And once again... There is no more risk of this then there is of me confusing which Interceptor has Fell in it, or which A-Wing has Jake in it. People have had to deal with multiple pilots in the same ship since the game was first made. This is no different.

Which is why the expansion should have included an alternate art card for Poe, depicting the 'Black One', and put +1PS as a feature of the Title card, with a points increase on it to compensate. The net result is the same but the execution is more elegant.

But again, they never actually said that. The fact that you read something into it doesn't actually make it true or even relevant.

Just because they didn't say it word for word doesn't mean that's not what is being suggested. The dish is the only 'change from RotJ' to be identified specifically.

Remember how easy it was to find the differences in the TIE and TIE/FO model before we had them in hand...

This is impossible! For once, we completely agree on something!

I don't think we differ in our opinions all that much to be honest YwingAce. Except on the subject of five-winged Imperial Y-Wing wannabes.

I simply jest.

(...) ORS vs Contracted scout:

(..)

-slightly worse dial (no white sloop, 4greens vs 6)

.

This is debatable. Yes, the Scout has 1 white, (but 1 red) sloop, and has 2more greens, but is much more predictable (all greens left), and has a K less. I would say there they are on par.

Absolutely not, Scout dial is the best dial of all time.

Multiple pilots in the same ship with the same name, no.

If you can't see how there is less inherent confusion in having two different possible Han's, whom you can't run at the same time mind you... then having 6 different named pilots in the same ship on the table...

Since this has become nothing more than you repeating the same illogical, flawed and simply incorrect statements over and over again I'm done responding.

Who exactly is going to get confused? The person using the ship or the other guy? If the person using it gets confused that's completely on them and frankly anyone who gets confused about what title they put on their ship... Well they likely shouldn't be playing the game anyway if that's the case.

If the other guy gets confused. So what? They're not the one flying it so that simply doesn't matter. All in all your argument makes little sense.

You don't think that having two different yet identically named title cards, two Han pilot cards and two Chewbacca pilot cards all for the same ship is going to create any confusion? Particularly among newer players who might not have pre-existing knowledge of the older versions?

And I'd say your opponent being clear on what your ships do is very important, so yes, it does matter.

For the final time, because at this point anyone who doesn't get this just isn't bothering to read the rest of the thread. To include Poe's signature X-Wing without Poe would've been a marketing blunder.

Yes, but I do not see the need to make a change to his pilot skill as a result. Include an alternate art version of Poe depicting the 'Black One', sure, but changing the pilot skill seems needless since he functioned perfectly well at 8. Alternatively, they could have given him a new pilot ability, as they have with Han and Chewbacca, to make the choice between the versions more prominent.

From a personal standpoint, I don't see Poe as being equivalent to Vader or Han (at his best, anyway) in piloting ability, but that's less relevant.

And you'd be wrong. 2 points for 1 point of PS is meaningful enough that you will have a real choice between the two.

I remain unconvinced of that. PS9 Poe will either be too points inefficient compared with the original, or the PS bump combined with PTL and BB-8 will render the old one obsolete. I'm not in a position to claim either as the likely outcome, but I feel like the more mathematically-minded will come up with the answer.

You may want to go and read the article again, since they never actually said that.

"First of all, you might notice the ship's new, rectangular sensor array. While this is likely the first change you may notice in the difference between the sculpts, it is not the only one"

Opening line of the second paragraph under 'Updating the Millenium Falcon'.

The only thing dangerous and confusing around here are all the posts bemoaning this release.

We were always going to get a new Falcon with rectangular dish and Rey pilot card. Even though a lot of people don't want to go purchase another Falcon because they already had one there are tons and tons of people from casual players, to competitive players, to collectors that not only were willing to buy it but begging for it.

We were always going to get a FFG official repain of Poe's X-Wing with the same spectrum of people begging for it.

There is MASSIVE demand!!!!

So you see no problem with the potential for more 'updated' versions of the same pilots in the same ships, yet would categorise any criticism of the set as dangerous?

I'm not sure anyone was 'begging' for a square-dished Falcon model - new pilots for it, such as Rey (who was indeed an inevitable addition), are great and could easily have been included in a set the same way that Most Wanted included cards for ships that were not in the box. Poe's ship, as I mention above, was always likely to happen but again, I'm not sure anyone was 'begging' for it, since a lot of people who wanted one probably already painted their own.

For everyone that wants to complain about having to pay so much for the game you have the right to stop purchasing and just use what you already have. This is not a cash grab. FFG is not holding a gun to your head and forcing you to buy their products.

And if things are getting too confusing then go play Monopoly. This is a tabletop miniatures game not a children's board game.

You'll notice that I did not once mention the price of the set, went out of my way to say that I didn't think it was a cash grab or similar, and that I will probably still buy it.

The jab at my intelligence really isn't warranted. I maintain that from a design standpoint, having pilots and upgrades with identical names yet different effects can create confusion among players, and has entirely nothing to do with their intelligence or the 'level' of the game.

This forum has absolutely bottomed out. The amount of complaining that goes on around here has reached ridiculous levels. Why would people continue to play this game if things are so horrible?

Sorry that I'm singling you out. You are just one of the most recent in a very very long list of people griping about what should be one of the most obvious and anticipated releases. A release, I might add, that has lots of cool stuff.

There are a lot of hollow complaints and hyperbolic responses on this forum, like any other internet forum. That doesn't mean you can lump all complaints and criticisms together as 'hating', 'whining', or whatever other blanket term you'd use. I for one love the game, and I post my concerns because I want it to continue to succeed.

I believe I was level-headed and reasonable in my original assessment, and again you should note that I said new pilots for the T-70 and YT-1300, as well as the host of new upgrades (the ones we know and the many more we don't), are definite positive elements of the set, and that my overall impression was 'underwhelmed', not 'brimming with hate, FFG are dead to me for this cash grab'.

However anticipated or expected this release is, I think it is perfectly fair to call out the flaws with it as well as identify the positives, which is all I have done.

Sorry if you took offense to anything I said. Many of my comments were a general response to all of the complaining and I wasn't trying to put words in your mouth. I also wasn't trying to insult your intelligence, though rereading what I wrote I understand why it was taken as such. I was just trying to make a point that this being the type of game it is requires far more complex rules than kids board games and that players not only accept said complexity but play because of it.

Yes, you are correct about this being the Internet and this is indeed the type of behavior commonly found within forums. That being said, this particular forum has not always been this way, at least not to this extent. This forum has always had its share of insufferable people but it feels like the ratio of quality posts to bad (or irritating) posts has changed for the negative. I heard about this expansion, came here to see what cool stuff people are talking about only to find a giant bitchfest instead.

Again, don't take anything personally. I was venting about the forum in general and I commented on something recent rather than from page 2 that had been already been buried by twenty more pages of mostly complaints.

I'm not so certain that the Smuggler's Compartments allow a second modification.

"You may...

Modifica...

costs...

squa..."

It might be something like:

"You may only equip this

Modification if the <Illicit> upgrade

costs less/more than X

squadron points"

It would actually make a fair amount of sense to restrict which Illicits are available to the Rebels, and it seems like people are really jumping to conclusions about the second modification part...

that alternate wording makes no sense, since you need to have the mod before you get the illicit

otherwise, you'll create a time paradox

The requirement could be something else, that was just the first thing I came up with.

An alternate possibility:

"You may only equip this

Modification on a ship that

costs more than X

squadron points"

Besides, considering the wording they chose for Tomax Bren, it really wouldn't surprise me if they chose something odd here, too!

Alternatively, maybe less than X squadron points??

A little life for ORS? Maybe?

I have a hard time believing that a Han Solo card wouldn't be allowed to use the Smuggling Compartments modification...

Lots of goodies there:

- New Falcon title is basically a limited Lightning Reflexes that lets you pull off an S-Loop.

- What looks like a new YT-1300 mod (Smuggling Compartment?) that gives you an Illicit slot, along with some new Illicits, and may let you take another modification?

- PS9 Poe (albeit at +2 points for +1 pilot skill).

- T-70 title that gives you Expert Handling.

- Pilot Rey basically has Lone Wolf within her arc.

You mean double Lone Wolf.

@Funk

Still one of the most civil forums around. Long news lags really brings out the trolls here when news does finally hit. Give it a few days and a few more folks speaking up about the negativity and it'll smooth out. Don't forget to use the Report Button when folks do go overboard.

From a relatively new player's perspective I have to say that I understand why this set was made. It may still contain things that make the veterans happy, but they are not the primary market for this product, terrible as that may seem.

This is not a GW moment of shunting Vets to one side though to bring in the kids. It appears to be an attempt to get the game up to date. For all the people who enjoyed the movie and wanted to have FA moments in the game.

Nothing is sacred in this game bar the thematics. Why believe that anything should be. One aspect of game development is pushing all boundaries. I'm sure they ummed and ahhed about just reprinting the previous Poe card to go with his ship but then thought F€&k it, we can make a lot of people happy about upping him to his implied level. It's incredible how people can be upset about a three second clarification about who you have... Resistance or Rebellion, Blue or Orange?

Well done on FFG for taking on the whiners. My daughter will be ecstatic to fly around as Rey and hopefully now she'll play arcs better (she's not yet seven, I also give her an eternal focus token).

It's so important that the iconic ships are on the board and in the stores, hopefully winning tournaments too. Most people cannot relate to Jumpmasters or the old EU ships. It could be Xelyion Fighters for all they know. This game needs the iconic ships to be released and rereleased for the average guy to feel the force flooding through them.

And yes, I have a falcon, and yes, I expect to buy this, although it is not my priority; I have a lot of catching up to do...

(...) ORS vs Contracted scout:

(..)

-slightly worse dial (no white sloop, 4greens vs 6)

.

This is debatable. Yes, the Scout has 1 white, (but 1 red) sloop, and has 2more greens, but is much more predictable (all greens left), and has a K less. I would say there they are on par.

No i dont think it is. The YT1300 only has 1green to the right (and only 4 overall), they're very predictable when stressed. I would argue that Scouts are even less predictable because they can still turn around (sloop) when stressed.

Just like Zoolander, can only go left.

(...) ORS vs Contracted scout:

(..)

-slightly worse dial (no white sloop, 4greens vs 6)

.

This is debatable. Yes, the Scout has 1 white, (but 1 red) sloop, and has 2more greens, but is much more predictable (all greens left), and has a K less. I would say there they are on par.

the dial you mean?

If you think the ships are on par then the amount of crack you've smoked is far too much and I feel sorry for your loved ones.

Anybody realize that the rebels just got 2 ps 9 pilots in one **** box?

Is that gonna be a thing later down the line for anyone else?

(Nope)

Anybody realize that the rebels just got 2 ps 9 pilots in one **** box?

Is that gonna be a thing later down the line for anyone else?

(Nope)

sure

it's jsut that no one's impressed because both ships they're in get minced trivially by torpedo scouts

PS 10 Poe or PS 9 Poe is literally the same **** to a PS 3 scout

The game has moved on and PS9 is no longer the gold-standard it used to be. When the game was dominated by arc dodgers and Fat Han, moving last and shooting first mattered a lot. Stresshogs, ordnance alpha-strikes and some solid mid-PS ships with interesting abilities have made the PS landscape more interesting and less binary. PS9 is still useful and still good but it is no longer the be-all-and-end-all that it used to be.

The game has moved on and PS9 is no longer the gold-standard it used to be. When the game was dominated by arc dodgers and Fat Han, moving last and shooting first mattered a lot. Stresshogs, ordnance alpha-strikes and some solid mid-PS ships with interesting abilities have made the PS landscape more interesting and less binary. PS9 is still useful and still good but it is no longer the be-all-and-end-all that it used to be.

Agreed, but I would also add that the TIE phantom nerf also contributed to this.

Just like Zoolander, can only go left.

Derek Zoolander COULDN'T turn left. What the Jumpmaster is, is a Nega-Zoolander.

The new Millennium Falcon title and Rey are pretty sweet. I'm glad FFG is emphasizing aggressive PWTs that actually prioritize having foes in arc as an alternative to the traditional run and gun play style.

9 PS Poe Dameron with the same skill feels like a waste, but at least we're getting some more different characters for the T-70.

Black One seems... Kinda crazy. I don't like that it counters Omega Leader so effectively.

Overall neat.