Not seeing value in discard secondary weapons

By slowreflex, in X-Wing

I'm very new to the game, so it's completely understandable if I'm ignorant to something here. However, the point value of secondary weapons that only last one turn (yes, I know you can do two turns with another upgrade), seem over-priced. Seems to only give you a couple extra dice for one attack. What am I missing here?

More dice, no range bonus, usually another effect.

If you spend 4 points and kill or cripple a ship (min. 12 points), then its always worth it.

As another newbie... That's exactly why they haven't been very popular for a long time. However between the additional munitions and some of the interesting fun you can do with the more exotic ones (bombs and such) they seem to be starting to make a slow come back.

I know that missile raiders are a tone of fun. :P

I'm very new to the game, so it's completely understandable if I'm ignorant to something here. However, the point value of secondary weapons that only last one turn (yes, I know you can do two turns with another upgrade), seem over-priced. Seems to only give you a couple extra dice for one attack. What am I missing here?

You were correct for the most part. But a card called Guidance Chips was released that makes them hit super hard, and last wave a card called Extra Munitions was released that gives you extra shots with them.

A card called Long Range Scanners is coming in Imperial Veterans that makes it easier to acquire the requisite TL needed to fire them and also makes them hit harder because once you already have the TL on something you can just focus perpetually until you have a shot.

Edited by ParaGoomba Slayer

Pre wave 8 torps and missiles were pretty worthless that's no longer the case if you set your list up properly.

Extra munitions lets you use them twice greatly improving their value, guidance chimps improve their accuracy.

But not an upgrade you slap on Willy nilly.

I'm very new to the game, so it's completely understandable if I'm ignorant to something here. However, the point value of secondary weapons that only last one turn (yes, I know you can do two turns with another upgrade), seem over-priced. Seems to only give you a couple extra dice for one attack. What am I missing here?

Yep. Munitions have had a rocky history.

If you take a Target Lock to fire most munitions, that means you didn't spend that action on a focus, and so the munition gets fired without any way to modify dice, except for any ability on the card itself. (Proton Torps changes one focus to a crit, etc)

Taking two turns to set up a focus and a target lock on a target can be more trouble than it's worth.

Placing a target lock requires being in range of the target at the time you lock, and so if you're just out of range of a higher PS ship, you're not going to be able to target lock that turn. (It moves after you've had the chance to take your target lock action.)

Placing a target lock telegraphs to your opponent which ship you're going to fire on. Primary and secondary guns can more easily switch targets after everyone has moved. You might have a better target after the activation phase is finished.

Target locks usually cannot be used for defense, focus can. And if you roll well on your attack, you might not need to spend the focus on the attack at all. You must spend a target lock for most munitions attacks.

Point cost of the upgrades in the face of these limitations makes munitions seem underpowered for their point cost.

All of the recent munitions upgrades have tried to improve on all these issues, while not stepping over the line and making munitions too good. The U-Boat (3 Jumpmasters with specific loadouts) kinda jumped over that line, depending on who you ask. They are probably the best munitions using builds at this point. Definitley the most popular.

Edited by Koing907

On one hand I do see your point. Having to discard something that you paid dearly for seems like a waste.
But look at it like this:
Anything with Assault Missles will make the ever present swarm player think twice. If you get the shot off and he's got them wing to wing, like some seem to enjoy doing, you've just likely killed one ship and wounded possibly two others. IF that swarm is a TIE swarm, you deffinatly killed one and took half the hull off everything at range 1.

Proton Torps, best against the big ships because they cant green dice away and they hit like a truck.
A-wings with Proton Rockets can toss out 5 red dice.
I know they are situational upgrades but if you are smart and set up those situations, they are devestating.

If enough for those one or two time attacks hit a ship in one turn, it's a dead ship.

Ordnance let's you increase your firepower, and with all jumpmaster, tie bomber, or z 95 lists, that means a lot of firepower directed at whatever you want dead. Might only be for a turn or tqo, but if you kill a ship it's worth it.

I mostly (not always) found it a waste of points for ships that have a primary weapon of value 3. But very useful with ships that are 2. Recent upgrade cards made missiles and torpedoes more attractive to use.

Honestly aTIE Bomber with Cluster Missiles and Chips with EM, is a vicious little craft for not a lot of points.

6 hull with a potential of 6 red (1 hit for sure) per round on the one buy of missiles for 22 points is pretty hefty.

That's with the lowest generic mind you, but still good.

Edited by Tybalt027

I'm very new to the game, so it's completely understandable if I'm ignorant to something here. However, the point value of secondary weapons that only last one turn (yes, I know you can do two turns with another upgrade), seem over-priced. Seems to only give you a couple extra dice for one attack. What am I missing here?

Basically what others have said. You've hit the nail on the head -- the out-of-the-box missiles and torpedoes are universally crap. But now that we have Guidance Chips and Extra Munitions, they're actually worth the points. You can practically guarantee that you land four hits with the right setup, which is pretty powerful

But now that we have Guidance Chips and Extra Munitions, they're actually worth the points. You can practically guarantee that you land four hits with the right setup, which is pretty powerful

Especially when you have more than one ship doing that.

One missile? Meh. But 3 or 4 at the same time? That might be enough alpha strike to seal a victory very quickly.

Try four Tansarii Point veterans with the Heavy Scyk title, Deadeye, Homing Missiles, and Guidance Chips. It's magic.

Typically they aren't worth it, unless you use other things to empower them.

For instance, Guidance Chips, Extra Munitions, Deadeye, etc., all significantly boost certain consumable weapons.

Munitions heavy lists can lead to some short games, especially if one of the lists has only 2 or 3 ships. It's like overnight ordnance became a thing and people are discovering Proton Torpedoes for the first time. They were in the core set, duh!!!

Yup, they're situational and can be victim to the randomness of dice, but they can hit hard. For instance, I once had Horton fire his Proton Torps at Vader at Range 3. Due to good dice at my end and lousy dice at his end, I ended up shredding Vader of his shields and dropping him to a single hull point (Thanks 'Direct Hit!') As opposed to if I'd fired my Primary Weapon, I would have been putting out 2 attacks vs 4 evades.

As it's been said they are getting better.

Upgrades like long range sensor, guidance chips, and extra munitions are making them worth while.

Also ships that have these tend to become big targets.

You can get a cheap ship Z95, or a bomber and have it hit hard, have a couple of those and then an ace ( expensive ship) then you're making your opponent decided on targeting priority.

Go for the expensive ace, or go for a one hit wonder ship

My favorite ordnance had been Prox mines.

It really messes with your opponent flying as it is something you don't want to get hit with.