how does this card work in regards to combat.

I have a 3 hit point 0 power dude who attacks. He faces a defending 3 power 3 hitpoint dude. That defending deals 3 points of damage. That 3 points of damage is assigned to my dude. That damage is applied to my dude. My dude dies

At what points am I allowed to play Stubborn Refusal?

After the dealt? After the assign? After the Apply but before my death? Or not at all in this situation?

Also, what gives me Forum points? I ve posted a ton of posts, but I go like a month with no points, but somehow I just got a point.

Can I steal forum points? Can I poison them and distribute them to my enemies? Can I protect them with intricate and deadly traps?

Hi Mateooo,

to play stubborn refusal you need a unit with damage . Units get damage with the apply step (you know that of course..)

Refering to the rulebook (p.13), there is no action window between appliing damage (put on units so that you theoretically can move it) and destroing units with as much damage as their hitpoints. So you cant play stuborn refusal in this case i guess.

And then there is this more detailed Sequence:

Battlefield Phase

1. Begin Battlefield Phase. Any Effects that initiate/resolve at the start or after the beginning of the Capitol Phase happens now following the Begin Turn order.
2. Begin Combat
2.1. Declare Target of Attack
A. The active player may take a player action, and then player actions rotate clockwise until all players have passed consecutively
2.2. Declare Attackers
A. The active player may take a player action, and then player actions rotate clockwise until all players have passed consecutively
2.3. Declare Defenders
A. The active player may take a player action, and then player actions rotate clockwise until all players have passed consecutively
2.4. Assign Damage.
A. Power icons are added
B.damage is pooled and now considered dealt by participating units.
C. The active player may take a player action, and then player actions rotate clockwise until all players have passed consecutively
2.5. Apply Damage.
A. Any cancel for damage is applied here.
B. Damage is moved on to units is now considered to have been inflicted.
C. The active player may take a player action, and then player actions rotate clockwise until all players have passed consecutively
3. End Combat
4. End Battlefield Phase. Any Effects that initiate/resolve at the end or after the end of the Battlefield Phase happens now following the End Turn order.

here its not explicit said when the unit is discarded. But after the action step 2.5C there is no more step in the apply damage window. I guess units are not discarded in the end combat step as the order in the rulebook is explicit.

the forum points... i guess you get some points for choosing an avatar ;-)

and all info i can give you is this:

"Points = Prizes
Get Points to participate in raffles and special promotions.

Participating in the Community and interacting with it is rewarded with Points, following our top secret scale (don’t bother asking, it’ll be kept secret). The Points are used to reach different levels of monthly raffles, which will let you get special promotions available only to Community Players, of all of our games, from the smallest to the largest. The more Points you have, the more levels of raffle you can reach, and the larger the games that will be available to you.

* Level 01 Raffle: for Players with more than 25 Points.
* Level 02 Raffle: for Players with more than 200 Points.
* Level 03 Raffle: for Players with more than 500 Points.
* Level 04 Raffle: for Players with more than 1000 Points.

Prizes and raffle winners will be made public on the last Friday of each month in the News section and the Forums (you can read the rules here on the Help page)."

- http://www.fantasyflightgames.com/edge_comunidad_ventajas.asp

im wondering about the pointsystem too.

thanks for the detailed explanation. The answer is as suspected, but I just wanted to make sure.

I'll go back and include this in the flowchart, but units that HP equals or is less than the amount of damage on them are removed from play at the end of the window that created the condition. In the case of combat when the damage from both pools has been applied all units are then removed before moving on to the next window 2.5C which is your first opportunity to play Stubborn Refusal.

Studdorn Refusal requires the unit to have survived the application of the damage. Only then do you have an actionwindow to move it.

so i was right *strike* :-)

@drmouse: can you please tell me whom you do have this flowchart from? it looks quite official and i wasn't able to find it...

I made it. I took all the timing rulings Nate had given me and the order sequence as it appears in the rulebook, added some numbering and voila. That is why it is the unofficial flowchart. The official flowchart will be included in the forthcoming FAQ, will be produced by Nate French and will include a level of detail that this chart does not have. It is just a thing I made for the community to better visualize what is mostly already available in a number of threads and the rulebook. It now has its own topic under rules, though it'll get barried in a couple of days.

I am really confused by this.

You all say that there is no window to play actions, but clearly there is as highlighted below:

arglor said:

At that point in time (step 2.4), the damage is only assigned, it isn't yet on any Unit (or Capital). During 2.5 it's applied, but if the Unit dies during that 2.5B, it is no longer out there for Stubborn Refusal to be of any use.

Gentlemen. I do feel you are both forgetting one thing and that is the actual text on the card itself.

The card states "ACTION: Put into play one target (DWARF) unit that entered your discard pile this turn."

This simply means at any time during your turn you can put into play (into any zone) any DWARF unit that entered your discard pile at any time during your turn. It does NOT have to have died during combat. It could have been discarded from your hand even. You also can play "Stubborn Refusal" at the end of your turn to bring a unti back before your opponent's turn starts.

I hope this helps to clarify any further questions.

carson72 said:

And I think you're mixing up your cards . The card you quoted is titled "Stand Your Ground" (from the Skavenblight BP), this thread is about the Core Set card of the title's name.

Dam is correct, the damage must actually have been on the unit in order for it to be moved, damage is only placed on a unit after 2.5 B. Until then it is simply placed near the unit, as per the rules. Since Stubborn Refusal says "Move all damage from one target unit..." it must actually be on the unit.

Holy Crap! I'm an idiot!

carson72 said:

We're a village and growing .