I've put together a 100 pt build using two ships I've never flown before and would like some input on how I should deploy and fly them.
TRIAL BY FIRE
100 points
• Guri StarViper
Adaptability Virago Autothrusters Sensor Jammer
Black Sun Soldier #1 Z-95 Headhunter
Concussion Missiles Guidance Chips
Black Sun Soldier #2 Z-95 Headhunter
Concussion Missiles Guidance Chips
• Torkhil Mux HWK-290
Blaster Turret Recon Specialist Moldy Crow
In my experience, both the HWK and the star viper are relatively squishy for their points and die easily unless you make effort to preserve them. The easiest way to do this is to be a little creative in your approaches to deny shots on them during the opening exchange of fire (they can survive quite well if only 1 ship, or ideally none, are shooting at them each turn).
It looks like you are going for a 'mini-alpha-strike' list here, hoping to drop something to PS0 and nuke it before it fires. However, I don't think your list will actually work as intended against quite a number of enemy ship types.
First of all, it is not easy to get Torkhil into the needed R2 band to activate his ability without either cloaking device or engine upgrade (both of which are quite handy in limiting return fire too)
PS3 ordnance carriers can easily get their needed TLs vs lower PS (1 or 2) but will not be able to alpha anything PS 4 or higher (and even PS 3 is initiative/luck dependent).
Lastly, I've found Guri (and all star vipers really) to work best outside of formation. Xizor likes to be in formation or at least close to some buddies for his ability, but otherwise, the star viper dial and action bar really excels when given free range to capitalize on the unpredictable factor at its disposal. Guri in particular can really get some work done with predator (although I really like Lone Wolf since its won me some games). So I would suggest trying to get one of those on there instead of the mostly useless adaptability card...
If you want to throw concussion missiles with generic Z-95s, I think you might be better of with the Rebel version. The Scum Z-95s trade a point of PS for an illicit slot that you aren't using.
I think this is close to what you were going for but using rebel ships. A three dice attack, a TLT attack, and two concussion missiles have a good chance of taking out most ships PS3 or lower before it has a chance to shoot. Poe and the Stressbot with two Z-95s as blockers should give you some tools against aces as well.
Tala Squadron Pilot (13)
I was trying this build in order to actually use a couple of ships that I have never touched. Adaptability was used as I was out of points. Perhaps I should replace the two z's with something else.
I was trying this build in order to actually use a couple of ships that I have never touched. Adaptability was used as I was out of points. Perhaps I should replace the two z's with something else.
Ah, okay. That makes sense. Guri is a ton of fun to play.
I was trying this build in order to actually use a couple of ships that I have never touched. Adaptability was used as I was out of points. Perhaps I should replace the two z's with something else.
Ah, okay. That makes sense. Guri is a ton of fun to play.
This could be fun to play. It keeps all the same pilots you were using but switches up the upgrades. Torkil has stealth device to let him get into (or out of combat) in a hurry. If he drops an named pilot down to 0, both he and Guri get to reroll two dice against them. The Z-95s can block aces and their feedback arrays can make range one of Torkil a scary place to end up. Dropping the Z-95s to Pirates gets you two more points to spend.Guri (30)Predator (3)Sensor Jammer (4)Autothrusters (2)Virago (1)Torkil Mux (19)Twin Laser Turret (6)Dengar (3)Cloaking Device (2)Black Sun Soldier (13)Feedback Array (2)Black Sun Soldier (13)Feedback Array (2)Total: 100
If you switch Torkil out for Palob you lose some synergy with Guri's Predator and the ability for the Zs to atack before his target. You would get Palob to strip tokens before Guri attack with both with his ability and with his TLT instead. He also helps Guri get more mileage out of her Sensor Jammer.
He'll look like Tycho after taking a few shots. Use Zuckuss to make them reroll as much as possible, their actions are worth more than yours so it's fine that you'll never get another one. Glitterstim is optional but it lets you modify both of your TLT shots and all of your defense rolls for a stress that you are probably never going to clear because it's just going on to the big stack of tokens Zuckuss will get you. Wired is there to allow you to modify attack and defense rolls once you've gone crazy with Zuckuss.
Edited by WWHSD
I was trying this build in order to actually use a couple of ships that I have never touched. Adaptability was used as I was out of points. Perhaps I should replace the two z's with something else.
Ah, okay. That makes sense. Guri is a ton of fun to play.
This could be fun to play. It keeps all the same pilots you were using but switches up the upgrades. Torkil has stealth device to let him get into (or out of combat) in a hurry. If he drops an named pilot down to 0, both he and Guri get to reroll two dice against them. The Z-95s can block aces and their feedback arrays can make range one of Torkil a scary place to end up. Dropping the Z-95s to Pirates gets you two more points to spend.Guri (30)Predator (3)Sensor Jammer (4)Autothrusters (2)Virago (1)Torkil Mux (19)Twin Laser Turret (6)Dengar (3)Cloaking Device (2)Black Sun Soldier (13)Feedback Array (2)Black Sun Soldier (13)Feedback Array (2)Total: 100
If you switch Torkil out for Palob you lose some synergy with Guri's Predator and the ability for the Zs to atack before his target. You would get Palob to strip tokens before Guri attack with both with his ability and with his TLT instead. He also helps Guri get more mileage out of her Sensor Jammer.
Palob Godalhi (20)Wired (1)Twin Laser Turret (6)Zuckuss (1)Glitterstim (2)He'll look like Tycho after taking a few shots. Use Zuckuss to make them reroll as much as possible, their actions are worth more than yours so it's fine that you'll never get another one. Glitterstim is optional but it lets you modify both of your TLT shots and all of your defense rolls for a stress that you are probably never going to clear because it's just going on to the big stack of tokens Zuckuss will get you. Wired is there to allow you to modify attack and defense rolls once you've gone crazy with Zuckuss.
Palob is a better HWK-man, by miles (I'd even say between every pilot available, Rebels included). Drop the Zs to Binayres and don't look back.
But I'd leave Cloaking Device on him as well. That repositioning is gold. And you can even include Inertial Dampeners on Guri with the leftover, just because.
Edited by K GenesisAh, okay. That makes sense. Guri is a ton of fun to play.
This could be fun to play. It keeps all the same pilots you were using but switches up the upgrades. Torkil has stealth device to let him get into (or out of combat) in a hurry. If he drops an named pilot down to 0, both he and Guri get to reroll two dice against them. The Z-95s can block aces and their feedback arrays can make range one of Torkil a scary place to end up. Dropping the Z-95s to Pirates gets you two more points to spend.
Guri (30)
Predator (3)
Sensor Jammer (4)
Autothrusters (2)
Virago (1)
Torkil Mux (19)
Twin Laser Turret (6)
Dengar (3)
Cloaking Device (2)
Black Sun Soldier (13)
Feedback Array (2)
Black Sun Soldier (13)
Feedback Array (2)
Total: 100
If you switch Torkil out for Palob you lose some synergy with Guri's Predator and the ability for the Zs to atack before his target. You would get Palob to strip tokens before Guri attack with both with his ability and with his TLT instead. He also helps Guri get more mileage out of her Sensor Jammer.
Palob Godalhi (20)
Wired (1)
Twin Laser Turret (6)
Zuckuss (1)
Glitterstim (2)
He'll look like Tycho after taking a few shots. Use Zuckuss to make them reroll as much as possible, their actions are worth more than yours so it's fine that you'll never get another one. Glitterstim is optional but it lets you modify both of your TLT shots and all of your defense rolls for a stress that you are probably never going to clear because it's just going on to the big stack of tokens Zuckuss will get you. Wired is there to allow you to modify attack and defense rolls once you've gone crazy with Zuckuss.
Palob is better HWK-man, by miles (I'd even say between every pilot available, Rebels included). Drop the Zs to Binayres and don't look back. But I'd leave Cloaking Device on him as well. That repositioning is gold. And you can even include Inertial Dampeners on Guri with the leftover, just because.
I'm wondering why everyone is putting TLT's on Palob and Torkil. With their pilot abilities only being effective at range 1 or 2, doesn't that make them less effective without a turret ability at range 1? Wouldn't it be a more efficient fighting machine with a turret that can also fire at ranges 1 and 2?
Cloaking device with Zuckuss on board is pointless, isn't it?Palob is better HWK-man, by miles (I'd even say between every pilot available, Rebels included). Drop the Zs to Binayres and don't look back. But I'd leave Cloaking Device on him as well. That repositioning is gold. And you can even include Inertial Dampeners on Guri with the leftover, just because.
I'm wondering why everyone is putting TLT's on Palob and Torkil. With their pilot abilities only being effective at range 1 or 2, doesn't that make them less effective without a turret ability at range 1? Wouldn't it be a more efficient fighting machine with a turret that can also fire at ranges 1 and 2?
No, it isn't.
Cloaking Device is meant to facilitate your first engagement from a safe distance and arc (effect-wise) and is bound to malfunction. It's a safe investment to protect him form early fire.
And you're not the first person to wonder about TLT on them. But you, like most people, assume that the target affected by their effect and the target of their attacks must be the same, for some reason. It mustn't and it won't 90% of the time.
TLT makes both more efficient fighters by giving them something to do at all ranges, while every other turret leaves them sitting ducks at R3. Any turn that they're simply doing nothing because they can't is a wasted opportunity for them to affect the outcome of the match. That's why you take TLT on them, aside from the fact that it is the best turret available by default.
Cloaking device with Zuckuss on board is pointless, isn't it?Palob is better HWK-man, by miles (I'd even say between every pilot available, Rebels included). Drop the Zs to Binayres and don't look back. But I'd leave Cloaking Device on him as well. That repositioning is gold. And you can even include Inertial Dampeners on Guri with the leftover, just because.
I'm wondering why everyone is putting TLT's on Palob and Torkil. With their pilot abilities only being effective at range 1 or 2, doesn't that make them less effective without a turret ability at range 1? Wouldn't it be a more efficient fighting machine with a turret that can also fire at ranges 1 and 2?
No, it isn't.
Cloaking Device is meant to facilitate your first engagement from a safe distance and arc (effect-wise) and is bound to malfunction. It's a safe investment to protect him form early fire.
And you're not the first person to wonder about TLT on them. But you, like most people, assume that the target affected by their effect and the target of their attacks must be the same, for some reason. It mustn't and it won't 90% of the time.
TLT makes both more efficient fighters by giving them something to do at all ranges, while every other turret leaves them sitting ducks at R3. Any turn that they're simply doing nothing because they can't is a wasted opportunity for them to affect the outcome of the match. That's why you take TLT on them, aside from the fact that it is the best turret available by default.
Excellent points
One other thing: ironically enough, TLT ends up being cheaper on an HWK compared to other turrets, because all the other turrets need either moldy crow (blaster) and/or engine (autoblaster/dorsal) to get the most out of them (although TLT is best with engine too, it can get by without it for people running HWKs on the cheap)
I've always found Blaster Turret to be much worse in game than it is in on paper. If you've got the focus tokens to shoot and modify your Blaster Turret you could have modified both shots with a TLT. Getting blocked, stressed, or Jaxed, can potentially shut down your turret.
I do think that the dorsal turret is decent for a HWK on a budget if you just want the support ability as cheaply as possible. Being able to put Palob on the board for 23 points isn't bad. He's annoying enough to shoot first, but cheap enough to make you second guess that decision.
I've always found Blaster Turret to be much worse in game than it is in on paper. If you've got the focus tokens to shoot and modify your Blaster Turret you could have modified both shots with a TLT. Getting blocked, stressed, or Jaxed, can potentially shut down your turret.
I do think that the dorsal turret is decent for a HWK on a budget if you just want the support ability as cheaply as possible. Being able to put Palob on the board for 23 points isn't bad. He's annoying enough to shoot first, but cheap enough to make you second guess that decision.
Indeed, a budget Palob is still an annoying Palob. His ability is a powerful enough deterrent to justify his place on the table.
But having a range limit for his turret and not packing EU is hard. I do support Blaster Turret on him, though, but you must invest and make him an ace. Which isn't bad at all.
Torkil too, for that matter. I like Palob more, but Torkil can mess up priority like a baws.