It's called the "HWK-290 Light Freighter" so yeah, freighter IS an accurate description. Small bulk (to me) classes what it can carry: Small but highly valuable items like medicine, weapons, holocubes. Large bulk carries stuff that has a small margin so you need a lot of it to make money, like food or clothing. Medium bulk is a compromise between the two and more flexible. The YT-1300 is a medium bulk, for example.

So basically the U-Wing is a combat insertion craft, like the Blackhawk? I...

Look. I'm going to watch the movie, and I'm going to enjoy it. And any complaints about 'canon' are obviously out the window because the movie IS canon. But...

But the Rebellion having a dedicated squad insertion craft, especially in the years before Yavin, is kinda hard for me to swallow. At that point, their navy was cobbled together from older surplus ships like the Blockade Runner, refitted noncombat ships like the first Mon Cal cruisers, or were as general-purpose as possible and manufactured on the sly, like the X-Wing. And that made sense. The Rebellion hadn't won any major victories, and any help they were getting had to be deniable - like stealing the surplus ships in that episode of Rebels.

So IMHO a ship in the role of the U-Wing should be something like the HWK - fast, common enough to blend in, cheap enough for the Rebels to afford, and made for another specification that was repurposed. Or just stolen.

I think people seriously underestimate the Rebel fleet before Yavin.

Cassio Tagge: And until this battle station is fully operational, we are vulnerable. The Rebel Alliance is too well equipped. They're more dangerous than you realize!

Conan Antonio Motti: Dangerous to your starfleet, Commander, not to this battle station.

They can't possibly be talking about 30 one-man fighters.

Yeah. I think the idea of a dedicated insurgence ship is more reasonable than a dedicated star fighter if you go down the no-fleet route. The Rebels are working on destabilising planetary governments at this point, so a quick landing craft makes sense. With the exception of the X-Wing, which was stolen, the rebels at this point only have the battered star fighters like the Y-Wing (not sure where the A-wing came from to be honest)

I agree that a HWK might be more likely and I think looks cooler, but maybe they only have a few U-Wings for their really specialised troops undertaking the most crucial of mission - i.e. stealing plans for the Deathstar.

What makes people think it was created specifically for the Alliance anyway?

A-Wings were surplus fighters that were refitted by the Alliance - a fairly common story, it seems like!

And it's not that they had NO fleet; it's just a case of where it came from. Stolen or 'stolen' capships, refitted or small-run manufacture for their fighters. Capable of hurting bigger ships or soft targets when used in a hit-and-run, but not capable of a standup fight against a serious Imperial force, that's why no systems were declaring for the Alliance.

It's like... if the Empire fleet was worth 100 points, the Rebel fleet at at the time of Yavin was worth 10 - but the Imperial Fleet had to cover the WHOLE galaxy with 1 point there, two points here, five points there... and the Rebels couldn't ever gather all 10 points together.

That was another part of why I liked the second season of Star Wars Rebels. Several episodes were all about that very problem.

It's called the "HWK-290 Light Freighter" so yeah, freighter IS an accurate description.

That's a logical fallacy. The name of an item does not determine the item's properties. If Renault produce a compact car and call it "ABC-456 Heavy Tractor" that doesn't make "tractor" an accurate description of it.

It's called the "HWK-290 Light Freighter" so yeah, freighter IS an accurate description.

That's a logical fallacy. The name of an item does not determine the item's properties. If Renault produce a compact car and call it "ABC-456 Heavy Tractor" that doesn't make "tractor" an accurate description of it.

It's called the "HWK-290 Light Freighter" so yeah, freighter IS an accurate description.

That's a logical fallacy. The name of an item does not determine the item's properties. If Renault produce a compact car and call it "ABC-456 Heavy Tractor" that doesn't make "tractor" an accurate description of it.

Yeah. In Legends, the HWK-290 is described as a currier ship.

No, in Legends it's described as,

The HWK-290 was a light freighter manufactured by the Corellian Engineering Corporation during the decades leading up to the Battle of Naboo, in an effort to break into a new market for fast, small cargo ships. Unlike YT-series of ships for tramp captains, the Hawk line was aimed at more upscale clients, like wealthy merchants and noble politicians

Underlined and bolded the parts you seem to have such trouble understanding.

In canon, it's described as,

The HWK-290 freighter was a model of unarmed freighter modified by Rebel Alliance technicians to carry incendiary bombs during the Death Troopers invasion.

Do I have to define 'freighter for you?

A freighter, cargo ship, or barge was a kind of spacecraft used for hauling cargo from one place to another.

You're wrong. the HWK's a freighter. It was designed to carry cargo. If that cargo happens to be a player avatar named Kyle Katarn, than that's the cargo.

Please give up.

It's called the "HWK-290 Light Freighter" so yeah, freighter IS an accurate description.

That's a logical fallacy. The name of an item does not determine the item's properties. If Renault produce a compact car and call it "ABC-456 Heavy Tractor" that doesn't make "tractor" an accurate description of it.

Yeah. In Legends, the HWK-290 is described as a currier ship.

No, in Legends it's described as,

The HWK-290 was a light freighter manufactured by the Corellian Engineering Corporation during the decades leading up to the Battle of Naboo, in an effort to break into a new market for fast, small cargo ships. Unlike YT-series of ships for tramp captains, the Hawk line was aimed at more upscale clients, like wealthy merchants and noble politicians

Underlined and bolded the parts you seem to have such trouble understanding.

In canon, it's described as,

The HWK-290 freighter was a model of unarmed freighter modified by Rebel Alliance technicians to carry incendiary bombs during the Death Troopers invasion.

Do I have to define 'freighter for you?

A freighter, cargo ship, or barge was a kind of spacecraft used for hauling cargo from one place to another.

You're wrong. the HWK's a freighter. It was designed to carry cargo. If that cargo happens to be a player avatar named Kyle Katarn, than that's the cargo.

Please give up.

It's called the "HWK-290 Light Freighter" so yeah, freighter IS an accurate description.

That's a logical fallacy. The name of an item does not determine the item's properties. If Renault produce a compact car and call it "ABC-456 Heavy Tractor" that doesn't make "tractor" an accurate description of it.

Yeah. In Legends, the HWK-290 is described as a currier ship.

No, in Legends it's described as,

The HWK-290 was a light freighter manufactured by the Corellian Engineering Corporation during the decades leading up to the Battle of Naboo, in an effort to break into a new market for fast, small cargo ships. Unlike YT-series of ships for tramp captains, the Hawk line was aimed at more upscale clients, like wealthy merchants and noble politicians

Underlined and bolded the parts you seem to have such trouble understanding.

In canon, it's described as,

The HWK-290 freighter was a model of unarmed freighter modified by Rebel Alliance technicians to carry incendiary bombs during the Death Troopers invasion.

Do I have to define 'freighter for you?

A freighter, cargo ship, or barge was a kind of spacecraft used for hauling cargo from one place to another.

You're wrong. the HWK's a freighter. It was designed to carry cargo. If that cargo happens to be a player avatar named Kyle Katarn, than that's the cargo.

Please give up.

You just ignoring my point then? The manufacturers can call it whatever they like, that doesn't make it so. A Mini isn't a van whatever the manufacturers call it.

Ok. I concede. But it still seem like there should be an ultralight freighter class just for ships like the HWK.

You just ignoring my point then? The manufacturers can call it whatever they like, that doesn't make it so. A Mini isn't a van whatever the manufacturers call it.

Your comment did bump down two other ones related to Trump though, so... bravo?

Ok. I concede. But it still seem like there should be an ultralight freighter class just for ships like the HWK.

Well, think of it like light pickup truck, heavy pickup truck, and semi-truck. The HWK is the light pickup, the YT-1300 is the heavy pickup, and the Bulk Freighter is a semi.

You just ignoring my point then? The manufacturers can call it whatever they like, that doesn't make it so. A Mini isn't a van whatever the manufacturers call it.

Blocked for stupidity. Sadly, that's only the third dumbest thing I've seen someone say in the last few hours. Of course, the other two related to Donald Trump being good at business despite driving multiple companies into bankruptcy where a common thread is, "Sure, you can have it - but only if Trumpikins isn't in charge any more."Your comment did bump down two other ones related to Trump though, so... bravo?

So you're saying yes, if Mini call their new car a van then van is an accurate description of it? I just want to be sure we're on the same page.

It's clear that when the Legends stats were drawn up for the HWK, whoever was doing the sourcebooks at the time wasn't paying attention to how little internal space it actually has. Unless its listed cargo capacity is referring to how large an external cargo pod it can dock with and haul around, there's no way that "150 tons of cargo" is accurate.

Of course, carrying cargo in external pods is a perfectly legitimate way for a freighter to operate, so that doesn't actually make the HWK not a freighter.

Ok. I concede. But it still seem like there should be an ultralight freighter class just for ships like the HWK.

Well, think of it like light pickup truck, heavy pickup truck, and semi-truck. The HWK is the light pickup, the YT-1300 is the heavy pickup, and the Bulk Freighter is a semi.

You just ignoring my point then? The manufacturers can call it whatever they like, that doesn't make it so. A Mini isn't a van whatever the manufacturers call it.

Blocked for stupidity. Sadly, that's only the third dumbest thing I've seen someone say in the last few hours. Of course, the other two related to Donald Trump being good at business despite driving multiple companies into bankruptcy where a common thread is, "Sure, you can have it - but only if Trumpikins isn't in charge any more."Your comment did bump down two other ones related to Trump though, so... bravo?

It's called the "HWK-290 Light Freighter" so yeah, freighter IS an accurate description.

That's a logical fallacy. The name of an item does not determine the item's properties. If Renault produce a compact car and call it "ABC-456 Heavy Tractor" that doesn't make "tractor" an accurate description of it.

Yeah. In Legends, the HWK-290 is described as a currier ship.

No, in Legends it's described as,

The HWK-290 was a light freighter manufactured by the Corellian Engineering Corporation during the decades leading up to the Battle of Naboo, in an effort to break into a new market for fast, small cargo ships. Unlike YT-series of ships for tramp captains, the Hawk line was aimed at more upscale clients, like wealthy merchants and noble politicians

Underlined and bolded the parts you seem to have such trouble understanding.

In canon, it's described as,

The HWK-290 freighter was a model of unarmed freighter modified by Rebel Alliance technicians to carry incendiary bombs during the Death Troopers invasion.

Do I have to define 'freighter for you?

A freighter, cargo ship, or barge was a kind of spacecraft used for hauling cargo from one place to another.

You're wrong. the HWK's a freighter. It was designed to carry cargo. If that cargo happens to be a player avatar named Kyle Katarn, than that's the cargo.

Please give up.

You gonna stand by the 29m measurement too?

Yes, it's 29 meters. That's a fact in its specifications. Just as are its description as freighter and its cargo hold.

The more I think about it, the more apt the truck comparison is - the HWK is a little pickup that can't haul much, the YT-1300 is a big ol' F-350 that can haul a serious load, and larger freighters are semi trucks dedicated to hauling bulk items. You can't say the HWK isn't a freighter because it's smaller than other freighters, just as you can't say a Toyota isn't a truck because it's smaller than a Peterbilt.

So what would it haul? Very small and high-value items. Holocubes, medicine - or maybe it's designed for a ordinary guy who'd want it for the same reason that I want a little pickup, to haul things around.

I´ve watched the first season and a half of the second one. The reason why I dislike the show is, that there is so much obvious bull I can´t stand it. I´ll name a few examples i remember:

1. The "Deathstar" B-Wing.

2. Vader dodges 7 A-Wings laser barrage. (I know Vader is an excellent pilot, and I really love that character, but that was exaggerated a lot)

3. Tie Advanced destroys corellian corvette in a few shots. (Happens a few seconds later)

4. Ezra joins the Imperial Academy and all the guys who like him sympathise with Rebels. The only ******* is loyal to the Empire, of course.

5. When these boys make their escape, the only one who stays behind makes up an excuse and every imperial on the base just buys it.

6. When the crew of the Ghost needs to get someone out of prison, the just assault it head on. And it works.

The show just doesn´t surprise me at any moment.

I´m not sure which ships came from the show, I remember only the Ghost and Gozanti. Gozanti looks really nice. But the Ghost and Phantom are just... meh.

Yes, it's 29 meters.

...Let me just show you how wrong you are.

Quibbling

Leaving out any prequel inconsistencies...

Any dumber than the Death Star not destroying Yavin rather than trying to fly around it to shoot at a moon?

Or dumber than R2-D2 somehow being able to magically produce any item he needs to solve a problem for the story? First a computer spike, then a buzzsaw, then a cattle prod, then a highly specific ejection compartment sized for a lightsaber...

Or dumber than Luke Skywalker being hidden from his father on the planet Anakin grew up on with Anakin's ACTUAL STEPBROTHER , with one of the few Jedi Masters left in the galaxy living within a casual droid's roll away, and Darth Vader somehow never checking back?

Or dumber than the whole Rebellion being put on hold for the Heroes as Leia established herself an undercover identity as a bounty hunter, Lando somehow get hired on as an anonymous guard despite being a fairly famous underworld guy himself, and try to do some elaborate heist instead of just doing a straight power play using the Alliance's might? If Han was important enough to the Alliance for them to give Leia and Luke all their vacaction days at once, you'd think that he'd be important enough to spare a Mon Cal Cruiser and a small invading force or two. Smuggler versus army?

Or dumber than (and I can't emphasize this enough) furry teddy bears establishing elaborate log based ambushes for Imperial forces and defeat their ground troops with stone axes and arrows? Seriously, watch that segment of RotJ again and think, "How much does one of those logs which just sandwiched the AT-ST weigh, how did the Ewoks manage to lift one - let alone two - in the day or two implied by the time gap, and how did they do so undetected within arms length of the Imperial base?"

If you've decided to hate a movie or show and THEN watch it, you can find countless ways to pick it apart and think, "This is the reason I hate it, it doesn't make sense, hurrah, I'm not being irrational!" when really you're just finding confirmation for your bias after the fact. The plot holes in Rebels are no greater or worse than in any other Star Wars production - less so IMHO - but because you want so badly to dislike them they're magnified all out of proportion.

As far as the HWK goes...

Golly gee, it looks like there's an edit war going on about the actual size of the HWK, fanboys *looks at name* raging back and forth about whether it's 29 or 16.5... one side being idiots and citing the guesswork WEG books and the other citing Lucasfilms and Lucasarts, and the only reason it's still listed as 29 meters is the wookiepedians refuse to let their creased WEG books go. Won't lie, I looked at the WEG books myself first and only noticed the edit war when you posted that video.

Seems I've stepped into a steaming horse turd of a fanboy quibble...

...that is completely irrelevant to the actual discussion going on - "Is the HWK a freighter?" Sorry, no distractions allowed.

It was designed to carry goods through interstellar distances.

The only detailed description of a named ship, the Moldy Crow, was used to smuggle illegal items during at least one point in its history.

It is, therefore, a freighter by the definition of that word.

Whether or not it's GOOD at the job is irrelevant - there are always duds and dead ends in any set of vehicles.

Yes, it's 29 meters.

...Let me just show you how wrong you are.

Just watched this 3 times. I didn't see anything about the length of a HWK.

EDIT: Never mind, I see they're standing next to it.

I don't care. It's a made up ship - it can be as long or as short as it needs to. It travels in parsecs remember.

Yes, it's 29 meters.

...Let me just show you how wrong you are.

Just watched this 3 times. I didn't see anything about the length of a HKW

At the very beginning, if the HWK is 29 meters long, then Jan and Kyle are about 3 meters tall - the scale is all off for 29 meters, but just about right for somewhere between 16 and 20.

Not coincidentally, the people at Lucasarts, who actually designed the HWK, apparently confirmed it as 16.5 meters for FFG, who then used that scale for their model.

Whereas the 29 meters scale is straight from the West End Games books, which have a habit of... well... making up statistics if they're not found within 5 minutes of research.

None of that size quibbling changes what the HWK-290 is, though: a small light freighter.

I'm just saying, you can't use Wook as a strong resource for this ship. I know this thing quite literally inside and out- though not as much as my good buddy Millennium Falsehood. He's the only person more familiar with the ship than I am.

Well, I can believe the Blade Wing prototype maser cannon since it fries the hyperdrive and that it seems to lack torpedo launchers.

The more I think about it, the more apt the truck comparison is - the HWK is a little pickup that can't haul much

Aah, I see. You don't actually know what freighter means do you? You're right, a pickup truck is a good analogy, and a pickup truck is not a freighter. Since you're ignorant on the matter, here's the definition curtesy of the Oxford University Press:

freighter

Pronunciation: /ˈfreɪtə/

NOUN

A large ship or aircraft designed to carry goods in bulk.

Basically, it's a transport.