Expose still remains worse than a focus token unless you have another form of dice modification .

I wonder, though, if it's not better with more ships? You will get a greater variance of numbers with 3 dice that aren't modified. Maybe you get more hits through overall? Well...it would be chancy.

... a Huge ship can use Coordinate to allow....

You know, I think the Coordinate action should give a lot of ally ships a free action. Otherwise, it's just not worth it so much. One ship isn't so important that it gets an action over the epic ship. Maybe if a number of ships got it, it would be worth it. Am I wrong?

In theory, with more shots, you have a greater chance of some massively outlying results. However, dice results tend to get closer to a statistically average distribution, not less, the more you roll.

I'm not saying expose is useless, just that it's not worth taking on its own. As I said, if you're pairing Youngster with Howlrunner, expose does become worth considering. It's a useless combination in a 'normal' game, because spending ~40 points on 'support ships' to slightly improve 60 points of 'fighting strength' is a losing proposition. Since in epic Howlrunner could easily be flying at the heart of a 7-ship box, and those ships could be Crack Shot Black Squadron Pilots, it becomes worth it.

It's like marksmanship; normally it's an inferior alternative to a focus token; only justifiable for pilots with a special ability triggering off criticals or with multiple attacks per turn. In epic, giving a 12-ship TIE fighter swarm marksmanship for a little over a point each is worth considering, since criticals on epic ships tend to be pretty brutal.

XX-23 S-Thread tracers are worth a thought for a similar reason; a 4-5 ship bomber element can quite realistically blow the front off a corvette in a single pass if armed properly.

The free action - it depends. Using co-ordinate to give a TIE fighter a focus token is definitely useless. But if the action is being handed to a large ship, or an expensive ace? Remember that Co-ordinate happens when the large ship moves - which is essentially PS12 + Large Ship's own PS. Being able to hand a boost action to a Decimator or YT-2400 after the Darth Vaders and the Poe Damerons have moved is seriously powerful. Imagine trying to get into the Outrider's blind spot if Dash was PS12....

Equally, the action may make the difference between firing an advanced proton torpedo or not. Getting an APT shot to work generally requires three actions - target lock, focus, and boost or barrel roll (because no sane person will let you get a frontal arc range 1 shot with a guy carrying advanced torpedoes if they can avoid it). Even with Push The Limit or similar, pulling all three actions in a single turn is hard.

The free action - it depends. Using co-ordinate to give a TIE fighter a focus token is definitely useless. But if the action is being handed to a large ship, or an expensive ace? Remember that Co-ordinate happens when the large ship moves - which is essentially PS12 + Large Ship's own PS. Being able to hand a boost action to a Decimator or YT-2400 after the Darth Vaders and the Poe Damerons have moved is seriously powerful. Imagine trying to get into the Outrider's blind spot if Dash was PS12....

Equally, the action may make the difference between firing an advanced proton torpedo or not. Getting an APT shot to work generally requires three actions - target lock, focus, and boost or barrel roll (because no sane person will let you get a frontal arc range 1 shot with a guy carrying advanced torpedoes if they can avoid it). Even with Push The Limit or similar, pulling all three actions in a single turn is hard.

I get that it might help some sort of ace, but I've found that aces don't really last long in Epic, anyways. Getting one action probably won't save that ace from getting blasted by whatever focus fires on it. The only exception I can think of is Focus to Poe. It is hard to arc dodge a lot of enemy ships in Epic, so giving someone a Boost or BR doesn't really accomplish as much in the big games. At least...that's what I've found.

Agreed. A large ship might, though. Or if the action is focus (for poe dameron) or cloak (for a phantom) it's probably significant. Or a boost to put you in range when otherwise you wouldn't be.

Look at it this way: in both corvettes, the section with 'co-ordinate' shares the space on its action bar with 'target lock'. On an ordnance boat, there's no contest, but if you're firing hardpoint guns, yes, a target lock is nice, but you don't necessarily need it. If spending a target lock would turn a 2 dice primary weapon shot into a 4+ dice torpedo shot, I think you're getting more payoff from Co-ordinate.

I agree, but I think it's a bit of a missed chance to do something more. I can see the Coordinate action giving 4 ships within range a free action. Now, that would be cool to do!

I agree, but I think it's a bit of a missed chance to do something more. I can see the Coordinate action giving 4 ships within range a free action. Now, that would be cool to do!

How does it give "4" ships actions? I thought it was only 1 ship.

Ordnance tubes, Jan ors Lubes, now with Shara on the horizon CR-90 is the beast that can dish 4\4 or 5\5 shots with her help and help from Han crew.

just...well... STAY AWAY FROM FETT CREW O_O

he'll leap forth and eat your ammo stocks (tubes card) and make missiles one-use-only once again!

What is the best anti-fighter build for a raider or cr-90? Imo single turbos are out, quads are too close range and ion batteries are great minus the limited damage. Ordinance is still new to me but I haved used homing missles on occasion and they seem pretty good. Just want to know other peoples opinions or if someone has the numbers calculated. Thanks for your time and any responses, if this is covered in another post any links would be appreciated. May the force be with you all.

In my testing, nobody in their right mind allowed Assault Missiles to wreck an expensive Fighter Screen. And the "force them to break formation" isn't exactly worth it when Concussion Missiles + Ordnance Experts combo converts two Blanks to Hits.

Here is the Missile-Loadout (Raider) I really enjoy flying:

https://geordanr.github.io/xwing/?f=Galactic%20Empire&d=v4!e!129:14,157,-1:-1:-1:;130:146,29,13,-1,-1,-1,-1:32:23:&sn=Unnamed%20Squadron

I agree, but I think it's a bit of a missed chance to do something more. I can see the Coordinate action giving 4 ships within range a free action. Now, that would be cool to do!

Four ships might be too many, but I agree with the sentiment. I've found that the Coordinate action is only worth it when the huge ship is too far away from everything else to do anything. It's really a last-resort sort of action. Compare it to Fleet Officer on a huge ship. Now for that same action, you can hand out focus tokens to the same range (1-2), and the stress doesn't affect the huge ship. Handing out tokens instead of free actions is great because it works on stressed ships and it lets you double focus, which is useful in epic matches when ships are likely to take more fire from different sources. Problem is, crew slots are really at a premium on huge ships. But if I were building a support ship that was all about coordination, I'd definitely pick Fleet Officer over relying on the Coordinate action.

I agree, but I think it's a bit of a missed chance to do something more. I can see the Coordinate action giving 4 ships within range a free action. Now, that would be cool to do!

How does it give "4" ships actions? I thought it was only 1 ship.

It is currently only 1 ship. We're saying that giving 1 ship a free action isn't powerful enough to warrant its use in most situations.

One good situation in which Coordinate is good: I loaded up my CR90 with Single Turbolasers, but now the fight has moved to range 1-2. I have no shots, so I will help my starfighter screen to fight better by using coordinate. Situational, but it has happened.

EDIT: Incidentally, this is when the Dodonna's Pride title is really good. I've always wanted to make that title work.

You missed Scum. Oh wait...

Got you covered as we wait for FFG.

LINK

As mentioned in the squad builder above, I'm a fan of cluster missile on one of your hardpoints. Great for point blank work and really good against any enemy epic ship that strays too close as well. One thing to consider is mixing your hardpoints.

If you run an all ordnance build, you are hurting for target locks even with weap engineer. I say mix and match, and put all of that energy to good use. Nothing says you cannot run a quad laser or even a single turbolaser alongside 2 hardpoints equipped with ordnance tubes. in this way, you do something productive with your energy and don't get in such a bind with target locks.

As ordnance builds go, I have had more success with the CR-90, but I have had some fun with the raider as well.

As mentioned in the squad builder above, I'm a fan of cluster missile on one of your hardpoints. Great for point blank work and really good against any enemy epic ship that strays too close as well. One thing to consider is mixing your hardpoints.

If you run an all ordnance build, you are hurting for target locks even with weap engineer. I say mix and match, and put all of that energy to good use. Nothing says you cannot run a quad laser or even a single turbolaser alongside 2 hardpoints equipped with ordnance tubes. in this way, you do something productive with your energy and don't get in such a bind with target locks.

As ordnance builds go, I have had more success with the CR-90, but I have had some fun with the raider as well.

If you're running ordnance and you run out of target locks you need to learn to love other munitions. Note, I will not say you are doing it wrong... Concussion missiles self-modify but eat your lock. Homing missiles and ion missiles can be fired all day upon the same target. Average shot does less, but you can keep sending more out the launch tubes. Nothing I love more than saving energy for other toys while smashing rebels with missiles.

Clusters are nice, but they are a fire last weapon since they eat your lock as well.

Use weapons engineer to collect two locks so if Janson takes one before you fire you smash the secondary target.

The only real flaw for an ordnance heavy ship is if the enemy is geared for a long range battle and your approach vector isn't getting you close fast enough.

I'm curious about your CR90 build though. I've been worried the overlapping fire isn't focused close enough in for ordnance and is better suited for the longer ranged lasers.

I'd agree you always want to mix ordnance types. Impetuous title (giving you free locks) and a Homing missile in the prow is better than you think - a homing missile + primary can often net you a kill - giving you a free lock for next turn; I've had the raider still keep fighting surprisingly effectively after losing the half of the ship with the target lock action!

The CR-90 definitely strikes me as the ship for long ranged turbolaser fire. Since you want to fly 'broadside on', you can hold the range open (good versus missile boats) but don't get much mileage from reinforce (because your opponent will simply shoot the other section) - optimised generators go a long way to making up for power-hungry turbolasers, which in turn make up for the issue of focus results. As with all epic ships it needs fighter cover, though. A few quad laser shots won't make up for the amount of incoming damage.

The only real flaw for an ordnance heavy ship is if the enemy is geared for a long range battle and your approach vector isn't getting you close fast enough.

Aha! Another use for Coordinate! If you are out of range to launch ordnance with your Huge ship, but your fighter screen is out front at range 2, it's not unlikely that they have shots at the enemy, and you can pick one of the soft targets to take a defensive action, or a heavy fighter to take an action to increase offense. It's not much, but it's better than nothing.

My favorite Coordinate anecdote was when Rexlar Brath was at range 1 of my Alpha Sq. Pilot ready to light him up, and I used Coordinate to make my TIE interceptor barrel roll out of Rexlar's arc and get his own sweet range 1 shot. It was glorious! And of course, Grand Moff Tarkin took away Rexlar's Focus token while Suppressor took away his evade from the /x7 title

I think Coordinate and Sensor Jammer are more for those Cinematic games, like the epic campaigns than really for epic games. Once you get into that many ships, then the epic ship actions become precious. Still, I could be wrong, but that's just what I've seen.

Target Lock conservation is pretty key, as if you've got lots of weapons on the CR90 it's difficult to modify all your shots. And why Jonus with the Raider may just be an auto-include.

I played an Epic game with Homers on the CR90 and ended up getting screwed by the Scrambled Scopes crit (can't target lock). Before you call it random, keep in mind how small the damage deck is for the Huge ships, so chances of drawing are higher than usual, and it's incredibly crippling for an ordnance boat.

I'll echo that mixing your weapons is key, namely the ranges. Otherwise, you'll be missing out on shots.

I have been in the Gozanti thread and I have to say that a Gozanti with the Suppressor title and Sensor Team can just troll an ordnance epic ship like nobody else! Throw on Weapons Engineer and you can target both halves and remove two TL a turn from an epic ship. That would brutally shut down an ordnance ship.

Yes, I know it has nothing to do with anti fighter epic, but it's just an idea that I saw with all the talk of ordnance epic ships.

I have been in the Gozanti thread and I have to say that a Gozanti with the Suppressor title and Sensor Team can just troll an ordnance epic ship like nobody else! Throw on Weapons Engineer and you can target both halves and remove two TL a turn from an epic ship. That would brutally shut down an ordnance ship.

Yes, I know it has nothing to do with anti fighter epic, but it's just an idea that I saw with all the talk of ordnance epic ships.

Close, except that the title says, "Once per round," so you can't remove two target locks. Weapons Engineer is a great card to have if you expect to see the Suppressor (and between you and me, I expect to see a LOT of Suppressor s).

I have been in the Gozanti thread and I have to say that a Gozanti with the Suppressor title and Sensor Team can just troll an ordnance epic ship like nobody else! Throw on Weapons Engineer and you can target both halves and remove two TL a turn from an epic ship. That would brutally shut down an ordnance ship.

Yes, I know it has nothing to do with anti fighter epic, but it's just an idea that I saw with all the talk of ordnance epic ships.

Close, except that the title says, "Once per round," so you can't remove two target locks. Weapons Engineer is a great card to have if you expect to see the Suppressor (and between you and me, I expect to see a LOT of Suppressor s).

Problem #2:

- The Gozanti is PS 2

- The Raider and corvette are PS 4

The Gozanti will therefore move first, activate his ability first, but the best he can do is hope to remove the target lock of the enemy capital ship from the previous round, forcing it to reacquire one upon its activation.

So many variables to keep in mind

Oh, the Gozanti is PS 2! I thought they were all the same. Gotcha....

I have been in the Gozanti thread and I have to say that a Gozanti with the Suppressor title and Sensor Team can just troll an ordnance epic ship like nobody else! Throw on Weapons Engineer and you can target both halves and remove two TL a turn from an epic ship. That would brutally shut down an ordnance ship.

Yes, I know it has nothing to do with anti fighter epic, but it's just an idea that I saw with all the talk of ordnance epic ships.

Close, except that the title says, "Once per round," so you can't remove two target locks. Weapons Engineer is a great card to have if you expect to see the Suppressor (and between you and me, I expect to see a LOT of Suppressor s).

Problem #2:

- The Gozanti is PS 2

- The Raider and corvette are PS 4

The Gozanti will therefore move first, activate his ability first, but the best he can do is hope to remove the target lock of the enemy capital ship from the previous round, forcing it to reacquire one upon its activation.

So many variables to keep in mind

I think you mostly want to use it against fighters, not against other capital ships. The PS difference certainly does keep you from stopping an ordnance tubes ship, but you can still stop fighter/bombers from laying into your other ships.

I have been in the Gozanti thread and I have to say that a Gozanti with the Suppressor title and Sensor Team can just troll an ordnance epic ship like nobody else! Throw on Weapons Engineer and you can target both halves and remove two TL a turn from an epic ship. That would brutally shut down an ordnance ship.

Yes, I know it has nothing to do with anti fighter epic, but it's just an idea that I saw with all the talk of ordnance epic ships.

Close, except that the title says, "Once per round," so you can't remove two target locks. Weapons Engineer is a great card to have if you expect to see the Suppressor (and between you and me, I expect to see a LOT of Suppressor s).

Problem #2:

- The Gozanti is PS 2

- The Raider and corvette are PS 4

The Gozanti will therefore move first, activate his ability first, but the best he can do is hope to remove the target lock of the enemy capital ship from the previous round, forcing it to reacquire one upon its activation.

So many variables to keep in mind

I think you mostly want to use it against fighters, not against other capital ships. The PS difference certainly does keep you from stopping an ordnance tubes ship, but you can still stop fighter/bombers from laying into your other ships.

Until their Huge ship uses coordinate See! Not totally useless after all. But I definitely agree that the Suppressor is designed with an anti-fighter role in mind. I love, love, LOVE this loadout, but it's super expensive:

Gozanti (40)

Suppresssor (6)

Grand Moff Tarkin (6)

Targeting Coordinator (4)

Comms Booster (4)

Docking Clamps (0)(depends if you use it as a carrier or not)

Engineering Team (4)

Automated Protocols (5)

TOTAL 69

Like I said, it's a whopper. But it's such a valuable support ship, and with no weapons it is almost always ignored until it's too late. And if it isn't ignored, well, you make them pay for attacking the Moff!

Co-ordinating a Suppressor Gozanti from a raider is a nice trick!

When I've taken Suppressor, it's usually been with a Dual Laser Turret, but even the weaponless version looks good.

Unfortunately huge ships can't take free actions, so coordinate doesn't work. Automated Protocols is the only way a huge ship can free action.