How would you do it? Where are the problem areas? Do you hit it every time your opponent needs to act?
E.g. squadron overlap. This might get tricky. Or, navigating through a pile of crap- whose timer, if any, starts rolling while you mark and remove pieces?
Has anyone actually tried this?
No.
And I'd have to be ludicrously Drunk and playing with an Open bar to consider trying...
Bad Idea, rounds vary so much. Sometimes round 1 and 2 is only movement, then round 3 and 4 are all action, then round 5 and 6 is cleanup. Sometimes round 1 and 2 is all combat (fleet ambush) and the game is over by round 3. So, I don't even know where you would declare as time limits since the timing of actions does change so much. I have not had a game go to time yet.
Re-placing overlapped squadrons is relatively painless, so I wouldn't overthink that. The main problem I see is that carrier fleets by their nature take a lot more time to play out than ship-based fleets. I like the idea though, my local store has a couple notoriously slow players, and I think if they tried something like this in casual play it could help them out.
I like the timer method on mtg online... you have a time bank of 25 minutes that you draw from, if you run out of time before winning, you lose the round... I suppose a similar system could be worked out, but translating it into real life might be cumbersome, difficult to implement...
Bad Idea, rounds vary so much. Sometimes round 1 and 2 is only movement, then round 3 and 4 are all action, then round 5 and 6 is cleanup. Sometimes round 1 and 2 is all combat (fleet ambush) and the game is over by round 3. So, I don't even know where you would declare as time limits since the timing of actions does change so much. I have not had a game go to time yet.
Not sure if you understand how the clock works: it's not round dependent, there's total time that goes down whenever it's your responsibility to do something ( in chess, that's just move a piece).
You're perfectly in your rights to slow down at times and be speedy in others, but if you run out of your own time you lose. It keeps the game from bogging down into attempting to visualize 9 moves ahead every turn.
How would you do it?
Chess clock at each table off to one side. Take the round time (135 minutes) and split it as evenly as possible (let's say 68 minutes per player) on each side. Clock is used up whenever a player is making a decision, taking an action, or rolling dice. So you use up time when you are:
At player discretion you can keep your clock running when an opponent is doing something that takes nearly no time (like rolling Counter dice, for example). Otherwise time just goes back and forth. If/when a player's time runs out, the game instantly ends after they complete their current action (current attack, maneuvering, etc.), and then they are considered tabled. This is the "deathclock" format for timed events and encourages speedy play to keep events running smoothly.
You'd have to figure out how to resolve the time consumption for objectives like Contested Outpost or Fire Lanes where end-of-turn calculating needs to be done for both players. I'd be amenable to pausing the deathclock or having it be alternating player responsibility. I think pausing is fairest in a situation like that.
Where are the problem areas?
Players forgetting to flip time to their opponent when they are done with an action. In practice I rarely saw this happen or become a serious problem. Once it was discovered, both players estimated the "forgotten" time and just evened it out (example: oh crap I figure I just accidentally used up 5 minutes of your time, here have the next 5 minutes on me, okay? okay!).
Slow players can struggle with deathclock losses. Not to sound callous but... that's a good thing. Slow players make running a tournament a nightmare. Three rounds is going to eat up 7 hours of time minimum, slow-mo players are going to make it even worse. This is our personal time we're giving up, let's make it count. If you're still slow, please practice at casual game night until you are not and then please come play in our tournaments. Otherwise be aware that Big Bad Mister Clock is gonna gitcha!
Sometimes players get caught up in the clock and rush themselves. In all honesty, most half-decent players won't lose due to clock.
Chess clocks aren't "no big deal" cheap (usually $20-$30 at cheapest) and you need to provide them in sufficient quantity. You may have problems raising the funds initially.
You need to be SURE that you're splitting the total time evenly. Attempts to provide players with even less time than they should otherwise get will disincentivize more time-intensive lists (lots of activations/squadrons in Armada). Deathclock intrinsically has a mild disincentive for that kind of play but it's not too strong. The only time I ever saw someone not bring something in Warmachine due to deathclock was because it was a very ineffective unit that took a very long time to resolve its actions (due to lots of AOE templates drifting all over to little effect) and thus consumed A LOT of time for very little real benefit. I can't think of anything in Armada that would have a problem like that.
Do you hit it every time your opponent needs to act?
Yep. At least in theory. Again, if it's a very short response action (like taking damage cards from a deck, rolling for Counter real quick, the enemy decides on defense tokens in 5 seconds or less) then it's really not a big deal and I wouldn't sweat it. So long as the two players agree beforehand (which was common in the Warmachine tournaments I played) as to when slapping the timer was appropriate, it's no big deal.
The big important thing to realize is that neither player wants to lose to deathclock and both players realize that the system works smoothly and pleasantly provided they don't antagonize one another with the clock by being pedantic. It's effectively player A vs. player B vs. the clock, and even if you want to beat player B, both of you hate the clock and so you'll "team up" to keep the game humming along.
E.g. squadron overlap. This might get tricky. Or, navigating through a pile of crap- whose timer, if any, starts rolling while you mark and remove pieces?
Whoever is placing the squadrons uses their time.
Whoever is navigating through a pile of crap uses their time.
It's expected that your opponent wants to help you resolve these as quickly as possible, however.
Has anyone actually tried this?
In Armada, no. I'd like to try it, though. In Warmachine it made tournaments run so much more quickly.
Edited by SnipafistI like chess clocks. I am a warmachine hordes player and are accustomed to them
They do stop a lot of things like burning time. I have not seen it come up but its easy enough to get kill a ship and then slow play till time winds down if you really want.
It would also punish MSU style lists which may or may not be a good thing. Clock management would add another layer to fleet design.
Chess clocks are very expensive and require a bit of official ruling to make sure there is no abuse.
They also add to the barrier of entry to newer players who don't know the math at the start. rolling attack dice, then clocking over for defense tokens and then clocking back again could lead to clock mishaps.
To be fair i rarely see games go to time as well. The problem with the events length is usually due to a TO not being proactive as games end.
I play chess. Clocks work great there and managing the clock is an important and integral aspect of the game. Armada has so much back and forth that I'm not sure how worthwhile the clock is. Someone mentioned the per round time above, and that might be the best way to use a clock, rather than a lump sum of time per game.
I get the impression some do not understand how the clock works.
In chess, it is common for the tournaments to list a time control. For example, G/90 would be a reasonable common time control. That means that each player gets 90 minutes in which to make all of their moves. They can spend that however they like, but when it is up, that's game. You can play chess at many different time controls, and that's one of the beauties of chess. Club games on a week night, for instance, might play at G/5 or G/10. Most of the time controls have names. G/2 is bullet because you have to move almost instantly. G/5 is blitz. Anything less than G/30 is considered "fast play." G/30 and up counts for fast play. You also see time controls listed as 40/2, which is a common high level time control. That means both players have 2 hours to reach move 40, and then there is usually an hour to make another 20.
One thing that many big chess tournaments are turning to is a time-delay, often 30 seconds to as high as one minute that is built into the clock BEFORE time on the clock starts elapsing. That is to say that there is always a minimal amount of time in which to make a move.
I think the chess clock concept could work, but we must realize that Chess and Star Wars Armada work according to different principles, and that is going to affect how the clock works. The honor system usually works for Armada, but in high level events, the looseness of the Armada structure means that some players will work that to their favor, even if they are only doing it unconsciously.
I say this as someone who agonizes over what to do, and therefore wind up playing slowly.
I think a chess clock would be a good idea - to make the game more time pressured - as if you're a real commander on the bridge of a star destroyer with the TIE Fighters and X-wings exploding around you as the turbolasers are thumping burning tibanna gas at enemy frigates.
I think it would make the game more exciting.
I also might not overanalyze and overagonize.
What is with people and Chess clocks?
It will NEVER happen stop trying to make it happen
One of the things I enjoy about Armada is the Sit-Back-and-Beard-Stroke Contemplation I can do...
When I had to choose between Armada and X-Wing, that was a selling point in Armada's Favour, to me... I didn't want to have to make what felt like snap decisions a hundred times a game...
I wanted to be able to take a breath, take a second, think my move, and then commit to it... To see how it would play out in 3 Turns...
That feeling, would go away with a Chess Clock... even though, without out, I've never had a game go anywhere near time - I'd be stressing about something that I don't have to stress about.
Its another complication.
If you feel you have to use it to train slow players, then by all means, its an effective tool to do that... It'll either train them to speed up, or train them right out the door... It happened with Infinity, for us...
I guess, what I don't want, is another physical, tangible way to be told You Suck.
What is with people and Chess clocks?
It will NEVER happen stop trying to make it happen
What do you mean? If my opponent or I decide to play with a chess clock (and actually get a chess clock), then we'll have a chess clock. Are you going to stop it?
If you're talking about tournament play - no, obviously that's not going to happen - but tournament play is not the only way people can choose to play this game. Even FFG says so.
....
Man, I am such a Vehemently Negative Arse today...
Man, I am such a Vehemently Negative Arse today...
Have you been getting enough ketchup? Ketchup has natural mellowing agents that help take the edge off forum debate.
No.
And I'd have to be ludicrously Drunk and playing with an Open bar to consider trying...
What is with people and Chess clocks?
It will NEVER happen stop trying to make it happen
What do you mean? If my opponent or I decide to play with a chess clock (and actually get a chess clock), then we'll have a chess clock. Are you going to stop it?
If you're talking about tournament play - no, obviously that's not going to happen - but tournament play is not the only way people can choose to play this game. Even FFG says so.
I might just require you bring that one of these days. I might then make it home in time to actually get some sleep before work the next day ^_~
What is with people and Chess clocks?
It will NEVER happen stop trying to make it happen
What do you mean? If my opponent or I decide to play with a chess clock (and actually get a chess clock), then we'll have a chess clock. Are you going to stop it?
If you're talking about tournament play - no, obviously that's not going to happen - but tournament play is not the only way people can choose to play this game. Even FFG says so.
I'm all for it.
But I think you should be the one to bring it, seeing as you've got the grand Feldherr bag. I can barely fit my laser pointer in my bag without having it too full to strap closed.
I might just require you bring that one of these days. I might then make it home in time to actually get some sleep before work the next day ^_~What is with people and Chess clocks?
It will NEVER happen stop trying to make it happen
What do you mean? If my opponent or I decide to play with a chess clock (and actually get a chess clock), then we'll have a chess clock. Are you going to stop it?
If you're talking about tournament play - no, obviously that's not going to happen - but tournament play is not the only way people can choose to play this game. Even FFG says so.
I'm all for it.
But I think you should be the one to bring it, seeing as you've got the grand Feldherr bag. I can barely fit my laser pointer in my bag without having it too full to strap closed.
What is with people and Chess clocks?
It will NEVER happen stop trying to make it happen
What do you mean? If my opponent or I decide to play with a chess clock (and actually get a chess clock), then we'll have a chess clock. Are you going to stop it?
Strong am I with the force. Use it to liberate players across the galaxy form the oppression of the chess clock I will. 
What is with people and Chess clocks?
It will NEVER happen stop trying to make it happen
What do you mean? If my opponent or I decide to play with a chess clock (and actually get a chess clock), then we'll have a chess clock. Are you going to stop it?
Strong am I with the force. Use it to liberate players across the galaxy form the oppression of the chess clock I will.
No!
The chess clock and I shall rule the galaxy like father and ... chessclock.
What is with people and Chess clocks?
It will NEVER happen stop trying to make it happen
What do you mean? If my opponent or I decide to play with a chess clock (and actually get a chess clock), then we'll have a chess clock. Are you going to stop it?
Strong am I with the force. Use it to liberate players across the galaxy form the oppression of the chess clock I will.
No!
The chess clock and I shall rule the galaxy like father and ... chessclock.
that not true, that's impossible
What is with people and Chess clocks?
It will NEVER happen stop trying to make it happen
What do you mean? If my opponent or I decide to play with a chess clock (and actually get a chess clock), then we'll have a chess clock. Are you going to stop it?
Strong am I with the force. Use it to liberate players across the galaxy form the oppression of the chess clock I will.
No!
The chess clock and I shall rule the galaxy like father and ... chessclock.
that not true, that's impossible
*facepalms*
What is with people and Chess clocks?
It will NEVER happen stop trying to make it happen
What do you mean? If my opponent or I decide to play with a chess clock (and actually get a chess clock), then we'll have a chess clock. Are you going to stop it?
Strong am I with the force. Use it to liberate players across the galaxy form the oppression of the chess clock I will.
No!
The chess clock and I shall rule the galaxy like father and ... chessclock.
that not true, that's impossible
Ben why didn't you tell me?