The fact that they stress activation advantage so much, I think they designed this for the added benefit of nerfing AA.
And the GR-75 preview is here
the expanded launchers are very powerful and well utilized in my play style, something many people forget is that demolisher only kills 1/4-1/3 of most fleets (how I play) and my raiders actually do more damage. Demolisher is just my extra tool to Make sure everything happens right.Clon: How much is it actually key that the Raiders are outfitted with Expanded Launchers? Do you require them to finish off enemies?
I tend to take out opposing Demolishers after they've wiped out one of my ships.
Now others have their own play version of my play style and many do not use expanded launchers. I personally think my version is More effective but I'm bias
Clon, what do you think about the option to replace your last two Raiders with Gozanti's squadrons? Your list has over 90 points available for squadrons after replacing two of your Raiders with GC1s.
I could see myself replacing my commander raider with 2 gosantis for activation advantage
That's what I feel... You'll get some benefit out of incorporating the Flotillas to your list, but you'll rapidly get diminishing returns, based on what you could take instead... There's got to be a point where Activation Advantage becomes Activation Whatever, because you're already so far ahead... And then, you start wishing for that thing that could be killing stuff, instead.
Okay, so you take it... 300 points of Gozantis and Demolisher...
Your Demolisher Screams in, and tanks out my... Say, Lead Assault Frigate... Boom. Well done. Points on your side...
But when Demolisher is then out in my zone all by himself and gets broadsided by the rest of my Fleet, as is generally Inevitable (the demolisher triple-tap generally means trying to trash the enemy's main combat capability in a good points trade, because Demolisher only gets to do it once...)... You now have 300 points of Gozanti to try to fight off everyone else...
How effectively do you think that'll go, if my force is, say, two more Assault Frigates backed with Squadrons...
Well, they just castle up in the corner, use their scatter tokens, and survive for the rest of the game giving the Imperial player a win on points. It's hard to get points out of little ~20 point ships.
I don't see the utility of it, to be honest, and I'm not afraid of that archtype... 2-3 more activation sin a standard list, for sure... But that's about as far as it'll go...
Well, sure it'll start as just 2-3 more activations, then it'll move to 3-4 more activations as the meta adjusts, then 4-5, then 5-6...
And to be clear, I don't think it will be a super-powerful combination, but I think it will encourage people to 'break' the game by squeezing in as many activations as possible because the first/last double/triple tap is *so* powerful.
Okay, so you take it... 300 points of Gozantis and Demolisher...
Your Demolisher Screams in, and tanks out my... Say, Lead Assault Frigate... Boom. Well done. Points on your side...
But when Demolisher is then out in my zone all by himself and gets broadsided by the rest of my Fleet, as is generally Inevitable (the demolisher triple-tap generally means trying to trash the enemy's main combat capability in a good points trade, because Demolisher only gets to do it once...)... You now have 300 points of Gozanti to try to fight off everyone else...
How effectively do you think that'll go, if my force is, say, two more Assault Frigates backed with Squadrons...
Well, they just castle up in the corner, use their scatter tokens, and survive for the rest of the game giving the Imperial player a win on points. It's hard to get points out of little ~20 point ships.
I don't see the utility of it, to be honest, and I'm not afraid of that archtype... 2-3 more activation sin a standard list, for sure... But that's about as far as it'll go...
Well, sure it'll start as just 2-3 more activations, then it'll move to 3-4 more activations as the meta adjusts, then 4-5, then 5-6...
And to be clear, I don't think it will be a super-powerful combination, but I think it will encourage people to 'break' the game by squeezing in as many activations as possible because the first/last double/triple tap is *so* powerful.
Well, they just castle up in the corner, use their scatter tokens, and survive for the rest of the game giving the Imperial player a win on points. It's hard to get points out of little ~20 point ships.
At long range.
If you're going to castle up, that's cool... I think the days of the "Turtle and Creep" lists are done... You always want to have an ability to reach out and grab someone by the exhausts... In this case, it you just Drive Towards what you want to kill.. They'll hit you, and do dmage to themselves... You'll hit them, and only damage you...
The trick will be, will Demo be paying for itself and the Objectives, or will you be losing right from the get-go...
Okay, so you take it... 300 points of Gozantis and Demolisher...
Your Demolisher Screams in, and tanks out my... Say, Lead Assault Frigate... Boom. Well done. Points on your side...
But when Demolisher is then out in my zone all by himself and gets broadsided by the rest of my Fleet, as is generally Inevitable (the demolisher triple-tap generally means trying to trash the enemy's main combat capability in a good points trade, because Demolisher only gets to do it once...)... You now have 300 points of Gozanti to try to fight off everyone else...
How effectively do you think that'll go, if my force is, say, two more Assault Frigates backed with Squadrons...
Well, they just castle up in the corner, use their scatter tokens, and survive for the rest of the game giving the Imperial player a win on points. It's hard to get points out of little ~20 point ships.
I don't see the utility of it, to be honest, and I'm not afraid of that archtype... 2-3 more activation sin a standard list, for sure... But that's about as far as it'll go...
Well, sure it'll start as just 2-3 more activations, then it'll move to 3-4 more activations as the meta adjusts, then 4-5, then 5-6...
And to be clear, I don't think it will be a super-powerful combination, but I think it will encourage people to 'break' the game by squeezing in as many activations as possible because the first/last double/triple tap is *so* powerful.
I think that slicer tools and tractor beams definitely mitigate the whole last/first thing somewhat. Not being able to engine tech AND losing a token really hurts a Demolisher's range that is just lying in wait for that last activation.
Is anyone else sort of concerned about where these tiny ships could drive the game? I'm thinking fleets like Demolisher and 300 points of Gozantis, or two MC30s and the rest in Transports, purely to pad out the activations and allow the one heavy hitter in the list to double/triple tap every turn?Like, they add a lot of cool new tricks to the game, but I worry that the best trick they will provide will simply be 18 point activations...
Actually, I think if the meta goes this way, people will go with lots of smaller attack ships (raiders and cr90). If you have tons of flotillas and I have lots of raiders, demolished kills a raider and my raiders kill your flotillas. Then the meta realizes that corvettes can beat flotillas well because they don't waste big shots on one ship that scatters it. As corvettes become more used, shrimps and gozanti are used to kill them. Then it all rebalances.
Again, the only real unbalanced issue is demolished.
Well, the combat refit is pretty lackluster and I don't see any reason to really take it unless you have the spare points. I'll most likely run two of these guys with squadrons to use both of those titles.
I was certainly crackin' up over the new commander. Too soon?
The thing about that is the Blue anti-squadron die is pretty valuable. Strictly as an anti-squadron platform it is pretty efficient. With Toryn Farr nearby a pair of Combat Retrofits could do some solid damage to squadrons.
Nah, I'd rather put those points towards more A-Wings or other fighters. Those are far more effective at AA. I especially do not want to put these capitals near enemy squadrons or even enemy capitals if I can help it.
Edited by KubernesIs anyone else sort of concerned about where these tiny ships could drive the game? I'm thinking fleets like Demolisher and 300 points of Gozantis, or two MC30s and the rest in Transports, purely to pad out the activations and allow the one heavy hitter in the list to double/triple tap every turn?Like, they add a lot of cool new tricks to the game, but I worry that the best trick they will provide will simply be 18 point activations...
Actually, I think if the meta goes this way, people will go with lots of smaller attack ships (raiders and cr90). If you have tons of flotillas and I have lots of raiders, demolished kills a raider and my raiders kill your flotillas. Then the meta realizes that corvettes can beat flotillas well because they don't waste big shots on one ship that scatters it. As corvettes become more used, shrimps and gozanti are used to kill them. Then it all rebalances.
Again, the only real unbalanced issue is demolished.
*coughs* Gunnery Teams *cough *Is anyone else sort of concerned about where these tiny ships could drive the game? I'm thinking fleets like Demolisher and 300 points of Gozantis, or two MC30s and the rest in Transports, purely to pad out the activations and allow the one heavy hitter in the list to double/triple tap every turn?Like, they add a lot of cool new tricks to the game, but I worry that the best trick they will provide will simply be 18 point activations...
Actually, I think if the meta goes this way, people will go with lots of smaller attack ships (raiders and cr90). If you have tons of flotillas and I have lots of raiders, demolished kills a raider and my raiders kill your flotillas. Then the meta realizes that corvettes can beat flotillas well because they don't waste big shots on one ship that scatters it. As corvettes become more used, shrimps and gozanti are used to kill them. Then it all rebalances.
Again, the only real unbalanced issue is demolished.
Moving the goalpost. The poster was worried about all flotillas and one or two threat ships (both of which will have ordnance experts and not gunnery teams). Of course larger ships can beat the corvettes. That wasn't the question.
**cough**read the conversation**cough**
*meant in fun. Just as I took your post.
*coughs* Gunnery Teams *cough *Is anyone else sort of concerned about where these tiny ships could drive the game? I'm thinking fleets like Demolisher and 300 points of Gozantis, or two MC30s and the rest in Transports, purely to pad out the activations and allow the one heavy hitter in the list to double/triple tap every turn?Like, they add a lot of cool new tricks to the game, but I worry that the best trick they will provide will simply be 18 point activations...
Actually, I think if the meta goes this way, people will go with lots of smaller attack ships (raiders and cr90). If you have tons of flotillas and I have lots of raiders, demolished kills a raider and my raiders kill your flotillas. Then the meta realizes that corvettes can beat flotillas well because they don't waste big shots on one ship that scatters it. As corvettes become more used, shrimps and gozanti are used to kill them. Then it all rebalances.
Again, the only real unbalanced issue is demolished.
Moving the goalpost. The poster was worried about all flotillas and one or two threat ships (both of which will have ordnance experts and not gunnery teams). Of course larger ships can beat the corvettes. That wasn't the question.
**cough**read the conversation**cough**
*meant in fun. Just as I took your post.
and his point was gun teams= lots of dead little ships*coughs* Gunnery Teams *cough *Is anyone else sort of concerned about where these tiny ships could drive the game? I'm thinking fleets like Demolisher and 300 points of Gozantis, or two MC30s and the rest in Transports, purely to pad out the activations and allow the one heavy hitter in the list to double/triple tap every turn?Like, they add a lot of cool new tricks to the game, but I worry that the best trick they will provide will simply be 18 point activations...
Actually, I think if the meta goes this way, people will go with lots of smaller attack ships (raiders and cr90). If you have tons of flotillas and I have lots of raiders, demolished kills a raider and my raiders kill your flotillas. Then the meta realizes that corvettes can beat flotillas well because they don't waste big shots on one ship that scatters it. As corvettes become more used, shrimps and gozanti are used to kill them. Then it all rebalances.
Again, the only real unbalanced issue is demolished.
Moving the goalpost. The poster was worried about all flotillas and one or two threat ships (both of which will have ordnance experts and not gunnery teams). Of course larger ships can beat the corvettes. That wasn't the question.
**cough**read the conversation**cough**
*meant in fun. Just as I took your post.
Gunnery Teams from oh let's say an ISD which can catch a couple of these guys who are near each other will be able to chew them to pieces. All you really need is 1 accuracy for the scatter, 1 damage for the evade, and 4 normal damage. Thankfully we have H9 Turbolasers, Home One, and such to provide the accuracy. Any medium to large ship can provide the rest. Heck, a Sensor Teams Gladiator can kill one of these with ease.
Don't forget a way to fish for accuracy with them gunnery teams... Vader+ sw7?
VSD with gunnery teams and H9 Turbolasers (15 pts). Or you could go with sensor teams and enhanced armaments(also 15 pts). Either seem to be a good role in wave 3 fleets trying to lock down scatter and evade ships.
Don't forget a way to fish for accuracy with them gunnery teams... Vader+ sw7?
Heck, a Sensor Teams Gladiator can kill one of these with ease.
But then you're not taking Ordnance Experts and you are losing a die worth of damage. You still need 4 more to kill at close range which means you need two natural hit/crits to kill. That's a tall ask without rerolls. I could see Sensor Glads in a Vader list though. Glad 2s to give the red for an acc out the side and extra AA. More of a support role Gladiator. If only I could have Ruthless strategist as well as the sensor teams... :/
ATm warlords is missing the new rebel officer upgrade card 
And Bingo was his name-o!and his point was gun teams= lots of dead little ships*coughs* Gunnery Teams *cough *Is anyone else sort of concerned about where these tiny ships could drive the game? I'm thinking fleets like Demolisher and 300 points of Gozantis, or two MC30s and the rest in Transports, purely to pad out the activations and allow the one heavy hitter in the list to double/triple tap every turn?Like, they add a lot of cool new tricks to the game, but I worry that the best trick they will provide will simply be 18 point activations...
Actually, I think if the meta goes this way, people will go with lots of smaller attack ships (raiders and cr90). If you have tons of flotillas and I have lots of raiders, demolished kills a raider and my raiders kill your flotillas. Then the meta realizes that corvettes can beat flotillas well because they don't waste big shots on one ship that scatters it. As corvettes become more used, shrimps and gozanti are used to kill them. Then it all rebalances.
Again, the only real unbalanced issue is demolished.
Moving the goalpost. The poster was worried about all flotillas and one or two threat ships (both of which will have ordnance experts and not gunnery teams). Of course larger ships can beat the corvettes. That wasn't the question.
**cough**read the conversation**cough**
*meant in fun. Just as I took your post.
Gunnery Teams from oh let's say an ISD which can catch a couple of these guys who are near each other will be able to chew them to pieces. All you really need is 1 accuracy for the scatter, 1 damage for the evade, and 4 normal damage. Thankfully we have H9 Turbolasers, Home One, and such to provide the accuracy. Any medium to large ship can provide the rest. Heck, a Sensor Teams Gladiator can kill one of these with ease.
I don't want to get into a this beats that discussion (especially because I agree that lots of flotillas and one big hitter demo isn't going to rule), but your answer to defeat demo plus flotillas doesn't account for demos love of big targets. Your ISD might get two flotilla...at the cost of itself. Gunnery teams on osd is great against lots of flotilla. ISD heavy isn't great against high act demo. Hence my statement that corvettes would be better suited against flotilla.
Heck, a Sensor Teams Gladiator can kill one of these with ease.
But then you're not taking Ordnance Experts and you are losing a die worth of damage. You still need 4 more to kill at close range which means you need two natural hit/crits to kill. That's a tall ask without rerolls. I could see Sensor Glads in a Vader list though. Glad 2s to give the red for an acc out the side and extra AA. More of a support role Gladiator. If only I could have Ruthless strategist as well as the sensor teams... :/
I can see the expanded use of concentrate fire tokens to fish for that accuracy on a lot of ships as well as adding ET for double-ram possibilities. I wouldn't be surprised to see CR90B/ET/SW7 as a flotilla hunter.
Heck, a Sensor Teams Gladiator can kill one of these with ease.
But then you're not taking Ordnance Experts and you are losing a die worth of damage. You still need 4 more to kill at close range which means you need two natural hit/crits to kill. That's a tall ask without rerolls. I could see Sensor Glads in a Vader list though. Glad 2s to give the red for an acc out the side and extra AA. More of a support role Gladiator. If only I could have Ruthless strategist as well as the sensor teams... :/
I can see the expanded use of concentrate fire tokens to fish for that accuracy on a lot of ships as well as adding ET for double-ram possibilities. I wouldn't be surprised to see CR90B/ET/SW7 as a flotilla hunter.
Yup, I think this is very likely. I'm playing Ard on Vassal now and I have a CR90b with ET for anti-flotilla duty.
Approved for Bounty Hunters in the GCW:
And I must admit, I am curious to see what sort of fleets people will make with them.
Regarding release, I got this mail from my favorite supplier:
as someone who has bought Star wars Armada itmes from us in the past, we thought you would be interested to know we are now taking preorders for 2 new ships coming end of July. The Imperial Assault Carrier and Rebel Transport expqansion packs give you a pair of each of these ships. These add an extra dimension to your battles. As while the Imperial Assault Carriers are a bit lacking in firepower, they have fleet support upgrades allowing you to coordinate and support your fleet more effectively. While the Rebel Transports allow you relay commands to your larger ships with a Comms Net. Read more and preorder at
Emphasis mine.
In my experience, distributors like to make up their own release dates, just so they can put vague rumors and such up for preorder.
Likely true. Thought I'd share it, though. ^^