Ten numb

Not a chance. He may not be as competitive as he used to be in the current meta, but he is far from dead and buried. The ability to guarantee damage means he'll never be completely gone.

Alliance HWK: Jan Ors, the HWKs are pretty marginal to begin with, but she's really expensive in a very frail ship which also does not take stress well, and her ability involves taking stress?

I had to single out Jan here; she may not be the most competitive option, but she has a very solid ability. Far from dead and buried. I've seen her in some excellent lists.

Got my regional bye flying a list with Jan, and another top4 finish as well

Let's see, from the Rank F stuff I've accumulated - by the way, Rank F is "Broken" stuff, that is obsoleted so bad there's never a reason to take it when you could reach for something else, or never worked right in the first place.

TIE/Interceptors: Avenger/Saber Squadron Pilots (straight obsoleted by the RGP), Fel's Wrath, Lt. Lorrir, Tetran Cowell - all of which suffer from the "I'm not Soontir, what do I bring to the table? Nothing? Well, okay, I'll sit in your binder then... unloved..."

TIE Fighter: Obsidian Squadron Pilot (why would you EVER take this when you could take a BSP with Crackshot for 2 points more, or Wampa for 1 point more?)

TIE/FOs: Zeta Squadron Pilots, same deal as the one above but costing the same as a CrackBlack.

TIE/Phantoms and Punishers: Generic pilots. They rely too much on high PS both for getting shots off AND dodging enemy fire.

TIE/Bombers: Gamma Squadron Pilots, with the new Gamma Vets at 1 point more getting an EPT (Deadeye), what's the point?

Imperial Firesprays: Scarlet. There are SO MANY WAYS to inflict Stress these days, especially for the Empire, that using her is an exercise in masochism: "how hard do I want to make this wierd, bad pilot work?"

Alliance HWK: Jan Ors, the HWKs are pretty marginal to begin with, but she's really expensive in a very frail ship which also does not take stress well, and her ability involves taking stress?

YT1300: Outer Rim Smuggler, overpriced, underarmed, and created before FFG knew how to price ships, large ships especially.

X-Wing: Jek Porkins. This card is just BAD. There are, first of all, only a few ways to stress an X-Wing, making it hard to use his ability so he's mostly just a generic PS7 X-Wing pilot. But if he DOES get stressed, then that 3/8 chance of damaging his ship and taking away 1/6 of his life (with IA) is just downright horrible!

Scum HWK: Dace Bonearm. At his basic level (with Ion Cannon), he's 28 points for a 5 HP/2 AGI ship at PS7; and he needs other items just to become okay, for an ability that is not good and easily replicated by Feedback Arrays. Plus, his name sounds like what a 13 year old would come up with for the frontman of his imaginary heavy metal band.

Kihrahz: Graz the Hunter. If he didn't fly like a brick and wasn't pitifully easy to outmaneuver at PS6, his ability might actually be relevant. On another ship he'd be great. Here? Not so much. Plus, green dice are treacherous.

Scyk: Uh, yes? But Leatin deserves special mention. Her ability is almost the definition of "Winmore": "You didn't hit me? Well, I get an evade token!" It'd be better if it read something like, "If during the Compare Results step at least one damage would be dealt, add an Evade Token to this ship immediately."

I have to disagree with sooooooo much of this. I've personally flown Lorrir and Porkins to great effect in a competitive environment. Same with Dace Bonearm (who's name I personally enjoy for its silliness, which isn't beyond a lot of SW names). Generic Punishers... Have you tried them with tracers yet?! Guy placed very well using a trio of them in Houston's last SC. Very deadly. Gamma Squad: yup, one more point gets you an EPT... Or maybe it gets you Concussion Missiles over Plasma Torpedoes, or Homing Missiles over Concussion Missiles. Unless you need that EPT slot, it's a good discount to take and still leaves you firing before a lot of enemies, including U-Boats.

Jan Ors... Slap an EU and VI on her, and she's now very slippery and will keep buffing, just like Dace.

There's very, VERY few things in this game that are truly "dead". ORS is worthless. Fels Wrath has zero reason to ever get picked over Lt. Lorrir. Graz has little reason to be taken over a cheaper Black Sun Ace with an EPT. Zeta Squad is in an awkward spot. Obsidian though? Only a point more than Academy and gives you Predator resistance and shots before a lot of other generics. Two more points for Crack Blacks can add up fast en masse.

And that's about it. Almost anything can be potentially used to effect. Maybe they don't often, but that doesn't mean they can't be. X-Wing needs more creativity and willingness to take risks, and less hyperbole and absolutes. Folks winning with unorthodox lists/pilots happens all the time. And it's not because the cards magically became better overnight, it's because they were already viable despite being unpopular.

Captain Jonus: His ability cannot compete with guidance chips or long range scanners

Red Line: When having FCS and guidance chips, his ability is now more or less worthless

I think that Jonus might have a new lease on life with the shuttle title. He effects all secondary weapons, so cannons get the buff too remember. Give him fleet officer and/or system officer and he can offer alot to a squad.

Yes you are right. The title will probably bring him back to life

There's also a tendency in this forum to dismiss ANY attempt to rate a ship as bad, regardless of whether or not it's actually bad.

I'll agree that there are a lot of underrated ships, because the meta seems to focus solely on Rank S/A stuff without ever dipping down into Rank B/C, but there are some straight BAD ships. My definition of bad is simple:

Difficult to use in the current state of the game or requires convoluted combos and/or excessive upgrades merely to bring it up to a state on par with other, easier to use choices.

Rank F stuff is either straight obsolete when compared to other options, or has an ability that's defective in some way.

Why use Porkins when you could use Biggs to defend your ships, Wedge as a railgun, Wes to strip tokens and ruin alpha strikes, or Tarn with R7 as a defensive tank? Stretching outside the X-Wing box, he costs in the same range as a Rage Tycho Celchu, a Nera with Deadeye/Flechettes/EM/GC, a Gray Squadron stressbot, a Red Squadron Vet, a K-Wing with Tactician or TLT, Airen Cracken with Homing Missiles/GC and EPT of your choice...

Jan Ors is in that same points range, too - and can dip up into "Poe Dameron" price range too if you're not frugal, for a ship without his resilience and that takes Stress in order to work with a measly four very slow greens on the dial.

That's why Obsidian Squadron fails. The problem with saying, "Oh, gee, well, two points for Black/Crack adds up" is that the points cost is meaningless - you can't fit an extra OSP into the points space given up by downgrading from CrackBlacks, and the two dice main is pretty worthless in a space with AGI 2/3 so common. Also, if you're just filling in points, having a dedicated ship for blocking enemies is worth a lot more than an extra 2 PS, so the Academy Pilot is a better choice. Last, Wampa - Wampa is such a BEAST, costs 1 point more, and has PS4. Even absent Palpatine, he's still got a 23% chance of triggering his ability, and draws so much hate he's like a shield for the rest of your squadron.

And when was the last time you flew Lorrir? He's wretched, especially when compared to the PTL shenanigans that not just Fel but Carnor Jax can pull - and Jax also has an advantage of his ability NOT giving him Stress. Carnor also works as an anti-meta choice, Turr with VI can use Boost/BR to dodge out of arc (or turtle up behind Evade tokens). There's also the non TIE/In options - he's in the same points range as Omega Leader, Zeta Leader, Valen Rudor, Storm Squadron w/ AC, Tomax Bren w/ Crackshot, Omega Squadron Pilot w/ Crackshot, Scimitar w/ Homing Missiles/EM/GC...

Making fun of Dace Bonearm's name is sheer hyperbole, but when I have to choose between "Oh, gee, do I get a CHANCE at extra damage if I manage to hit a target sitting, or do I pick Palob and strip tokens for sure and troll them?" it's Palob every time. Heck, even Torkil is a sure thing. Let's not even get into the "what's in the same points range" as him, because while Scum & Villainy may not have much in the 25-30 range he is bare bones (Ion Cannon Turret), it does have some doozies. Clusters/Lone Wolf N'dru, anyone? It's also easy to drift further north of 30, which DOES have some solid Scum options - Zuckuss/4-LOM, U-Boat, EU Talonbane, Guri...

The pilots don't exist in a vacuum. When you compare one pilot build to other pilot builds of the same price, there are clear winners and losers. Admitting this isn't BAD; it just gives you knowledge and lets you pick stuff suited to your own skill level.

Lately I've been testing Imperial Boba Fett with Navigator, VI, EU, EM, and Seismics, just for the level of maneuverability he gives - but I'm a skilled enough player to use him well. In the hands of a beginner.... well, he wouldn't do nearly so well. Would I take him to a big tournament? I'm not sure. He is fun.

How did you use Jan Ors anyway, Comradebot? EU/VI, with a Dorsal Turret so she can do something in combat? That seems about the most sensible to me.

Iamfanboy, it's not that there's resistance to calling anything bad. It's that you're wrong about some ships, in a way that runs against lots of players' experience.

Jan Ors needs to stay inexpensive. I prefer Nien, Adaptability, and Dorsal Turret right now; she's a credible addition to a lot of lists that way.

And I am willing to change things based on what other people say.

But is that recent experience, playtested out against the top lists of today, or "I won with this two years ago" reminiscing without due consideration of how the game has changed? I feel like a lot of the OSP support is in that category, because not too long ago it WAS a valid choice versus Academies, with the extra point going to a BSP being wasted because there were no decent 1-point EPTs. Nowadays, though...

And other considerations - would you say that a Black Eight Squadron Pilot is as easy and effective as Redline, where he costs only a couple of points more? Or that Porkins is as reliable a pick as Biggs? Or that Dace Bonearm is REALLY better than two Z-95s with Feedback Arrays, or even a single Bumpmaster?

The list isn't so much for veteran players, really. It's more for beginning and intermediate players, or players who are hot on flying, and not so much evaluating ships.

I like Ten Numb, but I do wish Kanan were a smidge cheaper; he'd be great for Jan. I also have hopes that the new Smuggling compartment card also includes the HWK (and isn't too expensive), because sticking her under a Cloaking Device for a turn or two while she buffs her comrades would be great. There is in theory room for a third ship to be named on the card itself.

Based on what I've seen from all the comments above, it sounds like the best way to make every one happy is to include a Title slot on everything with 1-2 variant titles per load out.
So for example: TIE Interceptors, Title: TIE/INx2 loose 1 red die, add 1 green
OR
Yt-1300, Title The "Other YT": Ship gains EPT slot

And I am willing to change things based on what other people say.

But is that recent experience, playtested out against the top lists of today, or "I won with this two years ago" reminiscing without due consideration of how the game has changed? I feel like a lot of the OSP support is in that category, because not too long ago it WAS a valid choice versus Academies, with the extra point going to a BSP being wasted because there were no decent 1-point EPTs. Nowadays, though...

And other considerations - would you say that a Black Eight Squadron Pilot is as easy and effective as Redline, where he costs only a couple of points more? Or that Porkins is as reliable a pick as Biggs? Or that Dace Bonearm is REALLY better than two Z-95s with Feedback Arrays, or even a single Bumpmaster?

The list isn't so much for veteran players, really. It's more for beginning and intermediate players, or players who are hot on flying, and not so much evaluating ships.

I like Ten Numb, but I do wish Kanan were a smidge cheaper; he'd be great for Jan. I also have hopes that the new Smuggling compartment card also includes the HWK (and isn't too expensive), because sticking her under a Cloaking Device for a turn or two while she buffs her comrades would be great. There is in theory room for a third ship to be named on the card itself.

Whether Obsidian Squadron is a good choice is, like any pilot skill bid, entirely a metagame decision. Completely ignoring the value of a bid to PS3 is a mistake, unless PS1-2 is entirely absent from the metagame--and it isn't.

As far as Black 8 and Redline, or for that matter Glaive/Ryad or Gand Findsman/4-LOM, you usually want to try to find the points to get the named pilot. But usually doesn't mean always.

Biggs is an interesting case, because like Corran he's one of the few pilots in a ship class that's competitively useful. I don't have much to say other than that. Dace is different kind of interesting; he's rarely used because Palob and Torkil are SO good, but he's actually very powerful in the right context.

But having said all that, I really don't want to get involved in arguing over particular pilots. All I'm trying to say is that there are relatively few cards in the game that are truly so bad they can't be fielded, and any project that tries to rank pilots without specifying any real context is an interesting but not terribly meaningful exercise.

Before yesterday, I would have insisted that nothing was truly dead, merely dormant.

Now, the outer rim smuggler is safely buried. Though I believe in a shallow grave.

Agree with this. Nothing in the game is so awful and outclassed that it can't see play in even a casual game. With the reveal of a new generic YT-1300 in HotR though, especially if that generic has the same statline as the ORS and it is costed correctly, it's almost certain that the ORS will be the first ship to be absolutely pointless to use.

This is true to a degree. But for some of us who only own one copy of the YT-1300 presently, the HotR pack will at least introduce the possibility of running multiples. So yeah, a definite shallow grave, but not completely dead.