Not proposing a change here, just curious on how you think the game would be different. Looking to hear some thoughts and see some interesting discussion.

Many other games use a rotating initiative system as opposed to how in X wing, initiations staYs with the original player. Tune TFA core introduced an initiative token. Assumimg all other current rules and cards exist, how would the game need different? What would the meta look like? Would it even change much?

Discuss!

I don't think it would change too much, but you wouldn't see lists go to below 100 anymore. High PS matchups won't be won by who bid the most on initiative/a coin flip anymore, which would be good.

A really interesting form to me would be to split the difference. If you win initiative by bid, you get to pick. If you tie, and win on a coin flip, Initiative passes back and forth.

If it just always went back and forth, though, there would be some really wild tactics in play for mirror matches, where you try and time your attack so you have or don't have initiative at the right time. That might lead to a whole new set of acceleration/delay tactics. The bid could still be important to control timing a little better for squads like TIE swarms.

For squads that really depend on initiative, or the lack of it, you are really going to mess with how they play. If your Arc-dodgers can only dodge half of the time it's probably going to have a lasting impact on how they are flown as they'll need to account for the rounds they won't be able to dodge.

Maybe some people love the idea but I really don't think it is worth the effort. Swapping initiative is one thing when the absolute order of things is tied to it but when it's just one piece determining the order of things I feel it is far less important but having it fixed leads to a more solid game plan even if it isn't always the plan you hope to execute.

For squads that really depend on initiative, or the lack of it, you are really going to mess with how they play. If your Arc-dodgers can only dodge half of the time it's probably going to have a lasting impact on how they are flown as they'll need to account for the rounds they won't be able to dodge.

It's perfect for a PS9 arcdodger who can ALSO joust as needed! Queue Fenn Rau!

Or determine it randomly at the beginning of each round.

For squads that really depend on initiative, or the lack of it, you are really going to mess with how they play. If your Arc-dodgers can only dodge half of the time it's probably going to have a lasting impact on how they are flown as they'll need to account for the rounds they won't be able to dodge.

Maybe some people love the idea but I really don't think it is worth the effort. Swapping initiative is one thing when the absolute order of things is tied to it but when it's just one piece determining the order of things I feel it is far less important but having it fixed leads to a more solid game plan even if it isn't always the plan you hope to execute.

But having identical pilot levels, you're saying that 50% arc dodging capacity is not as good as 100% ignoring that if you fail to give the initiative you're going to get a 0% capacity (against the equal skill pilot). Surely te middle option is better than having the extremes based on a roll or a bid?

I hadn't considered the idea before but I like the idea of rotating initiative. Maybe bidding could let you choose who has it first turn, making the approach more strategic if pilot levels are tied....

Much of the game is already based on a roll or how you build/bid your squadron.

Someone mentioned it at the top of the thread but if initiative changed every round then there would no longer be a reason to put in any kind of bid to get it.

Another thing, who wins in an elimination match if there is a draw? Does that swing back and forth from round to round too?

Or determine it randomly at the beginning of each round.

Or recalculate it as you go. Maybe at the start it was 100-98 in your favor. But I blew up your naked Howlrunner, so now it's 98-82 in my favor. Oops, there went Wedge with VI and Artoo, now it's 82-64 for you. Might change some tactics as far as who to target. Of course, it would be a pain to keep track of.

Or change the way we determine initiative. In my opinion, an outright comparison of points is a poor method that is easy to game (it is however costly to game). Furthermore, once you have gamed an won (say 97 bid vs 98 bid), you win initiative for every round for the rest of the game. That seems a little overpowered.

I suggest a dynamic way to determine initiative bids. At the start of the game, for every point below 100, the player are granted one attack dice. Say 97 pts vs 98 points. Each <Boom> is worth one point and each <Kaboom> is worth 2. Which player rolls with more points wins.

This way, the player who paid 3 points for initiative bid does have a much higher chance of winning but on the other hand, bidding low on initiative does not guarantee that initiative is won.

This dynamic initiative can be used in two ways. One, it's just like the old way, determine initiative once using dice, one dice for each point bid and that's the initiative for the whole game. Two, initiative is generated at the start of every round. This shouldn't take too much time as each player knows how many points they bid down for initiative and should readily prepare the red dice for the dice off.

Having initiative generated at the start of each round could also introduce new pilots with new pilot ability. Let say it was a Jedi or Sith pilot, normally a pilot ability that affects initiative is kinda meh because initiative is only generated once per game. But if initiative is determined round by round, wouldn't it be fun if some Jedi force powers or Sith mind games have the ability to influence initiative dice?

Much of the game is already based on a roll or how you build/bid your squadron.

Someone mentioned it at the top of the thread but if initiative changed every round then there would no longer be a reason to put in any kind of bid to get it.

Another thing, who wins in an elimination match if there is a draw? Does that swing back and forth from round to round too?

In Imperial Assault, you can bid for the first round, but in that game there is no choice. So, I suppose you could bid for the first round so you don't have it the second round, or the third, theoretically. Also, yes, the player who began the current round with initiative would win in the case of a Draw. Lets say time is called during Round 4, but during the course of that turn, both players reach 40 points (the score needed to win.) In that case, the game is a Draw, and the player with initiative in Round 4 would advance.

if they go by initiative to remove draws from the game - it would cause some issues there.

if they go by initiative to remove draws from the game - it would cause some issues there.

The only reason to remove draws is when a winner MUST be determined to advance in a single elimination.

if they go by initiative to remove draws from the game - it would cause some issues there.

The only reason to remove draws is when a winner MUST be determined to advance in a single elimination.

FFG would seem to disagree, given they will be removing draws from X-wing (and other games) entirely next time they update the Tournament Rules.

if they go by initiative to remove draws from the game - it would cause some issues there.

The only reason to remove draws is when a winner MUST be determined to advance in a single elimination.

FFG would seem to disagree, given they will be removing draws from X-wing (and other games) entirely next time they update the Tournament Rules.

Which is foolish. Draws can happen even if they are rare occurrences.

Then again if the time comes and they leave things alone is there going to be a new outcry and a bunch of examples presented of where draws completely broke the game while they were still in effect.

if they go by initiative to remove draws from the game - it would cause some issues there.

The only reason to remove draws is when a winner MUST be determined to advance in a single elimination.

FFG would seem to disagree, given they will be removing draws from X-wing (and other games) entirely next time they update the Tournament Rules.

Which is foolish. Draws can happen even if they are rare occurrences.

Then again if the time comes and they leave things alone is there going to be a new outcry and a bunch of examples presented of where draws completely broke the game while they were still in effect.

Draws can happen, but they are indeed rare. And theres numerous ways to resolve a draw to determie a winner. My favorite is % damage done to the opponent. So basically (total health remaining / max health), whoever has more % health left wins (or whoever did more % damage to the opponent. Same thing)

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Draws can happen, but they are indeed rare. And theres numerous ways to resolve a draw to determie a winner. My favorite is % damage done to the opponent. So basically (total health remaining / max health), whoever has more % health left wins (or whoever did more % damage to the opponent. Same thing)

And that still doesn't come close to covering all draw situations.

No but its a good start. You cam easily have secondary, third, fourth options to determine winner with initiative being the final tiebreaker

The initiative bid system is fine the way it is. It's your reward for sacrificing upgrades from your list.

To those who say it's stupid that Boostwing games are won or lost based entirely upon that die roll, stop playing Boostwings at 100 points. If all that matters in a Boostwing game is who boosts last, then bid down to 95 points.

Also, it IS stupid that all that matters with Boostwings is boosting last, but that's not a fault of the initiative system. That's a fault of FFG power creeping all of the jousters out of the game. In a Joustwing game, initiative doesn't hyper matter like it does for Boostwing games.