However the single Raider/CR-90 list will kill transports and carriers but those list will die to the Starfighter wings. As for Starfighter wings the best will be the Scum & Villainy with the IG-8000 list.

List with transports is a Starfighter list. Transport cost ~45 points and leave a lot of place for small ships. Also Rebel Transport is perfect weapon against huge ships. Transport murders them (with starfighters help of course).

I am playing a local epic league with Rebel transport + 13 small ships. Won so far 6/6 games.

I played against:

- Rocket Tantive + z-95 and a-wings with missles;

- Tantive + some starfighters;

- Raider + 3 phantoms and 3-4 advanced;

- Gozanthi + TIE-Fighter/FO aces + Redline + Vader;

- 4xIG + 3xScouts;

- 4xIG + 4xTLT.

When you smash IG with transport, you instant kill ship that costs more than transport

Not quite, a pure starfighter list will play differently than a list with one or even two transports. Sure two Flotilla ships do take up less points than a Gunship like the CR-90 but in a flotilla list the ships are designed to support the fighters by screening the squadrons from fighters acting like obstacles to either draw fire or funnel them into a killzone of firing arcs. Or even act as a line breaker to plow through an attacking squadron. Because of those moves you can make with a 30 point huge ship they play differently than a list with nothing but standard large and small fighters.

With a starfighter wing (no huge ships) you are looking more or less for combos and synergies that might not be available in standard. IG-8000 is the perfect example, Biggs and the big dogs is another. Sure some of these combos could be included with lists that have a huge ship such as Jonus clan (larger version of Jonus Bros) but in lists that have huge ships the support and line and block order changes where it goes from Fighter to Ship (as for most gunship lists) ship to fighter (for all the flotilla lists) or fighter to fighter (as a list with 0 huge ships will be focused on).

Wow, it's been some time since I've read the Epic Dogfight tournament rules, and I found something I hadn't noticed before regarding Biggs Darklighter. I knew that he couldn't protect huge ships with his ability, only friendly large and small ships. However, I did not know that, "huge ships treat Biggs Darklighter's card text as blank when attacking." So if you're TIE fighters can't gun down Biggs fast enough to get to Wedge, don't sweat it: just have the Raider bypass Biggs and shoot directly at Wedge with its awesome primary weapon attack. Good to know.

The main thing about huge ship dice especially their primary attack is that huge ships attack dice are lees than standard ship attack dice because huge ships do not have the ability to focus or gain focus tokens. That being said if you take a gunship like raider or CR-90 you will need modifications like Jonus or Eskge which can modify attacks or an upgrade that can modify focus results like Han<crew> or does damage regardless of results like Vader<crew>.

That is why gunships which take at least 120-150 (half of the points) are played much differently than say two Gozanti carriers. in list like those the starfighters are set up to support the huge ships be it modification or even screening for fighters that would get behind them.

Wow. I did not catch that either.

Wow, it's been some time since I've read the Epic Dogfight tournament rules, and I found something I hadn't noticed before regarding Biggs Darklighter. I knew that he couldn't protect huge ships with his ability, only friendly large and small ships. However, I did not know that, "huge ships treat Biggs Darklighter's card text as blank when attacking." So if you're TIE fighters can't gun down Biggs fast enough to get to Wedge, don't sweat it: just have the Raider bypass Biggs and shoot directly at Wedge with its awesome primary weapon attack. Good to know.

While winning is my goal, any list brought that does not include a huge ship I want to destroy, annihilate, devastate. When Scum gets a huge ship I will lobby FFG that Epic must include a huge ship. Yes, I have issues

While winning is my goal, any list brought that does not include a huge ship I want to destroy, annihilate, devastate. When Scum gets a huge ship I will lobby FFG that Epic must include a huge ship. Yes, I have issues

Totally understandable, and I like your enthusiasm! Can't wait to see what kind of anti-swarm tech you come up with. I need to try some of my Epic squads against hordes of generics to get a feel for how to approach them, and to see what holes I need to plug in my squad composition. I know somebody is going to try something like spammy.

love to hear back on that. You break that problem and suddenly epic ships are worth the points. I just realized my list won't work. Don't have the cards I need and misplaced a TIE fighter dial. I need to change things up.

Ordnance tubes and Assault Missiles are a pretty good anti-spam deterrent.

Ordnance tubes and Assault Missiles are a pretty good anti-spam deterrent.

I agree. Sure, they can spread out to avoid the splash damage, but then they're not concentrating fire as well as they otherwise could. And even if you never trigger the splash damage, you still have a decent warhead shot for the whole game.

Ordnance tubes and Assault Missiles are a pretty good anti-spam deterrent.

I agree. Sure, they can spread out to avoid the splash damage, but then they're not concentrating fire as well as they otherwise could. And even if you never trigger the splash damage, you still have a decent warhead shot for the whole game.

Exactly. The main threat from swarms, especially for huge ships, is their ability to concentrate multiple fire arcs over a small area dealing lots of damage. Their main defense is the ability to 1) use lots of green dice and 2) spread their damage potential over multiple hulls. Destroying a single TIE fighter does not significantly impact the damage output of the swarm as a whole. Assault Missiles neatly address all three issues, removing green dice from the equation for the splash damage, dealing damage to multiple targets in a single attack, and punishing opponents who fly in close formation in order to put multiple arcs on the target.

They're a must in Epic/Cinematic games, IMO.

A theory, but maybe some Ion Torpedoes and a large ship running over some little guys? Ok...that is large part of my strategy...so you have me ALL figured out.

Never tried it on a swarm. Some mini-swarms and they went....SPLAT.

Faced a SCUM 4 IG88 + Dengar + Contracted Scouts list in a tourney. I lost, My B-Wings with Ion's never gained target lock before being burned down by the IG-88 and Torp boats. Still achieved some success with Nera B-Wing that I (later dropped for LT Blount)

Therefore, I have added LT Blount hoping to get that Target Lock. It did not help me in regionals in Seattle....Moved him out front and that darn Gozanti removed his target lock so I could not fire the Tracers. Still won that game, barely for the Regional Championship....but still have not proven the theory works.

Huge ships even with individual shots like Homing Missiles don't seem to do much damage to 3 Agility ships.

Considering moving to Raider + TIE/D Defenders for GenCon. But not sure if I can ever get any practice in by then.

However the single Raider/CR-90 list will kill transports and carriers but those list will die to the Starfighter wings. As for Starfighter wings the best will be the Scum & Villainy with the IG-8000 list.

List with transports is a Starfighter list. Transport cost ~45 points and leave a lot of place for small ships. Also Rebel Transport is perfect weapon against huge ships. Transport murders them (with starfighters help of course).

I am playing a local epic league with Rebel transport + 13 small ships. Won so far 6/6 games.

I played against:

- Rocket Tantive + z-95 and a-wings with missles;

- Tantive + some starfighters;

- Raider + 3 phantoms and 3-4 advanced;

- Gozanthi + TIE-Fighter/FO aces + Redline + Vader;

- 4xIG + 3xScouts;

- 4xIG + 4xTLT.

When you smash IG with transport, you instant kill ship that costs more than transport

I think the Transports are super fun and can be fairly inexpensive for what they can do. Not 100% aboard that Huge Ships should smash every ship but rather the small ship in the way rolls to see if they get destroyed (hit crits) and if not then they lose half of their base points rounded up (hull + shield)...now if that destroys them, so be it. Fly better.

Faced a SCUM 4 IG88 + Dengar + Contracted Scouts list in a tourney. I lost, My B-Wings with Ion's never gained target lock before being burned down by the IG-88 and Torp boats. Still achieved some success with Nera B-Wing that I (later dropped for LT Blount)

Yep, the prospect of contracted scouts in epic terrifies me.

Therefore, I have added LT Blount hoping to get that Target Lock. It did not help me in regionals in Seattle....Moved him out front and that darn Gozanti removed his target lock so I could not fire the Tracers. Still won that game, barely for the Regional Championship....but still have not proven the theory works.

And this proves my prediction that Suppressor will be a very common ship in the tournament. The only ways I can see to get around it are ability are pilot abilities that allow you to pass actions at the start of combat. For example, in your squad, if you had Airen Cracken next to Lt. Blount, he could fire and allow Blount to target lock in the combat phase to get his tracers off. But it's one of those things where if you build to counter Suppressor , you have to ask yourself if you're leaving yourself open to other squads.

Considering moving to Raider + TIE/D Defenders for GenCon. But not sure if I can ever get any practice in by then.

So here we are at just about a week before the event. Has anybody got some good practice in with their epic squad of choice? I know I haven't. It's so much easier to play the 100 point dogfight, but I am itching to get some huge ship(s) on the table!

Nope. I got some time with the list I'm NOT going to use though. It didn't work to where I feel it would have survived another epic list from an experienced player.

Plan B on paper should be effective and I've flown most of the ships regularly in other settings. Most of the cards are separated and bagged, and the bases assembled and pre-numbered to hold the cardboard in place during travel. Ten minutes to deploy everything and be game ready. Even applied some paint to the epic ship for some engine colour.

Plan C I go back to my standard epic Raider list and compensate for the loss of the TIE Fighter dial somehow. Not as easy as it sounds... It'll be an option though, I'm going to bring it as well.

Team epic on the other hand... I may be building that list the night before the event. I've got a list but it feels a bit light. Rebel support ship and escorts.

I'm excited for the team epic tournament, but I prolly need to read the rules a dozen or so times before then....and the upgrade cards.

I'm excited for the team epic tournament, but I prolly need to read the rules a dozen or so times before then....and the upgrade cards.

I made sure I have an FFG huge ships manual in my kit, including a printed update from FFG site. Are you playing team epic, or hovering around the tables in an official manner?

I just decalled my epic ship. "Mischief Maker" will be flying it's colours proudly in Saturday. Pro painter I'm not but gaming quality I can handle. I'll probably will also be pretty easy to spot with the big green Catalyst badge holder around my neck.

I'm judging the team epic

well, looks like roughly 25 teams worth of players so far. Hopefully you have plenty of time to float and watch rather than running and ruling. Though a little is good. Keeps ya sharp and connected.

Don't know why you'd want to waste points on huge ships.

Don't know why you'd want to waste points on huge ships.

I can see you don't play much Epic.

I've been fortunate enough to play in five Epic tournaments, and the winning build has included 1-2 Huge Ships in all of them.

I don't get why so many people can't see the value or potential of huge ships...? They are incredible and built and flown well they shape the entire battlefield.

Don't know why you'd want to waste points on huge ships.

I've always wanted to fight a desperate battle against incredible odds.

Because, quite simply, it's more fun. I'm in games for the fun. I'm not getting paid for victory nor do I do it for recognition. My lists are never meta. Besides, I've seen corvettes take out more than 200 points of ships on its own... 300 isn't much exaggeration. Knocked out a Raider and rammed through ships.

I don't know why you would feel my points are wasted.

Don't know why you'd want to waste points on huge ships.

I can see you don't play much Epic.

I've been fortunate enough to play in five Epic tournaments, and the winning build has included 1-2 Huge Ships in all of them.

I don't get why so many people can't see the value or potential of huge ships...? They are incredible and built and flown well they shape the entire battlefield.

Throw out some low quality attacks for a bunch of points. The rebel transport is the best one because it has the best offense epic ships have(ramming small ships) but isn't as garbage on the price but it still sucks.

Epic tournaments are cesspools of hobbyists and don't have the level of analysis and play that would really make any results from them telling.

Sorry you feel that way Panzeh. You're not alone of course, and I do expect to face the win at all cost, numbers says I should use these type people. Whether or not I succeed in beating them is my problem alone and not one I lose sleep on.

"WE NEED MORE SHIPS!"

Whoops. Joe, are Klingon's the 4th faction now?

Epic tournaments are cesspools of hobbyists and don't have the level of analysis and play that would really make any results from them telling.

lol, welcome to my ignore list, Cheryl!