Guess I try to post this again ....

So in the meme of "if I could just change one thing that I think might help improve the game", I'd like you to consider the lowly squadron token. What if on spending a squadron token, it allowed you to activate 1/2 (rounded down) of the squadron value associated with a ship. (Subject to modification by expanded hangers of course)

This would give the MC80 and ISD the ability to activate 2 squadrons using a token. With Wave 3 and it's command dial alteration powers coming, this makes for an interesting game dynamic ahead, where sure you might take out my squadrons command, but I'll still get two off with a token that I've planned for or say like in the Imperial Case Tarkened for.

<MSK3K voice>

What do you think sirs?

</MST3K voice>

I'd like it as a passive upgrade to a ship, potentially via Crew / Officer / Admiral.

But just as an overall effect? Makes me feel like I'd be laughing all the way to the bank...

All the way... Like a Maniac...

An Evil, Evil Maniac...

... and I'm not totally convinced letting me do that is a good thing.

I agree. Eng tokens scale with the ship's eng value; CF tokens become more valuable the better your odds of rolling a blank (and therefore, with increased battery armament); even nav could be said to scale with your speed in that a higher top speed means more unpredictability offered by the nav token (a CR90 at speed 2 with a nav token is much more unpredictable than an MC80 in the same situation). Only the squadron token is as valuable on an MC30 as it is on an ISD.

Having sat and pondered this for a couple of minutes, I think this could make for a good update. I agree with Ardaedhel in particular that the squadron token seems to be the only one that doesn't scale up and down in proportion to the ship it's used by. It would be an easy change to make, work with things like Expanded Hangars without needing to change any wording, and arguably be more realistic.

The only question is, would it be too major a boost in the capabilities of the bigger ships? Assuming that one rounds up when halving the squadron total (like with Repair tokens), an ISD with expanded hangars, using a command dial and a token, would go from being able to activate 6 squadrons to 8. By contrast, a Raider in the same situation would remain stuck at 3. Would that be a game breaker?

I actually thought this was how the game worked on my first read-through last year. I was kinda bummed that it didn't and often wondered why. I too, wouldn't let it work as a blanket affect/errata. I think EVERYTHING would need to re-jiggered in terms of ship cost, etc.

Like Dras said, I think there are ways you could indrectily buff the squadron token. An officer who applied a straight buff, for example. What about a ship title or officer that allowed you to spend your own squadron tokens, to their normal affect, but also friendly ships' squadron tokens out to distance 5 for additional affect?

I've pondered this on occasion as well and I've had a hard time coming up with a way this would be a serious problem for the game. The worst I've come up with is that you could get a single super-activation of 8 squadrons (as you mentioned) which can be a fantastic amount of firepower in one activation if you're activating a cloud of bombers and then attacking with an MC80 or ISD.

On the other hand, neither squadrons nor large ships are particularly dominating the meta right now nor have they ever really (excepting early wave 2), so that doesn't seem too awful to me. Would definitely make Tarkin and Garm's stocks both go up, that's for sure.

I doubt FFG would issue an errata for this, however. You're more likely to see some kind of upgrade that buffs squadron tokens at some point in the future, I'd think.

I like the idea of charging the token to half but is you need a upgrade to bring it up to half i dont like that idea. No matter its price it would be over costed. However if an upgrade let you activate you full Squadron amount from a token existed that would be priceless

I like the idea of charging the token to half but is you need a upgrade to bring it up to half i dont like that idea. No matter its price it would be over costed. However if an upgrade let you activate you full Squadron amount from a token existed that would be priceless

Just doing it (going to Squadron 1/2 instead of just 1) - severely undercosts the other Squadron based expansions, though (Boosted Comms, Expanded Hangars, will let you get more instant gratification out of Bomber command, etc)...

I like the idea of charging the token to half but is you need a upgrade to bring it up to half i dont like that idea. No matter its price it would be over costed. However if an upgrade let you activate you full Squadron amount from a token existed that would be priceless

I think the idea would be upgrades would make it better than half. Even something like...

"Logistics Specialist" Support Crew, X points

"You may discard Logistics Specialist to treat a spent Squadrons token as a spent Squadrons dial."

Could be extremely potent when used at the right time (see: Yavaris, Command MC80) even if it's effect is only a one-time use.

I think the worry is that it would allow lists to just run with one "super carrier" that did the entirety of the squadron activations. Now IDS-1 with Wulf and Expanded Hangers and Boosted Comms can activate 8 Squadrons at once. This is close to an entire fleet's worth of fighters, so every non-Rogue Squadron list would just run with a single super carrier. Furthermore, being first player would completely decide the squadron game. If I get to activate 8 Squadrons at once, good luck having any meaningful amount of your squadrons still alive to react. We'd start seeing Squadron builds making absurd bids, because Second Player would be an automatic loss to another squadron build.

Just to clarify, I don't think this should be implemented as an errata to the game as it stands now--it would require a complete rebalancing of way too many mechanics at this point. It just has always stuck me as a strange design choice that the squadron token--inconsistent with every other token, but especially engineering--doesn't scale with the ship's corresponding capabilities.

I really would not mind this, as its kind of easy to remember too (half down vs half up.. ) yknow, on second thought, its probaly half down, which is different from repair for half up. never mind. ugh.

Gozanti, Expanded Hanger Bays.

5 activations, 28 points.

Yikes.

I personally don't think this is a good idea, and it has to do with how powerful squadrons are. Squadrons basically mitigate all defense tokens, as it is many cuts coming in on the same arc most of the time. You thought Demolisher's triple tap was bad? Now we have 8 unanswered squadron attacks from an ISD/MC80 kitted out right before it shoots all its good dice? Yeah, no thanks. It would make taking max squadrons necessary, and also make it whoever goes first wins the squadron game, which doesn't sound fun to me. I won't even get into how powerful Yavaris gets with this.

An upgrade that possibly gives out two squadron orders per token? Maybe. But not double. That sounds very broken.

Part of the reason the half value for engineering isnt a problem is that the points don't directly translate into value. 1 engineering point didn't get you one shield for example. So getting 2 engineering points instead of 1 isn't a direct doubling of actual effect (regaining shields / fixing damage)

Squadron commands are though. Activating 2 or 3 more squadrons is a direct impact. And that impact is on a significant portion of the squadrons you brought (heavy squadron lists are somewhere around 8 squads). In a light squadron list, you could activate all of your squadrons with just tokens.

And that would be too powerful.

I single squadron placed in the right place can ruin someone elses squadron game.

I'd like to see an upgrade that allowed one to have multiple squadron tokens (and in excess of a ships command value), my headcannon imagines this is a carefully planned command that takes several turns (or several upgrades) to organize.

You can launch every squadron you have against the enemy late in the game (their shields are down), at the cost of several turns commands being banked instead of used. It would synergize with Tarkin, Garm, Tantive IV, and Antilles - so cost may have to be high.

I think the worry is that it would allow lists to just run with one "super carrier" that did the entirety of the squadron activations. Now IDS-1 with Wulf and Expanded Hangers and Boosted Comms can activate 8 Squadrons at once. This is close to an entire fleet's worth of fighters, so every non-Rogue Squadron list would just run with a single super carrier. Furthermore, being first player would completely decide the squadron game. If I get to activate 8 Squadrons at once, good luck having any meaningful amount of your squadrons still alive to react. We'd start seeing Squadron builds making absurd bids, because Second Player would be an automatic loss to another squadron build.

And with that idea of a super carrier is an achilles heel, where Slicer tools can completely negate it's squadrons command.

With a refactoring of a squadron token as being 1/2 (rounded down) of the squadron number of the ship/floatilla, least large ships with a 4 squadron value like an MC80 can still activate 2 squadrons, presuming they were wise and buried a token ahead of time.

While this might add value to the squadron token, I don't think it completely upsets the apple cart given the Wave 3 counter that is coming, or via spreading your fleet out or countering with your own squadrons or ....

I dunno, eight unanswered squadron activations is pretty insane. Seven TIE Interceptors with Howlrunner and Flight Controllers would net you 46 blue dice, so averaging about 35 damage with Swarm, which is enough to kill the average squadron load out for a Regionals list. First thing. Flight Controllers would become ungodly in the squadron superiority battle.

Or how about this:

ISD with Expanded Hangars launches seven TIE Bombers/six Firesprays and Rhymer with a BCC Gozanti nearby. That's, what, an average of 10+ damage, and even a large ship would have to discard Brace/Redirect/Redirect to avoid suffering any hull damage. And that's BEFORE the ISD unloads on your face. ISDs and MC80s with EH would become the new Demolisher, able to kill the biggest enemy ships in one activation (admittedly in this case with some squadron help).

Maybe 1 squadron if a small base ship spends it, 2 if medium or large?

Gozanti, Expanded Hanger Bays.

5 activations, 28 points.

Yikes.

With the proposal....

and with expanded hanger bays it would be 3 squadron activations and with a token added 4. (3/2 rounded down is 1)

Same for the GR75.

Add in Adar ... and one gets a double tap potential for the cost of 10 more fleet points.