high Intellect if your playing a character who finds places in need of help, perhaps curing plagues etc.
• Star-fighter Ace if you want to rule the skies.
• Sage to play up those Knowledge skills, as well as for an eventual FR 4, this works well with a Presence instead of Willpower.
• Soresu Defender if Intellect is more your focus than Agility and you want to play the character who finds places in need of protection.
• Seer for Lore and Discipline and to build on Uncanny Senses/Preemptive avoidance, also for that FR 4. not only can you get places you can get away and use the force.

Outside of FaD there are a couple of notable mentions

• Fringer, its got a bit of everything and it all works wonders for a Navigator
• Scout for lots of things, but especially those 2 extra ranks of Shortcut. (this works in reverse too, Navigator is an awesome Spec to get if your a Scout)
• Analyst is an interesting one, it adds a lot of useful talents relating to Knowledge checks, makes for a very interesting mix of abilities.
• Saboteur... your good at finding places, and great at blowing them up!

What characteristics where you actually thinking about focusing on?

What characteristics where you actually thinking about focusing on?

Sorry for taking my sweet time to reply...

I've been thinking a lot about my character for a few days.

Here is a roundup of the situation.... we are starting a new group of characters : first player is a Seer (face of the group), second player is gonna be a CyberTech/Medic (healer of the group), third player is gonna be a Technician guy (not sure is spec right now). The last player of our group is the first session GM ; we alternate between GMs, mostly me and that first session GM, the others GM sometimes, but rarely. So I'll rarely play with that last character, but I suspect he's gonna be a pirate of some sort...

Now for my character, he's a member of a Outer Rim Search and Rescue team ; I wanted him to be the co-pilot of his team, doing the astrogation and navigating. Looking at the Additionnal Starship actions on Tabler 7-4 page 241 (F&D), I was looking at some Astrogation, Computers, Mechanics, Leadership and Piloting checks. With that in mind, he'd have Agility, Intellect and Presence all at 3. With Ranks in Astrogation, Piloting, Perception, Leadership, Computers, Mechanics, Survival and Outer Rim.

The problem is the role I wanted my character to play, and the role he'll probably have to play. The skill setup will probably have the Tech Guy be co-pilot at first. Since my character will probably be the only one with ranks in Piloting, he'll probably fall being the ship Pilot. Unfortunately, Navigator isn't that good of a piloting spec since it doesn't have any Piloting boosting talent except for Shortcut and Improved Shortcut.... no Defensive Driving, no SKilled Jockey, no Tricky Target....

Also, I feel i'm not going the right way with my Navigator... I wanted to buy Ataru Striker has a second spec. With Force Rating talent being the easiest to get at 50xp, and One With the Universe tricked out with other talents, I feel that it would have been a lot better Force User going Force Powers instead of LS spec.... Going Sage would probably be a better idea...

The Powergamer in me is conflicted

Mechanics and Synergy VS Flavor and story...

Help me Obi-Wan Kenobi, you're my only hope

First I want to clarify a personal opinion I have on using the Force. It's my belief that one of the most effective ways to use your Force dice is to find ways to add them to your skill rolls, such as with Enhance. The ability to add just enough success to succeed on a check, then pile on the advantage is just incredible, especially when your Force Rating is 3 or more.

Ok so my first question to you is if you are going to be the pilot then why not embrace it? make your character a Starfighter Ace instead, then you get all the flashy talents, not to mention Intuitive Strike. Pick up Navigator as your second Spec later on to give you a boost to your Astrogation etc, and a cheap FR talent to boot. Of course you could start in Navigator and shift to Starfighter Ace later, but if your the pilot from the start then why not start with it.

Now if you're truly loving the Navigator vibe then stop thinking too much about the flashy pilot talents, a good dice pool is often enough. Instead look at ways to pump that Force Rating quickly, and get those dice added to your skill checks. Enhance is obviously your mainstay to get extra dice into your piloting checks, but the Intuitive Navigation talent (is that what it's called?) from Navigator let's you add it to Astrogation as well. But where to from there? Probably the Influence force power, at least to get the Control upgrade to let you add your Force Rating to all social checks. Hermit would be a great Specialisation to get due to the extra FR, and the ability to add Force Dice to Survival checks, right in a navigators wheelhouse.

A third potential build would be for working towards that leadership roll. Starting in Navigator to get those piloting skills cheap, but then getting Peackeeper. It focuses on enhancing those around you, and enhancing your Leadership ability.

And finally there's the Navigator/Advisor option, this one let's you get very good at social and knowledge skills as well as using that Intelect in the real world. Through some ranks of piloting onto it and your good to go.

As far as species go if you're careful about what you choose you should be able to have a 4, 2 3's, 2 2's and a 1 in your Characteristics, Dresellian, Duros, and Twi'Lek are the three that immediately come to mind. I personally think that's a better character than 3 3's and 3 2's. There's always going to be someone better than you in your weakness, and having a flaw can make playing the character quite a bit more fun.

Can you still use the Sense Force Power Control upgrade (Defense) to increase difficulty against a ship you are piloting ?
I'm not sure how all this ended up... before F&D, I think Sam said you could... but later on, after F&D released, he said it couldn't.... so what's the official word on it ?

More later on...

He said no you can't because of the Starfighter Aces "Intuitive Evasion" talent