To be fair the rebels in this video at least blew up 2 Death Stars and the Emperor.

More often I see rebels not destroying a single one. They just wait out the turn counter and Ding Fries are done. Imperials took too long we won we won. Sometimes I wish there was a house rule once the markers pass the Rebels immediately look at all available stage 3 missions and chose one. When they complete that mission Rebels win the game.

So make it even harder for the Rebels to win? My playgroup has yet to see a single rebel victory.

Anyways, you're missing the point of the Rebels winning. It's not like they won instantly that turn, in reality they just opposed the Empire enough that everyone across the galaxy starts openly opposing the Empire on a catastrophic scale. Entire systems revolting against the local Moffs, construction yards being abandoned or sabotaged, even fellow Imperials betraying each other or abandoning their cause. Before long the Galactic Empire becomes the Imperial Remnant and believe me, that is a never ending downward slope.

In short, its not so much that the Rebels won... its that the Imperials lost.

Indeed. Sparks of rebellion, unable to be extinguished by the empire, as the number of voices increase enough in number that no fleet or battlestation would ever again be able to silence them.

It's not their ability to destroy that wins over the populace. Terrorists can destroy. Their victory is in their ability to endure, and show the Galaxy it need not live in fear anymore.

And then the ewoks sing.

Nyub yub, my friends. Nyub yub.

I find its a feature that both sides can be getting closer and closer to victory at the same time as the game goes on. It keeps it interesting rather than create a feeling of inevitability for the last few turns.

I do understand how the imperials can look at the board and think, "I control 75% of the galaxy and outnumber the rebels 5:1, how exactly is that a rebel victory?" That's hold over thinking based on more traditional strategic games (which we all have to one level or another).

I think the American revolution is a fair real world parallel. England had more military strength and certainly controlled far more land than the fledgling colonies, but still lost the war. And America's influence ever since has grown enormously and affected much of the globe. Obviously, the parallel is not perfect as the UK and the US are allies and friends in our world, but there's enough similarity to show that in the right circumstances, that when enough people believe in an idea, the idea itself can be a powerful weapon.

Please note, I am not bringing up this point to spark real world political debate. However you feel about the countries involved, I will not waste my time to argue over patriotic ideology. There's no place for that debate in these forums. I only want to illustrate the point with an example most can understand.

The original Star Wars movies (heck, all of them) were not war movies. They were mostly about propaganda and espionage. When a power loses its sway over the masses, it is impossible for that power to remain. Machiavelli stated it is better for a leader to be feared than loved, but if the subjugated hate their ruler they will find arms and revolt.

That is what this game is about. To win, the Rebels must remove fear from the systems and encourage uprisings. The Empire must maintain its its most powerful weapon, fear, to keep the systems in line.

I find its a feature that both sides can be getting closer and closer to victory at the same time as the game goes on. It keeps it interesting rather than create a feeling of inevitability for the last few turns.

I do understand how the imperials can look at the board and think, "I control 75% of the galaxy and outnumber the rebels 5:1, how exactly is that a rebel victory?" That's hold over thinking based on more traditional strategic games (which we all have to one level or another).

My only problem is that often there is no clear battle in the end for most rebel wins. Now if the rebels complete a stage 1 or 2 objectives and that puts their prestige over the imperial turn counter I can understand that. However most games I played or seen simply has the Rebels waiting out the turn counter and holding on to the base evacuation card in case the imperials get too close and wait out the clock.

If it is too hard for rebels to pursue victory through completing missions then maybe the game doesn't have the best balance.

Sorry Sir but Our Counter passed over their counter they won.

We took multiple systems from them

We captured and froze their leader

The Rebels have yet to complete a single mission or win a single battle

Yes Sir but our cardboard counter has passed their cardboard counter even though their counter hasn't moved at all so they won.

I find its a feature that both sides can be getting closer and closer to victory at the same time as the game goes on. It keeps it interesting rather than create a feeling of inevitability for the last few turns.

I do understand how the imperials can look at the board and think, "I control 75% of the galaxy and outnumber the rebels 5:1, how exactly is that a rebel victory?" That's hold over thinking based on more traditional strategic games (which we all have to one level or another).

My only problem is that often there is no clear battle in the end for most rebel wins. Now if the rebels complete a stage 1 or 2 objectives and that puts their prestige over the imperial turn counter I can understand that. However most games I played or seen simply has the Rebels waiting out the turn counter and holding on to the base evacuation card in case the imperials get too close and wait out the clock.

If it is too hard for rebels to pursue victory through completing missions then maybe the game doesn't have the best balance.

The the Imperial player cannot win this game in 14 rounds... I don't think the problem lies with game balance...

The longer the Rebels survive, the more systems realize it is possible to fight the Empire. Those markers represent the moment when the Empire loses its rule by fear over the galaxy.

I find its a feature that both sides can be getting closer and closer to victory at the same time as the game goes on. It keeps it interesting rather than create a feeling of inevitability for the last few turns.

I do understand how the imperials can look at the board and think, "I control 75% of the galaxy and outnumber the rebels 5:1, how exactly is that a rebel victory?" That's hold over thinking based on more traditional strategic games (which we all have to one level or another).

My only problem is that often there is no clear battle in the end for most rebel wins. Now if the rebels complete a stage 1 or 2 objectives and that puts their prestige over the imperial turn counter I can understand that. However most games I played or seen simply has the Rebels waiting out the turn counter and holding on to the base evacuation card in case the imperials get too close and wait out the clock.

If it is too hard for rebels to pursue victory through completing missions then maybe the game doesn't have the best balance.

Sorry Sir but Our Counter passed over their counter they won.

We took multiple systems from them

We captured and froze their leader

The Rebels have yet to complete a single mission or win a single battle

Yes Sir but our cardboard counter has passed their cardboard counter even though their counter hasn't moved at all so they won.

Now you're exaggerating way too much. How could you lose if the rebels didn't complete a single MISSION? That means the Rebels didn't sabotage anything, never got any more systems to join them, etc etc... and the Imperials STILL lost? If that actually happened then you are completely playing the game wrong.

Anyways, it doesn't take a huge explosion to turn the tide of the Galactic Civil War, despite what the movies may say. All it takes is enough of the galaxy to oppose the Empire. That is what the turn and rebel token represent. Once those two meet, the Empire has lost control of the situation and starts to face a downward spiral. Would you really want to play as the Empire when no matter what you do you lose anyways? Once those two tokens meet, the Empire's defeat is inevitable.

It might take 10 days or it might take 10 years after those two counters meet... but the Empire's defeat is already assured.

I find its a feature that both sides can be getting closer and closer to victory at the same time as the game goes on. It keeps it interesting rather than create a feeling of inevitability for the last few turns.

I do understand how the imperials can look at the board and think, "I control 75% of the galaxy and outnumber the rebels 5:1, how exactly is that a rebel victory?" That's hold over thinking based on more traditional strategic games (which we all have to one level or another).

My only problem is that often there is no clear battle in the end for most rebel wins. Now if the rebels complete a stage 1 or 2 objectives and that puts their prestige over the imperial turn counter I can understand that. However most games I played or seen simply has the Rebels waiting out the turn counter and holding on to the base evacuation card in case the imperials get too close and wait out the clock.

If it is too hard for rebels to pursue victory through completing missions then maybe the game doesn't have the best balance.

The the Imperial player cannot win this game in 14 rounds... I don't think the problem lies with game balance...

The longer the Rebels survive, the more systems realize it is possible to fight the Empire. Those markers represent the moment when the Empire loses its rule by fear over the galaxy.

Unlike most games, this is not merely a tactical combat simulation. It represents also aspects of espionage, diplomacy and desperate chances, like in the films we love. The entire war. Not just the part fought with lasers.

If you are looking for a war based board game designed symmetrically, there are many fine games in the grand tradition of Axis and Allies to choose from. But using this to frame the galactic war in Star Wars would be doing it a disservice and feel unoriginal.

If you are looking for a symmetrical Star Wars combat game, consider instead a tactical combat based game such as Armada or X-Wing. Between those, Rebellion, Imperial Assault, the card game and the three connected role-playing games, FFG has truly got something for every style of play.

After having only two games under my belt I will say I absolutely love this game. I played Rebels both times being the most experienced player; the first game I lost badly early on due to poor base positioning and a lucky reveal followed by a surprise assault on the base which I lost. Still very enjoyable.

The most recent game was epic but I must say that the rebel victory does seem anti-climatic. After nearly 5 and half hours play I won by playing two objective cars at the start of the refresh phase which meant when the turn counter moved up a spot the Rebels auto-won. The Empire will always get it's 'money-shot' when winning (either turning the base into slag or defeating the rebels in combat) the Rebel victory is a bit 'meh'. That said, it was all about the journey.

The game really started to reveal it's complexity this time, especially once you have all the leaders out. It's very much like chess in that you need to play your leaders in a specific order to maximise your chances at success and trying to anticipate what your opponent will do or not do is a compelling part of game play.

For example, turn 7 (I think) was the critical point of this game for both sides:

I'd previously decided the turn before to not move the rebel base (stupid mistake) and the death star had moved to a system adjacent to my base. That same turn the Empire had interrogated General Reeikan and I had revealed Yavin (the base), Kessel and Ryloth as possible locations. The Death Star moved to Dathomir.

I had one chance, get the Death Star plans and successfully destroy the Death Star before it could be moved into Yavin. Alas, I din't have the plans! I played Obi Wan first on a mission to look at the top two objective cards and put one into my hand and hope one was the plans. I played it in a system near Kessel thinking the Empire wouldn't oppose as they'd need to move the fleet and it would look like the base was in Kessel. Unfortunately the Empire opposed, so much for that idea, and the mission failed.

Thinking I was doomed I launched a suicide attack against the DS from the rebel base hoping to bluff that I had the plans and lure a leader into oppose and thus keep the fleet grounded for that turn so I could escape. Again, I was thwarted, the Empire opposed with General Veers and his action card that meant he returned to the pool after combat. The fighters all died for nought.

Fortunately the Empire didn't then move the DS fleet but did some loyalty mission to Utapau, I then sent Chewie in to Dathomir to blow up 2 health worth of ground troops. The next round the Empire moves the DS fleet into Yavin, the base is revealed. I've left Jedi Luke back to resist and due to Chewie's previous sabotage we win the ground battle.

I'm now waiting for the Superlaser mission but the Empire didn't have it assigned - big mistake and relief all round in the rebel base.

We then activated the base move at the end of the phase and fled to Ryloth. The Empire had another turn but got nowhere near and I won by playing two objectives the end of turn 8.

Can't wait for the next game.

I had a very close game against my son who played Empire.

He turned Mon Mothma to the Darkside.

He was closing in on the base and so I moved it (from Nal Hutta). He later narrowed the new base location to two systems. He had 2 Deathstars by then, I destroyed one, and the counters were 2 apart. I could probably win the next turn due to objectives in my hand, and certainly would the turn after. I missed a chance of an extra counter advance too, I had an objective to destroy a SD,he has one in a queue that I could destroy by using a card (sorry don't remember which one), but I got prompted when he did a mission that allows one unit to insta-build from his build queue.

So, he has 1 DS left, I have played another Rapid Mobilisation to move again, but this gets resolved at the end of the turn. On a whim he used the Super Laser and destroys Mygeeto... Victory for the Empire.

GREAT GAME!

I have to agree with all those who love this game. I've only played twice, once as either side, and both have been amazing, with deep drama each turn.

Like the time I saw the rebels massing on one card, so I rushed my interrogation. Cue the rebels breaking mon monthma out of carbonite (just after she gave up the bases location), murdering my stormtroopers then running an uprising to completely flip the mon cal system (with wulff on the last gozanti out )

Or even better, the game that ended with a massive surge by the rebels, deploying both space and ground forces into coruscant via a variety of means to pull off heart of the empire.


If you're finding this game dull or that people are just waiting out the clock then I suggest playing much more aggressively. Sure, you'll probably win less but you will have so many awesome stories in your head (such as Chewie repeatedly failing to stop all his closest friends being kidnapped and tortured turn after turn).

If you're finding this game dull or that people are just waiting out the clock then I suggest playing much more aggressively. Sure, you'll probably win less but you will have so many awesome stories in your head (such as Chewie repeatedly failing to stop all his closest friends being kidnapped and tortured turn after turn).

If you're playing the Empire, it is easy to keep the Rebels from "waiting out the clock". Capture leaders and force them to tell you where the base is! Draw more probe card and project cards! Those project cards are all very powerful and can change the game dramatically.

It's a bad idea to wait out the clock as a Rebel player. The Rebels should always be forcing the Empire to react to their missions. The second you give the Empire room to breath they'll send Liam Neeson...

I find its a feature that both sides can be getting closer and closer to victory at the same time as the game goes on. It keeps it interesting rather than create a feeling of inevitability for the last few turns.

I do understand how the imperials can look at the board and think, "I control 75% of the galaxy and outnumber the rebels 5:1, how exactly is that a rebel victory?" That's hold over thinking based on more traditional strategic games (which we all have to one level or another).

My only problem is that often there is no clear battle in the end for most rebel wins. Now if the rebels complete a stage 1 or 2 objectives and that puts their prestige over the imperial turn counter I can understand that. However most games I played or seen simply has the Rebels waiting out the turn counter and holding on to the base evacuation card in case the imperials get too close and wait out the clock.

If it is too hard for rebels to pursue victory through completing missions then maybe the game doesn't have the best balance.

Sorry Sir but Our Counter passed over their counter they won.

We took multiple systems from them

We captured and froze their leader

The Rebels have yet to complete a single mission or win a single battle

Yes Sir but our cardboard counter has passed their cardboard counter even though their counter hasn't moved at all so they won.

The whole game is an abstraction and the fact that you track a victory condition with cardboard counters is not really a valid critique. The Imperials victory condition just involves small pieces of plastic. Plus you are not actually freezing anyone in carbonite, you are putting a cardboard ring on a plastic and cardboard game piece. I know you know this and are joking, but they way you phrase Imperial's accomplishing actual items versus moving cardboard for Rebels is very one sided. It takes a lot to move that cardboard before the Imperials find and destroy the base.

I would go on to say that requiring a clear battle in the end would destroy the asymmetry of the game, although in many of my games, they do end with a battle where the Rebels take a out a Star Destroyer or Death Star. Like I have said before, you need to look at what the Rebels are doing in total to achieve victory and not necessarily what happens when they move the last tracker. I mean if in one turn I destroy the death star, gain popular support throughout the galaxy and liberate a planet and then later in the refresh phase, the time token moves over the Rebel reputation token, its quite clear that its not a matter of waiting things out, but rather those concrete items that won the game. A 14 turn game that the Imperials lose is a loss that the Imperials handed to the Rebellion, there is no way that the Imperials should not have found and destroyed the Rebel base even if Rapid Mobilization kicked in once or twice.

One other thing that contributes to the Imperial feeling around losing is the nature of information for each player:

1. The Rebels always know what Objectives they have in hand and how close and how large the Imperial fleets are in relation to their hidden base.

2. The Imperials end up with imperfect knowledge of Rebel Objectives and the location of the Rebel Base. (there are missions that can help mitigate this, in fact a lot of the missions help in this are).

The result? The Rebel player is generally more mentally prepared to lose when they lose than the Imperial player is.

The most recent game was epic but I must say that the rebel victory does seem anti-climatic. After nearly 5 and half hours play I won by playing two objective cars at the start of the refresh phase which meant when the turn counter moved up a spot the Rebels auto-won. The Empire will always get it's 'money-shot' when winning (either turning the base into slag or defeating the rebels in combat) the Rebel victory is a bit 'meh'. That said, it was all about the journey.

FYI you can play, at most, one objective card per combat and one objective card per Refresh phase.

The most recent game was epic but I must say that the rebel victory does seem anti-climatic. After nearly 5 and half hours play I won by playing two objective cars at the start of the refresh phase which meant when the turn counter moved up a spot the Rebels auto-won. The Empire will always get it's 'money-shot' when winning (either turning the base into slag or defeating the rebels in combat) the Rebel victory is a bit 'meh'. That said, it was all about the journey.

FYI you can play, at most, one objective card per combat and one objective card per Refresh phase.

Dammit you are correct, totally forgot that rule! Might not have made much difference, maybe...

The most recent game was epic but I must say that the rebel victory does seem anti-climatic. After nearly 5 and half hours play I won by playing two objective cars at the start of the refresh phase which meant when the turn counter moved up a spot the Rebels auto-won. The Empire will always get it's 'money-shot' when winning (either turning the base into slag or defeating the rebels in combat) the Rebel victory is a bit 'meh'. That said, it was all about the journey.

Imperial victories can be 'meh' too. Like when the Rebels successfully fend off an Imperial assault and move their base in the nick of time, then in the next round the Imperials land a single trooper by chance on your empty base before you can protect it! (not that I'm bitter at all)

Thank you Emporer! But the Rebel base is in another system.