The thing with the white (or green!) K-turn is that while it's very powerful and nice to immediately get behind someone, it's also good for recovering from a bailout move (usually a 3 turn or 3 bank to avoid blocks and/or shots). The Countess excels, here, too, because she can take a 2K after a "swarm avoidance maneuver" and both keep her guns close and stay nearby where it's easier to dodge arcs. Interestingly, by staying close to opposing ships, it keeps the K-turn open, whereas a regular Defender may have to deal with extra chances to get blocked and/or shot by ships with actions. More K-turning options = more turns where you don't get shot by unstressed ships.

As an aside, I want to thank everyone again for all the kind words that have been said. The original post has hit 100 likes, which has pleased me more than it probably should.

I'm still surprised people are surprised when I take the 1 turn. Using the full dial is key. Especially since everyone expects the K-turn.

I'm still surprised people are surprised when I take the 1 turn. Using the full dial is key. Especially since everyone expects the K-turn.

It's kinda engraved into people's minds that every pilot in the empire except for the Baron hates stress, and when they see the Defender's 1-2 red hard turn it throws their world upside down and stomps on it.

I'm still surprised people are surprised when I take the 1 turn. Using the full dial is key. Especially since everyone expects the K-turn.

It's kinda engraved into people's minds that every pilot in the empire except for the Baron hates stress, and when they see the Defender's 1-2 red hard turn it throws their world upside down and stomps on it.

I don't do it often, but when I do, it has had had a disproportionately large effect on the game. Usually (but not always) good.

I'm still surprised people are surprised when I take the 1 turn. Using the full dial is key. Especially since everyone expects the K-turn.

It's kinda engraved into people's minds that every pilot in the empire except for the Baron hates stress, and when they see the Defender's 1-2 red hard turn it throws their world upside down and stomps on it.

I don't do it often, but when I do, it has had had a disproportionately large effect on the game. Usually (but not always) good.

Twin ion engine definitely helps with that XD

Doesn't help when you roll blank blank focus on your stressed moves. =P

I fully agree that you must use your whole dial. But sometimes, a ship has enough other moves that it becomes rare that a stress move is required.

I use the FULL shuttle dial. All the time. Its absolutely required.

But I've rarely used the 1 and 2 turns on the Defender. Usually I can get a similar mathematical shot from a different move.

Doesn't help when you roll blank blank focus on your stressed moves. =P

I fully agree that you must use your whole dial. But sometimes, a ship has enough other moves that it becomes rare that a stress move is required.

I use the FULL shuttle dial. All the time. Its absolutely required.

But I've rarely used the 1 and 2 turns on the Defender. Usually I can get a similar mathematical shot from a different move.

Definitely don't do it all the time, haha, but pulling a 1 hard (especially with Vessery) and catching your opponent off guard because they were expecting you to k turn and you get them in your sights......

So satisfying......

Doesn't help when you roll blank blank focus on your stressed moves. =P

I fully agree that you must use your whole dial. But sometimes, a ship has enough other moves that it becomes rare that a stress move is required.

I use the FULL shuttle dial. All the time. Its absolutely required.

But I've rarely used the 1 and 2 turns on the Defender. Usually I can get a similar mathematical shot from a different move.

Definitely don't do it all the time, haha, but pulling a 1 hard (especially with Vessery) and catching your opponent off guard because they were expecting you to k turn and you get them in your sights......

So satisfying......

That is exactly my thought. I have never thought the defender dial was bad for this very reason. People assume your K-turn is coming so often that they forget the defender can make nearly any move but a 1 straight and the newer sloops and such. The look of horror when they realize they are facing 4 dice from a 1 sharp turn is glorious!

This is the reason. When I play against defenders I know to position so I'm exactly already at the 4K spot. Blocking it from low ps defenders. The better your opponent is the worse a single Kturn is. Against decent normal players? Meh. Nobody cares.

Also a lot of times I find myself accidentally blocking my 4kturn as a defender by staring at a big rock. I know now as a defender player to think two turns ahead but still it happens to me.

3 turns are great. Other than that I think it's a fine dial. But funny enough its strength is its greatest weakness.

Also while sometimes you just need those 4 naked reds just remember that your average hits is literally two. It could be four. But it's usually around 2. It can also be 0!!! Haha. Happens to me more than 4.

Doesn't help when you roll blank blank focus on your stressed moves. =P

I fully agree that you must use your whole dial. But sometimes, a ship has enough other moves that it becomes rare that a stress move is required.

I use the FULL shuttle dial. All the time. Its absolutely required.

But I've rarely used the 1 and 2 turns on the Defender. Usually I can get a similar mathematical shot from a different move.

Please. I will be rolling all blanks when I play a Defender.

You know what Crackswarms don't want to see? Ruthlessness /Ds.

2 Ruthless Defender TIE/Ds is a minimum of 76 points. Not room for much. I would not have more than 1 in a list, because the real dynamos are the X7s.

But I wouldn't mind trying something like:

Countess Ryad (34)

Push the Limit (3)

Twin Ion Engine Mk. II (1)

TIE/x7 (-2)

Colonel Vessery (35)

Ruthlessness (3)

Tractor Beam (1)

TIE/D (0)

Baron of the Empire (19)

Push the Limit (3)

Autothrusters (2)

TIE/v1 (1)

Now we just need a 3 point cannon version of TLT that has a range of 1-2. Then Ruthless Vessery will be an unholy terror.

What about a 31 point Inquisitor, 35 point Fel, and 34 points of Defender?

A juke X7 Glaive Squadron? The Inquisitor and Fel will probably have stripped focus tokens by then.

Like some people have said, I'd rather just have the Inquisitor or Fel instead of a Defender. But once you already have those a Defender seems like the best option if you're not going for the Palp Shuttle.

The kind of thoughtful commentary that we've come to expect from you Bio, thanks!

Just a quick question - I've played Ves for quite a while now, and I honestly think the guy is already pretty decent with HLC/VI (to match him with OL & Inquisitor). His ability is one of the best in the game, once you get the hang of him, wouldn't you agree?

How do you feel about Ves being levelled up to official Nightmare status? I have mixed feelings. Having played against him a few times now, he's still dependent on the favour of green dice to some extent, but if they go his way he honestly feels a little too powerful. I'm thinking here, as you rightly pointed out, of the curb-stomping ion/D version of Ves. He makes a total mess of opponents' lists and plans, and lays down very reliable damage. He clocks in at 39-45pts.

Is Ves 2.0 verging on being an Imperial Auto-include? What's your opinion?

PS I'm seriosuly considering playing him the Yavin open, as a fond farewell to Vess 1.0

I have been practising with him, Vader & Omega especially for Yavin and am now upset to see the pack isn't legal for the event :-(

The kind of thoughtful commentary that we've come to expect from you Bio, thanks!

Just a quick question - I've played Ves for quite a while now, and I honestly think the guy is already pretty decent with HLC/VI (to match him with OL & Inquisitor). His ability is one of the best in the game, once you get the hang of him, wouldn't you agree?

How do you feel about Ves being levelled up to official Nightmare status? I have mixed feelings. Having played against him a few times now, he's still dependent on the favour of green dice to some extent, but if they go his way he honestly feels a little too powerful. I'm thinking here, as you rightly pointed out, of the curb-stomping ion/D version of Ves. He makes a total mess of opponents' lists and plans, and lays down very reliable damage. He clocks in at 39-45pts.

Is Ves 2.0 verging on being an Imperial Auto-include? What's your opinion?

PS I'm seriosuly considering playing him the Yavin open, as a fond farewell to Vess 1.0

I have been practising with him, Vader & Omega especially for Yavin and am now upset to see the pack isn't legal for the event :-(

Hopefully you also practiced with your fall-back list, in the event that it wouldn't be allowed?

"If you fail to plan, you plan to fail" and all that.

The kind of thoughtful commentary that we've come to expect from you Bio, thanks!

Just a quick question - I've played Ves for quite a while now, and I honestly think the guy is already pretty decent with HLC/VI (to match him with OL & Inquisitor). His ability is one of the best in the game, once you get the hang of him, wouldn't you agree?

How do you feel about Ves being levelled up to official Nightmare status? I have mixed feelings. Having played against him a few times now, he's still dependent on the favour of green dice to some extent, but if they go his way he honestly feels a little too powerful. I'm thinking here, as you rightly pointed out, of the curb-stomping ion/D version of Ves. He makes a total mess of opponents' lists and plans, and lays down very reliable damage. He clocks in at 39-45pts.

Is Ves 2.0 verging on being an Imperial Auto-include? What's your opinion?

PS I'm seriosuly considering playing him the Yavin open, as a fond farewell to Vess 1.0

I have been practising with him, Vader & Omega especially for Yavin and am now upset to see the pack isn't legal for the event :-(

Hopefully you also practiced with your fall-back list, in the event that it wouldn't be allowed?

"If you fail to plan, you plan to fail" and all that.

Thankfully, Vessery replaced Soontir who I fly all the time so he is back

Definitely don't do it all the time, haha, but pulling a 1 hard (especially with Vessery) and catching your opponent off guard because they were expecting you to k turn and you get them in your sights......

Sometimes opponents mistake unexpected for impossible. A couple of times I have really caught people out by pulling Reds with Poe simply because people expect me to try and Focus with him every single turn.

The one bank is criminally underrated.

Definitely don't do it all the time, haha, but pulling a 1 hard (especially with Vessery) and catching your opponent off guard because they were expecting you to k turn and you get them in your sights......

Sometimes opponents mistake unexpected for impossible. A couple of times I have really caught people out by pulling Reds with Poe simply because people expect me to try and Focus with him every single turn.

Same thing goes for my Shuttle play.

I had him halt on a rock, at 1 hp knowing full well i could be forced to use Palp to make him not die. The reason? It cockblocked a certain annoying E-wing pilot that was ready to fire twice this round. Soontir got an amazing shot off because of it my opponent was flabbergasted that i did that ON A ROCK with 1hp.

The sometimes suicidal or stupid plays can really win out. Even had Soontir remained stressed one turn by doing a 5forward to GTFO instead of 2green hard like my opponent was expecting. Still stressed, lost his shot, but so did my opponent and i wouldnt have gotten a shot anyway.

I love Defenders but I had to throw this on here...I was able to 1 shot Ves with a crazy shot from Miranda (Homing missile, +1 red dice for Miranda's ability, +1 red dice from Jan). Ves had an evade he couldn't sue and then blanked his green dice! Will likely never happen again but it was pretty awesome (for me )

This is the reason. When I play against defenders I know to position so I'm exactly already at the 4K spot. Blocking it from low ps defenders. The better your opponent is the worse a single Kturn is. Against decent normal players? Meh. Nobody cares.

Also a lot of times I find myself accidentally blocking my 4kturn as a defender by staring at a big rock. I know now as a defender player to think two turns ahead but still it happens to me.

3 turns are great. Other than that I think it's a fine dial. But funny enough its strength is its greatest weakness.

...

I think an entire book can be written on this subject!

If a player is not familiar with Tie Defender, they will rarely block the 4K on purpose. However, good players will pay attention to this and block the 4Ks consistently, significantly reducing the effectiveness of the lower pilot skill defenders. I have noticed that new players find Tie Defenders, even without any titles extremely difficult to deal with because they can save a target lock of later and can always get behind you. Experienced players find it easier to shut down the 4K.

On a complete tangent, this is really where Ryad shines with a potential 2, 3, 4 and 5K: "Block THIS!"

I love Defenders but I had to throw this on here...I was able to 1 shot Ves with a crazy shot from Miranda (Homing missile, +1 red dice for Miranda's ability, +1 red dice from Jan). Ves had an evade he couldn't sue and then blanked his green dice! Will likely never happen again but it was pretty awesome (for me )

If I had a dollar every time I have lost a full health Tie Defender in one pass I would pay for my entire X-Wing collection.

I will note, people always talk about the 4k being predictable and easy to block by experienced players, but then forget that a solid majority of the time that happens it barely matters to the defender. If you are in a place that they block the 4k and you get mega punished then completing the 4k likely wasn't going to be that much better. If you aren't mega punished then you just 4k again next turn or do something else, it's a white maneuver after all. The 4k in my experience is usually not a surprise to anyone but that also doesn't matter because the ship just did a white 4k, that's (still) nuts.

This is the reason. When I play against defenders I know to position so I'm exactly already at the 4K spot. Blocking it from low ps defenders. The better your opponent is the worse a single Kturn is. Against decent normal players? Meh. Nobody cares.

Also a lot of times I find myself accidentally blocking my 4kturn as a defender by staring at a big rock. I know now as a defender player to think two turns ahead but still it happens to me.

3 turns are great. Other than that I think it's a fine dial. But funny enough its strength is its greatest weakness.

...

I think an entire book can be written on this subject!

If a player is not familiar with Tie Defender, they will rarely block the 4K on purpose. However, good players will pay attention to this and block the 4Ks consistently, significantly reducing the effectiveness of the lower pilot skill defenders. I have noticed that new players find Tie Defenders, even without any titles extremely difficult to deal with because they can save a target lock of later and can always get behind you. Experienced players find it easier to shut down the 4K.

On a complete tangent, this is really where Ryad shines with a potential 2, 3, 4 and 5K: "Block THIS!"

If you think that there's a 4K that's going to be blocked, you have a lot of options still. A 2-straight will generally leave your guns at close range against the blocker, and with their guns not pointed at you. You can also swerve away, setting up a K-turn next turn.

Seriously...when are they going to ship Imperial veterans? Sorry, I'm just getting impatient for this expansion.

Vessery with D-tile and ion.

Countess Ryad - MII engine, PTL, X7

Omega Leader with the usual.

or

The inquisitor with the usual

Vessery with D-title and ion, Crackshot or VI

Palp mobile with electronic baffle

I will note, people always talk about the 4k being predictable and easy to block by experienced players, but then forget that a solid majority of the time that happens it barely matters to the defender. If you are in a place that they block the 4k and you get mega punished then completing the 4k likely wasn't going to be that much better. If you aren't mega punished then you just 4k again next turn or do something else, it's a white maneuver after all. The 4k in my experience is usually not a surprise to anyone but that also doesn't matter because the ship just did a white 4k, that's (still) nuts.

In my toughest games even one ship not firing for a single round can mean an increase in likelkhood of losing by say 5%. Or basically that if you do it twice versus me you're likely to never win that game. The games I've seen are that tightly played.