Tried a pair of x-7glaives with Echo yesterday.

Good times were had by me.

why on earth would you target a defender before a decimator? yeah, they have **** near 1/3 the hp but theyre nimble as hell. Decimator's main issue is its reaaaaally easy to crit the sucker to death.

Barring really bad dice, the defenders would take longer than the decimator. But its also a dice game with them, so potentially kill them in 1-3 rounds while the Decimator is a fixated 4-6 at best.

Urks me when people dive for the deci first because once he starts getting hit i know i only got ~5 turns left with him

If i'm making my opponent think twice about target priority and what he does to handle my list that's part of the first battle won!

Tried a pair of x-7glaives with Echo yesterday.

Good times were had by me.

I said it, or at least thought it, when the titles were first spoiled, two x7 generics +X is going to be a thing. They add a huge amount of beef to an Imperial Squad that doesn't really have fighters with beef.

why on earth would you target a defender before a decimator? yeah, they have **** near 1/3 the hp but theyre nimble as hell. Decimator's main issue is its reaaaaally easy to crit the sucker to death.

Barring really bad dice, the defenders would take longer than the decimator. But its also a dice game with them, so potentially kill them in 1-3 rounds while the Decimator is a fixated 4-6 at best.

Urks me when people dive for the deci first because once he starts getting hit i know i only got ~5 turns left with him

Well, in theory sure, go for the deci first....if you can. There's different ways to deploy and approach to make going after the deci first a difficult or at least costly proposition...

Tried a pair of x-7glaives with Echo yesterday.

Good times were had by me.

I said it, or at least thought it, when the titles were first spoiled, two x7 generics +X is going to be a thing. They add a huge amount of beef to an Imperial Squad that doesn't really have fighters with beef.

Yeah you can fit 30 points with 2 predator x7 Glaives which gives a few small ace (or Palpatine *cough*) options and 2 beefy accurate brawlers. If you go cheaper with your generics you can fit some real aces in too like juke Glaives and inquisitor, adaptability Glaives and soontir, a pair of dirty deltas and whisper, 3 delta + backstabber or dark curse, the list goes on.

you can put Ryad/Stele in a list with palp. i dont see a reason to run deltas if youre going the palp route. It would let you bring Yorr for soaking stress most likely but considering defenders usually dont get stressed unless they hardturned away and out of range of yorr or went over debris, not that important.

you can put Ryad/Stele in a list with palp. i dont see a reason to run deltas if youre going the palp route. It would let you bring Yorr for soaking stress most likely but considering defenders usually dont get stressed unless they hardturned away and out of range of yorr or went over debris, not that important.

For palp a pair of predator Glaives with x7 is nasty and I think gains some advantages by being uniform and the ships not wanting any further upgrades really. They're not as flashy but free evades and action less rerolls at solid ps6 backed by palp is a grindy solid list.

Tried a pair of x-7glaives with Echo yesterday.

Good times were had by me.

I said it, or at least thought it, when the titles were first spoiled, two x7 generics +X is going to be a thing. They add a huge amount of beef to an Imperial Squad that doesn't really have fighters with beef.

Again, I want to point this out. You have 2 defenders and Palpatine, or 2 Defenders and The Inquisitor.

Why not sub one Defender out for The Inquistor? Why not sub one of the Defenders out for Palpatine if you already have the Inquisitor?

And once you've done that, why not spend the few extra points you have converting the generic Defender to Vessery?

I'm having trouble seeing 2 Defenders + Ace as equal to inquisitor (who is the best Defender pilot), Vessery, Palpatine.

I take issue with your usage of the word, "beef". The Inquisitor and Soontir are some of if not the beefiest ships in the game, their 3 and 4 health respectively are just an illusion of low "beef".

Right, but Ryad costs the same (-1 PS) for an outright amazing pilot ability and if you just dont bring anything fancy you can bring Stele as well.

I just dont see why you'd run 2 glaives when Ryad is literally the same price and superior. PS5 vs 6 isnt usually that big of an issue if at all (least for my mileage)

Omicron Group Pilot (30)

Electronic Baffles

Palpatine

Countess Ryad (34)

Juke

x7

Maarek Stele (36)

Juke

TIE Mk2 Engines

x7

Total:100

They still have the x7 and juke. All i sacrificed was possible Yorr palpmobile or a cannon/mod and the mod on Ryad (which she doesnt really need)

Except for init bid with those 2 pts, what would the glaives have this doesnt?

Tried a pair of x-7glaives with Echo yesterday.

Good times were had by me.

I said it, or at least thought it, when the titles were first spoiled, two x7 generics +X is going to be a thing. They add a huge amount of beef to an Imperial Squad that doesn't really have fighters with beef.

I take issue with your usage of the word, "beef". The Inquisitor and Soontir are some of if not the beefiest ships in the game, their 3 and 4 health respectively are just an illusion of low "beef".

I guess by "beef" I'm thinking "resistant to all types of incoming damage" or "still hard as hell to kill when everything goes wrong". The Inquisitor and Fel, even with Palp support, hate being blocked, and the closer they are to the opponents, the closer they are to being blocked. The Defenders can dive in close, take Range 1 Focus/Predator shots, K-turn, and just keep doing that as long as they're alive, which will be awhile. In my experience, Aces tend to be hit-and-run sorts of ships, or they get blocked and killed too easily. Defenders are hit-and-hit ships. They don't have to spend time worrying about avoiding shots or getting blocked, because their offense and defense is not nearly as action-dependent as Fel or the Inquisitor. Even if the Defenders take damage on their attack run, they'll K-turn, and will usually be in a pretty good position to avoid damage for a few turns after that. So Defenders will do more damage over time than the Aces, because they'll spend less time positioning to avoid arcs. x7s have the same token stack as the Inquisitor, just 2 more hit points and they don't care about PS or blocking for their Evade token.

Tried a pair of x-7glaives with Echo yesterday.

Good times were had by me.

I said it, or at least thought it, when the titles were first spoiled, two x7 generics +X is going to be a thing. They add a huge amount of beef to an Imperial Squad that doesn't really have fighters with beef.

I take issue with your usage of the word, "beef". The Inquisitor and Soontir are some of if not the beefiest ships in the game, their 3 and 4 health respectively are just an illusion of low "beef".

I guess by "beef" I'm thinking "resistant to all types of incoming damage" or "still hard as hell to kill when everything goes wrong". The Inquisitor and Fel, even with Palp support, hate being blocked, and the closer they are to the opponents, the closer they are to being blocked. The Defenders can dive in close, take Range 1 Focus/Predator shots, K-turn, and just keep doing that as long as they're alive, which will be awhile. In my experience, Aces tend to be hit-and-run sorts of ships, or they get blocked and killed too easily. Defenders are hit-and-hit ships. They don't have to spend time worrying about avoiding shots or getting blocked, because their offense and defense is not nearly as action-dependent as Fel or the Inquisitor. Even if the Defenders take damage on their attack run, they'll K-turn, and will usually be in a pretty good position to avoid damage for a few turns after that. So Defenders will do more damage over time than the Aces, because they'll spend less time positioning to avoid arcs. x7s have the same token stack as the Inquisitor, just 2 more hit points and they don't care about PS or blocking for their Evade token.

But a Defender with X7 doesn't deny Autothrusters or the range 3 bonus die. That's HUGE against everything, especially other Acewings.

There also isn't the troll factor of pulling out the range ruler, just barely being in range 3, and saying, "Range one."

An x7 Defender is aiming to fight at Range 1-2 against most things. It has the hit points and action independent offense and defense to make it work. The Inquisitor's pilot ability is undeniably incredible. Each ship is optimal at different ranges. x7 Defenders are happier up close, while the Inquisitor wants to skirt around the edges. Personal preference, and where one's strengths lay in piloting probably determine which one you'll want to take.

The Inquisitor is amazing, but he is a different beast from Defenders. The Inquisitor wants to snipe at range 3, and he is amazing at it. Probably the best flanker in the game. However, he doesn't want to charge straight at the enemy. He will get blown up so fast if you straight up joust with him. That is the exact thing that Defenders want. They are so different from any other ship in the Imperial navy because they want to fly straight at you! The Inquisitor and Defenders fill different roles. Comparing them is like comparing apples to oranges. They really complement each other well. Defenders can rush in and take heat off the Inquisitor.

It also boils down to playstyle. Maybe a player is better at flying more hammering joust lists than nimble arc-dodgers. In that case, take Defenders and leave the Inquisitor at home! Some people just find more success playing lists that don't require arc-dodging, and that is totally legit. Triple U-boats seems to be doing well, and there is nothing arc-dodgey about that list!

Right, but Ryad costs the same (-1 PS) for an outright amazing pilot ability and if you just dont bring anything fancy you can bring Stele as well.

I just dont see why you'd run 2 glaives when Ryad is literally the same price and superior. PS5 vs 6 isnt usually that big of an issue if at all (least for my mileage)

Omicron Group Pilot (30)

Electronic Baffles

Palpatine

Countess Ryad (34)

Juke

x7

Maarek Stele (36)

Juke

TIE Mk2 Engines

x7

Total:100

They still have the x7 and juke. All i sacrificed was possible Yorr palpmobile or a cannon/mod and the mod on Ryad (which she doesnt really need)

Except for init bid with those 2 pts, what would the glaives have this doesnt?

There's something to be said for symmetrical ships, especially in that matching ps means complete freedom of choice for activation order. Additionally the countess typically is going to run 36 points for the 'optimal' build with ptl and mk2 and I'm not positive that juke mk2 is a particularly inspiring steele build. I think 'settling' for the pair of generic symmetrical predator ships is superior to stuffing in pilot abilities seemingly for the sake of it. I firmly believe that predator is superior to juke on x7 defenders because it's always on and it doesn't force the token that's supposed to keep me alive better into being bad to use before they shoot.

Or both. Both is good.

The Inquisitor (25)

Push the Limit (3)

Proton Rockets (3)

Autothrusters (2)

TIE/v1 (1)

Delta Squadron Pilot (30)

TIE/x7 (-2)

Colonel Vessery (35)

Veteran Instincts (1)

Tractor Beam (1)

TIE/D (0)

Total: 99

View in Yet Another Squad Builder

Right, but Ryad costs the same (-1 PS) for an outright amazing pilot ability and if you just dont bring anything fancy you can bring Stele as well.

I just dont see why you'd run 2 glaives when Ryad is literally the same price and superior. PS5 vs 6 isnt usually that big of an issue if at all (least for my mileage)

Omicron Group Pilot (30)

Electronic Baffles

Palpatine

Countess Ryad (34)

Juke

x7

Maarek Stele (36)

Juke

TIE Mk2 Engines

x7

Total:100

They still have the x7 and juke. All i sacrificed was possible Yorr palpmobile or a cannon/mod and the mod on Ryad (which she doesnt really need)

Except for init bid with those 2 pts, what would the glaives have this doesnt?

There's something to be said for symmetrical ships, especially in that matching ps means complete freedom of choice for activation order. Additionally the countess typically is going to run 36 points for the 'optimal' build with ptl and mk2 and I'm not positive that juke mk2 is a particularly inspiring steele build. I think 'settling' for the pair of generic symmetrical predator ships is superior to stuffing in pilot abilities seemingly for the sake of it. I firmly believe that predator is superior to juke on x7 defenders because it's always on and it doesn't force the token that's supposed to keep me alive better into being bad to use before they shoot.

I'm of this mind.

You do have the point to sub in Maarek, though. There's arguments for two PS 6s, but Palpatine, fittingly, really likes Maarek.

Glaive (34), x7 (-2), Predator (3) = 35

Maarek (35), x7 (-2), Predator (3) = 36

PalpShuttle = 29

Right, but Ryad costs the same (-1 PS) for an outright amazing pilot ability and if you just dont bring anything fancy you can bring Stele as well.

I just dont see why you'd run 2 glaives when Ryad is literally the same price and superior. PS5 vs 6 isnt usually that big of an issue if at all (least for my mileage)

Omicron Group Pilot (30)

Electronic Baffles

Palpatine

Countess Ryad (34)

Juke

x7

Maarek Stele (36)

Juke

TIE Mk2 Engines

x7

Total:100

They still have the x7 and juke. All i sacrificed was possible Yorr palpmobile or a cannon/mod and the mod on Ryad (which she doesnt really need)

Except for init bid with those 2 pts, what would the glaives have this doesnt?

There's something to be said for symmetrical ships, especially in that matching ps means complete freedom of choice for activation order. Additionally the countess typically is going to run 36 points for the 'optimal' build with ptl and mk2 and I'm not positive that juke mk2 is a particularly inspiring steele build. I think 'settling' for the pair of generic symmetrical predator ships is superior to stuffing in pilot abilities seemingly for the sake of it. I firmly believe that predator is superior to juke on x7 defenders because it's always on and it doesn't force the token that's supposed to keep me alive better into being bad to use before they shoot.

But Juke doesn't burn the evade token. You just need to have one for the ability to work.

Predator works well, don't get me wrong. And 95% of the time I'll pick Predator over Outmaneuver on a ship for the same cost. However, that 5% of the time happens to be on Ryad since she's incredibly good at getting behind a target for a shot. It's basically a math argument. Predator always works, but rerolling a die (or two) increases your probability of hitting. On the other hand, Outmaneuver doesn't work all the time (but honestly most of the time with Ryad), BUT it significantly increases the variance of your roll vs the defender. I also happen to like using Outmaneuver when I'm facing some enemy ships that have 3 defense dice, and I LOVE it against ships with 1 defense die because they usually have weaker movement dials making the ability much easier to activate.

Using C3PO on a Falcon? Not when you have zero defense dice to roll.

Right, but Ryad costs the same (-1 PS) for an outright amazing pilot ability and if you just dont bring anything fancy you can bring Stele as well.

I just dont see why you'd run 2 glaives when Ryad is literally the same price and superior. PS5 vs 6 isnt usually that big of an issue if at all (least for my mileage)

Omicron Group Pilot (30)

Electronic Baffles

Palpatine

Countess Ryad (34)

Juke

x7

Maarek Stele (36)

Juke

TIE Mk2 Engines

x7

Total:100

They still have the x7 and juke. All i sacrificed was possible Yorr palpmobile or a cannon/mod and the mod on Ryad (which she doesnt really need)

Except for init bid with those 2 pts, what would the glaives have this doesnt?

There's something to be said for symmetrical ships, especially in that matching ps means complete freedom of choice for activation order. Additionally the countess typically is going to run 36 points for the 'optimal' build with ptl and mk2 and I'm not positive that juke mk2 is a particularly inspiring steele build. I think 'settling' for the pair of generic symmetrical predator ships is superior to stuffing in pilot abilities seemingly for the sake of it. I firmly believe that predator is superior to juke on x7 defenders because it's always on and it doesn't force the token that's supposed to keep me alive better into being bad to use before they shoot.

Juke is better on Vessery since you can get TLs from his ability. Other than that it might be less ideal. PTL ryad + juke vessery is a wonderful combo.

But Juke doesn't burn the evade token. You just need to have one for the ability to work.

Predator works well, don't get me wrong. And 95% of the time I'll pick Predator over Outmaneuver on a ship for the same cost. However, that 5% of the time happens to be on Ryad since she's incredibly good at getting behind a target for a shot. It's basically a math argument. Predator always works, but rerolling a die (or two) increases your probability of hitting. On the other hand, Outmaneuver doesn't work all the time (but honestly most of the time with Ryad), BUT it significantly increases the variance of your roll vs the defender. I also happen to like using Outmaneuver when I'm facing some enemy ships that have 3 defense dice, and I LOVE it against ships with 1 defense die because they usually have weaker movement dials making the ability much easier to activate.

Using C3PO on a Falcon? Not when you have zero defense dice to roll.

To the first, my point is mostly that if I'm running juke defenders and get shot at by an ace/higher ps then I have to choose between using my pilot ability (by not spending the evade) and having a stronger defense (by spending it freely). Sure juke doesn't destroy your evade in any way but it locks until you shoot which nullifies the main draw of x7 for me against any ship at higher ps.

Outmanuver certainly is strong and likely good on countess I just am often afraid of conditional epts when compared to the super ease of always rerolls.

An x7 Defender is aiming to fight at Range 1-2 against most things. It has the hit points and action independent offense and defense to make it work. The Inquisitor's pilot ability is undeniably incredible. Each ship is optimal at different ranges. x7 Defenders are happier up close, while the Inquisitor wants to skirt around the edges. Personal preference, and where one's strengths lay in piloting probably determine which one you'll want to take.

Inquisitor gets TL focus Evade.

Defenders get Evade and one of those. They're not equal offensively.

Defensively, the Inquisitor is better. It's not exactly difficult to trigger Autothrusters.

Theres also the mentality of taking the damage and hanging onto the juke.

I dont like predator, its a 3pt ept with a singular die reroll. Too expensive to me. If im going to suffer 1dmg but i get to juke a low agi ship, im going to take that 1 damage and decimate that low agi ship. I run PS3 Awings with PTL + Juke thanks to the title often, and i have done some serious damage with that mentality. If i can make it work with them i dont fear it working on defenders at any ps.

Personal preference but i know from running Stele in his TIE Adv and the same kind of power in Armada that dishing out the proper crit for the scenario is tremendously powerful. I've forced my opponent to take the "no straights next round" on a large ship in the middle of an asteroid field, which caused him to utterly waste his next round because he hit a rock with every turn he had. Also managed to finish off a ship because i gave them a double damage. I love that sense of control over such nasty things stele gives me: i kinda wish he was a Crew so i could slap that on Chiraneau lol oh that would be so juicy...

Also how can you say the Inquis is better defensively? He has 4hp, so any leaks that get through his identical evade chances to an x7 defender is going to HURT while a defender would just get pissed off. Offensively its a bit of a tossup, since Inquis is rolling 3die always and agreed always has a TL/Focus, but if he gets caught at range1 he is worse off because he gains nothing, his opponent gains everything. Defender would roll 4 die and still have a focus if it isnt Ryad with PTL.

Plus, Inquis will be stressed to get those tokens/TL. Meaning he is forced to do a green or disengage. Defender wouldnt be stressed except for Ryad, which would just green-Kturn and do it again. Defenders have the ability to never disengage.

And yes i know Inquis has autothrustors. Doesnt matter, you dont shoot at anyone at range3 unless you dont have a choice anyway. If hes irritating you, gun for him, and he dies. Range2, no autothrustors. Range1, you hit harder, he doesnt.

I stopped bringing him because hes so **** easy to remove. And ive done it to others who bring him too: hes not hard to get rid of because of 4hp

An x7 Defender is aiming to fight at Range 1-2 against most things. It has the hit points and action independent offense and defense to make it work. The Inquisitor's pilot ability is undeniably incredible. Each ship is optimal at different ranges. x7 Defenders are happier up close, while the Inquisitor wants to skirt around the edges. Personal preference, and where one's strengths lay in piloting probably determine which one you'll want to take.

Inquisitor gets TL focus Evade.

Defenders get Evade and one of those. They're not equal offensively.

Defensively, the Inquisitor is better. It's not exactly difficult to trigger Autothrusters.

Ryad with PTL and x7 gets Focus/TL/Evade. Vessery with x7 gets focus/evade and a free TL as long as an ally has one. And they get 4 dice at range 1.

It's no secret that the Inquisitor is better when he's at Range 3. The various x7 Defenders are stronger at Range 1. At Range 2, they have similar offensive and defensive profiles, but the Defender has more HP backing it up. The Defenders, in my experience, will get more shots over a given number of turns because they're not moving as much to minimize shots against them, they're moving to maximize shots on their opponent, because they don't particularly fear a bad round of green dice. This makes them more offensively effective.

moving the maximize shots + white 4k versus moving to dodge + the hell's a 4k? do you mean ptl?

The literal worst ive ever had happen to a defender is a solid wiff of green dice (all blanks, no focus, no evade title) and he suffered 4 damage, one that went through was a crit for double damage (go figure).

He was still alive, and destroyed the guy infront of him.

Inquis has died for me in literally 1 volley because they snuck into range2 and torp'd him or rocketed forward for range1. Hes stupid easy to take out when confronted. He technically has the same evade odds of a defender but that 2hp difference is **** near always the reason a defender survived a bad roll or an inquis evaporated from a bad roll.

And while i love the range3 sniping, its too fickle. Really easy to move too far inward, or disengage more often than other ships to avoid moving too far forward.