USA is one of the best countries in the world, lets keep improving it also by learning the better things from other countries
The United States of America has a long and successful tradition of pilfering the best parts of other countries/cultures and incorporating them into itself.
I thought theft was the highest form of flattery... 
Actually I saw a great video about this the other day.
Any chance you couby ld explain (in a language that most of us will understand) exactly how a Lightsaber works?... I have a PhD in physics from Cambridge...
Cheers
Baaa
Sorry can't post link, but a Google search of scientists explain how lightsaber works well find you your answer
I preferred this explanation -
A typical saber hilt is roughly 12 inches (30 centimeters) long, about the size of a large flashlight. Yours may be a little longer or even a hair shorter, but don't let that concern you. The full length of the weapon won't be obvious until it's turned on -- and even then, it's all about how you use it.
It appealed to my lack of maturity.
Cheers
Baaa
Well played, sir. Most of your posts make me smile, but this one made me laugh out loud. Well played.
I like your articulate arguments and supporting evidence you provided. that expensive american education really paid off and proves to be much superior to my free italian-british education
You're the one making ludicrous claims about Common Core guidelines, the onus is on you to support them. Not on us to demonstrate that they're wrong. Which they are, and which you would know after a google search or two.
Common Core does have actual problems, but none of them have been described in this thread thus far. Since you appear to have some affection for elite American universities, go ahead and plug "Harvard" and "Common Core" into google. Plenty of material there to keep you busy, if you're actually interested.
Even if you aren't, hey, maybe a lurker or two will learn something.
I like your articulate argument about the fact that I have to provide arguments while you don't have to provide any, but merely state as a matter of fact that I am making ludicrous claims. it really shows your expensive american education paid off and proves to be superior to my second rate free italian-british education.
I also like how you create a straw man argument that implies I'm the only one in this thread criticizing common core, nicely ignoring someone whose spouse actually works in an american school dislikes common core with a passion.
However the best part is implying Harvard supports common core while not providing any actual link to the fact. I mean, I'm sure some people at Harvard support common core, and probably some don't. Big deal?
Or perhaps, instead of reading "education experts" opinions, you could, you know, actually check out the real textbooks yourself: see this link from someone posting pictures of an old textbook and a new common core textbook
or since you like to use google, you could actually google plenty of examples from parents frustrated with common core homework, never mind the one about the commutative properties that you nicely ignore since it's already been demonstrated here it was an isolated example due to a bad teacher. Here I copy one other example from you, this should be easier for you to demonstrate how ludicrous my arguments are, for example you could easily blame it on the poor girl having a poor intelligence, or again a bad teacher, or perhaps a math illiterate parent, so much choice!
Last night my daughter and I spent over three hours on one math problem in her homework.
For fun she demonstrated how she was taught to solve the problem 302 x 6 = 192
Step 1, write the problem: 302 x 6 =
Step 2, write the number from the hundreds place to simplify the problem: 300 x 6 =
Note: She seemed to be unsure if she was rounding at this point. She asked, “If the number was 350 would we round up to 400”. (The class has been working of fuzzy logic and rounding in 4th grade.)
Step 3, underline the first digits: (3)00 x (6) =
Step 4, multiply the first two numbers together: 300 x 6 = 18
Step 5, cross out the two zeros: 3(00) x 6 = 18
Step 7, bring the two zeros over: 3(00) x 6 = 1800
Step 8, write -2 on the left side of the paper with an arrow pointing down: 300 x 6 = 1800 -2
Step 9, multiply 2 x 6 and find the product: 300 x 6 = 1800 -2 2 x 6 = 12
Note: at this point she had lost all sense of why we were splitting up 302 into 300 and 2. She was focused on memorizing the convoluted steps and sadly never captured the “core” concept that was poorly demonstrated. Nothing made sense to her at this point and she could no longer remember if she should write 1800 + 2 or 1800 + 6 or 1800 + 8 to find the correct answer. I reminded her that she had missed a step, she then quickly wrote the next step 1800 + 12.
The key here is that she is memorizing each step as a convoluted math game that an adult just wants her to do. She is not demonstrating that she understands how the numbers correlate to each other. I spent the next 3 hours trying to explain to her that the concept is the same as this one: 302 x 6 = 300 x 6 + 2 x 6 = 1800 + 12 =1812
Three hours later I realized I had made a mistake. I should have just showed her:
302 x 6 = 1812
Why is this even being discussed...
Neutronium (packing a bunch of neutrons together into a 'solid' mass), a form of degenerate matter, can only exist in a collapsed stellar remnant following a supernova of a massive star. The gravity of the star has overcome the pressure of the atoms to repulse each other and the electrons and protons have collapsed into neutrons.
Anyway, common core curriculum is one of the banes of the American education system. Speaking as the husband of a school psychologist I can attest to the silliness of common core math and it's teaching techniques. Even addition is taught with many redundant steps that anyone educated a generation ago would be very confused by.
what amazes me most in america is not so much the idiotic things I meet, but the amount of americans who defend the idiotic things and utterly ignore or deride anything that is not american, like saying europeans are communists for having free education and health care, and that america is best in everything, and the core system is great.
so thank you, and all americans who don't immediately defend something because it's american.
USA is one of the best countries in the world, lets keep improving it also by learning the better things from other countries
...what? You spouted complete and utter nonsense and berated my ::ahem:: "expensive american education" without having even an inkling of a clue as to where I was educated. Now you want to pretend like it's Americans, not you, who are defending (or in your case, berating) something because it's American? As if they're the obstinate ones and not you? Are you actually out of your mind?
I have a degree in mathematics. An actual degree. From an actual accredited university. Not YouTube knowledge I pass off as a PhD. Common Core is just fine. It's not just fine, it's *good*. You clearly have no clue what you're talking about here so maybe you can step down off of that high horse, stop shouting about how bad American education is, and maybe just learn a thing or two about the stuff you decide to spout off about.
kthxbye
Edited by EvaUnit02Again... Stop.. this is a game intended to be fun and these forms are for sharing the passion of the game so go see who's Dicksons are bigger somewhere else
Ugh, I'm coming to this thread rather late, and there's a TON to respond to. I'm going to have to pick and choose, or I'll be here all night.
With regard to the American higher education system, and education in Asia. Most of the finest minds in Asia are being sent to be (further) educated in the United States, because higher education really is one of the finest remaining industries in the United States. I'm not saying that as an American nationalist, just one who works in American higher education, and has also attended higher (post-graduate) education (as well as primary and secondary education) in Europe.
The problem with American education (because there are many flaws) is that it's highly unequal, and so the best of American education is among the best in the world (yes, hat tip to the great British institutions as well), and some of the worst is really bad. It's also really expensive, unless you can get the right scholarships. But American education does something that many non-American schools absolutely fail at - instilling critical thinking skills, rather than rote memorization.
Regarding labor standards in China - no, it's not a matter of dragnetting people out of the farm and shackling them into factories. That is not how it works. It's very much akin to the industrial revolutions that much of the Western world went through a century (or more) ago - complete with the period of shoddy products and grotesque treatment of workers. That's not peculiar to China - and if we want China to improve (and China is improving), then we need to let them see the process through. When labor standards improve, our plastic spaceships (or whatever else we're playing with at that time) will be coming from Indonesia or Pakistan. Hopefully, a decade later they'll be coming from Nigeria. Or, it'll be cheaper 3D printing, who knows.
The point is: don't begrudge China the manufacturing of our plastic spaceships. That's not a great job that we should wish to insource. The bulk of the value added is going to Minneapolis, Burbank, and Paris.
Or, to utterly switch sides, how about I lament that our spaceships are being made by yellow people, and I would pay extra if it was proudly made by white people?
...Yeah... that felt icky just to write. Same principle applies.
Doesn´t ´made in America´ also mean it might have been made in Canada, Peru, Mexico, Chile, Brazil, Suriname, French Guyana, Honduras, Belize, Panama, El Salvador, etc.?I have given this more thought. And made in America is even LESS important than I thought.
If made in America means ...made in California...or made in Maine or made in Kentucky...
After all you can´t claim the title of all of the Americas just for one country.... can you....?
Isn't Suriname part of the Netherlands?
In the Americas there are 3 countries who recognize the King of the Netherlands as their head of state; Curaçao, Aruba, and Sint-Maarten.
There are three Islands directly part of the Netherlands itself;Bonaire,Sint-Eustatius, and Saba
There is one country in Europe besides the Netherlands where Dutch is spoken as a primary language. But they keep reminding me here it became independent in 1830 
Personally, I also would prefer production in the US so we could avoid the 3 month boats. If they were made in the USA, it would just be a quick truck or train ride to Roseville, and we could go from "On the Truck" to "Shipping Now" in a week or less.
Ugh, I'm coming to this thread rather late, and there's a TON to respond to. I'm going to have to pick and choose, or I'll be here all night.
With regard to the American higher education system, and education in Asia. Most of the finest minds in Asia are being sent to be (further) educated in the United States, because higher education really is one of the finest remaining industries in the United States. I'm not saying that as an American nationalist, just one who works in American higher education, and has also attended higher (post-graduate) education (as well as primary and secondary education) in Europe.
The problem with American education (because there are many flaws) is that it's highly unequal, and so the best of American education is among the best in the world (yes, hat tip to the great British institutions as well), and some of the worst is really bad. It's also really expensive, unless you can get the right scholarships. But American education does something that many non-American schools absolutely fail at - instilling critical thinking skills, rather than rote memorization.
Regarding labor standards in China - no, it's not a matter of dragnetting people out of the farm and shackling them into factories. That is not how it works. It's very much akin to the industrial revolutions that much of the Western world went through a century (or more) ago - complete with the period of shoddy products and grotesque treatment of workers. That's not peculiar to China - and if we want China to improve (and China is improving), then we need to let them see the process through. When labor standards improve, our plastic spaceships (or whatever else we're playing with at that time) will be coming from Indonesia or Pakistan. Hopefully, a decade later they'll be coming from Nigeria. Or, it'll be cheaper 3D printing, who knows.
The point is: don't begrudge China the manufacturing of our plastic spaceships. That's not a great job that we should wish to insource. The bulk of the value added is going to Minneapolis, Burbank, and Paris.
Or, to utterly switch sides, how about I lament that our spaceships are being made by yellow people, and I would pay extra if it was proudly made by white people?
...Yeah... that felt icky just to write. Same principle applies.
American school are right on post with Canadian ones.
I'm talking grade school up to high school, which is the most important because this is where you develop.
I mean I've seen many Americans not even able to list every state, simple math that when their till broke they didn't know how much change to give.
It's not the people fault, it's the educators, and teachers union.
Their way to teach is terrible.
And well I guess I can't speak for the US Canada It's pretty bad
Why does a teacher need to have a pd day every second week?
In Japan they do that on the weekends
Also teachers here get the summer off with pay.
Wish I could get a 2 month paid vacation.
Not also mention the times kids miss due to snow storms.
Our system is a joke
And the Universities.
There are many who can't afford places like Harvard, or MIT. They are private businesses and they are wreaking the benefits off of the high education costs which is increasing year by year
There are countries that have (and actually the dean or president of one near by me agree) University education should be free
It be a long term investment but in a decade your going to start getting more and more qualified people that'll be able to contribute to the economy etc. Rather than have to resort to tax payer dollars to live feed kids etc.
And when you say Asia coming to the US that wouldn't include Japanese. Tokyo University is very hard to get into, so if there was only reason would be they couldn't get the courses they wanted, or were unable to get into their school, or maybe wanted to travel, but it's not because US has better University that is for sure
Don't compare China to our industrial revolution
Sure we didn't have the regulations in place, but we also didn't create cancer towns at the rate of China.
I've never once heard that you couldn't see the sun through the smog, and people were recommended to stay in doors here in North America from the pollution.
China is,(or was) booming and the people making the money are also the ones running the country with no regard to the villages that they are dumping toxic waste into their drinking water.
So don't go Compare them to our industrial revolution. It's not the same
Ours wasnt much better work standards but environment wise they are much worse, and sickens me, and I'm pretty sure people here were still paid better than in China today.
The people work crazy long hours, for very little pay, and in some cases children too
If they are doing something about it, it only because they can no longer hide it from the world.
If we didn't have social media Internet etc like in the 80s you think they'd change.
Nope I highly doubt it.
China only starts to care when they think they don't look good to the outside world
Edited by Krynn007Not including top brass Universities like Harvard where only the rich can basically afford unless you got a scholarship.American school are right on post with Canadian ones.
I'm talking grade school up to high school, which is the most important because this is where you develop.
I mean I've seen many Americans not even able to list every state, simple math that when their till broke they didn't know how much change to give.
It's not the people fault, it's the educators, and teachers union.
Their way to teach is terrible.
And well I guess I can't speak for the US Canada It's pretty bad
There's a lot here I agree with, and I can't speak to the Canadian case, other than to say that I had some great academic conferences in BC, and they seem to have fine higher ed institutions. (I didn't deal with the students or see their teaching methods - so, again, I can't really comment from personal experience).
As I said, the United States' primary and secondary education system is highly unequal, and there are plenty of horror stories. If you control for social class, then the United States runs in the middle of the pack of OECD countries. (Canada does seem to do better, it seems, scoring in the top tier of OECD countries - source.)
Blaming teachers unions is certainly popular, but misguided I think. Countries with much stronger teachers unions (e.g. Finland) perform very strongly. I do think that a number of European cases do better with strong teachers unions because their unions are not in a trench war the way US teachers unions are. US teachers unions are extremely defensive, because the politics in the United States are much more zero-sum in nature, without much collaboration between the unions and their critics for the common good.
But that's quite aside from the higher education system. Top tier universities are great because they are also able to get the best students on scholarships and keep their reputations high, so that they can charge high tuitions for the mediocre students who happen to be scions of the rich and well-connected. I am curious about the value-added of such schools, however.
There are countries that have (and actually the dean or president of one near by me agree) University education should be freeIt be a long term investment but in a decade your going to start getting more and more qualified people that'll be able to contribute to the economy etc. Rather than have to resort to tax payer dollars to live feed kids etc.
And when you say Asia coming to the US that wouldn't include Japanese. Tokyo University is very hard to get into, so if there was only reason would be they couldn't get the courses they wanted, or were unable to get into their school, or maybe wanted to travel, but it's not because US has better University that is for sure
There's no doubt that there are some really exclusive universities in Asia. You mention Tokyo University. You might also talk about the Indian Institutes of Technology. However, as you say, those are highly exclusive. In fact those exclusive universities have stricter entrance processes than even Ivy League American institutions have (acceptance rates of <2% rather than 9-10%), and they select students who are good at taking tests, rather than looking at a broader range of what the student is about and is capable of.
Even so, being able to collect the sharpest kids is great, but it doesn't say anything about the value-added by those universities - same as with the Harvards and MITs. Obviously, for those kids who can get into Harvard and MIT and such on scholarship (which, yes, they're private institutions, but they're not profit-seeking institutions) it's great - and there are a lot more of those than you might think - also, those students getting in on those scholarships get connected to the rich kids, who can help them out with their connections after college life. The value of these places is as much in who they get to know, as what they learn - as well as the positive reputation.
Anecdotally, I can compare middle-of-the-road American universities, where I've studied and taught to a few Dutch universities, where I attended (or loitered).
...oh, excuse me for a moment...
Ik ben ook Nederlands-talig, trouwens!!
...sorry, I had to weigh in on the Dutch speakers showing themselves around here. Where was I?
Like is said about many Asian Universities, I found Dutch universities to be very top-down, and more focused on memorization and test taking, rather than really learning how to think. Sure, those are great for being able to regurgitate information, but that doesn't give students critical-thinking skills - being able to apply different perspectives to problems, etc. I was pretty depressed through much of my time in higher education in the Netherlands - in what is supposed to be one of their finest institutions - after getting my undergraduate degree from a pretty mediocre American college (non-flagship state institution). The style of education was much less creative (simple lecturing), rather than having a format that induces the students to think and work through problems with the teacher's guidance.
Don't compare China to our industrial revolution
Sure we didn't have the regulations in place, but we also didn't create cancer towns at the rate of China.I've never once heard that you couldn't see the sun through the smog, and people were recommended to stay in doors here in North America from the pollution.
China is,(or was) booming and the people making the money are also the ones running the country with no regard to the villages that they are dumping toxic waste into their drinking water.
So don't go Compare them to our industrial revolution. It's not the same
Ours wasnt much better work standards but environment wise they are much worse, and sickens me, and I'm pretty sure people here were still paid better than in China today.
The people work crazy long hours, for very little pay, and in some cases children too
If they are doing something about it, it only because they can no longer hide it from the world.
If we didn't have social media Internet etc like in the 80s you think they'd change.
Nope I highly doubt it.
China only starts to care when they think they don't look good to the outside world
When you talk about cancer towns at the rate of China - of course not directly comparable. China is industrializing at a rate much faster than the West did, with a population that is much, MUCH greater. Also, as an authoritarian country, its leadership can get away with a lot more. But let's not sugarcoat what the industrial revolution in the West was like. In those days you didn't get a chance to die of cancer (to the degree that they identified causes of death as such), because you died of all sorts of other diseases, if you didn't get eaten by the machine you were working on. Also, plenty of child labor there too.
Regarding the environment, there's no question that China is the biggest polluter these days, but they're also working harder (compared to their capabilities) to turn the ship around. The Chinese leadership knows what the problem is, and they're taking steps. The US leadership is blocked by a faction that doesn't believe the pollution is a major problem.
As to how well people are paid, I don't have insight into particulars, right now inequality in China is getting lower, whereas in most of the 19th century (as well as now in the 21st), inequality is growing in the United States and Europe. A large part of that is bringing subsistence farmers into the money economy, for sure, but the same was true in the 19th century for the United States, yet inequality grew, rather than come down.
So, the United States really is doing yeoman's work in higher ed, but it doesn't take a highly educated people to crank out and paint plastic spaceships. It takes smart and inventive people to invent and design the games to begin with. That's why the value-added remains in the United States (and France, now), and we shouldn't despise the Proudly Painted in China.
Neutronium (packing a bunch of neutrons together into a 'solid' mass), a form of degenerate matter, can only exist in a collapsed stellar remnant following a supernova of a massive star. The gravity of the star has overcome the pressure of the atoms to repulse each other and the electrons and protons have collapsed into neutrons.
Anyway, common core curriculum is one of the banes of the American education system. Speaking as the husband of a school psychologist I can attest to the silliness of common core math and it's teaching techniques. Even addition is taught with many redundant steps that anyone educated a generation ago would be very confused by.
what amazes me most in america is not so much the idiotic things I meet, but the amount of americans who defend the idiotic things and utterly ignore or deride anything that is not american, like saying europeans are communists for having free education and health care, and that america is best in everything, and the core system is great.
so thank you, and all americans who don't immediately defend something because it's american.
USA is one of the best countries in the world, lets keep improving it also by learning the better things from other countries
...what? You spouted complete and utter nonsense and berated my ::ahem:: "expensive american education" without having even an inkling of a clue as to where I was educated. Now you want to pretend like it's Americans, not you, who are defending (or in your case, berating) something because it's American? As if they're the obstinate ones and not you? Are you actually out of your mind?
I have a degree in mathematics. An actual degree. From an actual accredited university. Not YouTube knowledge I pass off as a PhD. Common Core is just fine. It's not just fine, it's *good*. You clearly have no clue what you're talking about here so maybe you can step down off of that high horse, stop shouting about how bad American education is, and maybe just learn a thing or two about the stuff you decide to spout off about.
kthxbye
I'm sorry, you're right. you helped me realize now I am american and I should accept the fact america's education system is the best, because people from Asia come here. You're right, me working as a postdoc in USA, UK, Germany and Korea is just youtube knowledge, as I spent all my time watching lolcats videos.
In fact, when I was in Korea I couldn't see a single person between the ages of 5 and 60. So I asked an old ajumma:
me: "Grandma, where is everybody?"
she: "In America, to study."
me: "what about the hot girls singing in korean pop videos?"
she: "in America"
then she started praying.
me: "why are you praying?"
she: "that President Trump does not build a wall in the Pacific, where would we send our kids to be educated then?"
me: "but he wants to build it at the border with Mexico"
she: "aren't China and Russia greater enemies to America than Mexico?"
me: "well yes"
she: "wouldn't a wall stop chinese and russian submarines and ships"
me: "I suppose it would"
and she resumed praying, and I joined her.
XBear exits stage left
Edited by XBear@Mikael, I agree income inequality in USA is getting worse, but I don't think you're right when you say it's getting better in China. I mean I did not spend half an hour researching, I just did a quick googling, but it seems at least one study from the University of Michigan says income inequality in China is getting worse: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-04-30/chinas-income-inequality-gap-widens-beyond-u-dot-s-dot-levels
just to offer my personal experience to the discussion on the education systems of different countries the latest posts have been about, I agree that in USA and in my experience also UK, there's a wide quality gap between the top universities and the middle or low tier.
I got my 1st degree in physics in italy, and the quality was outstanding. professors are paid by the government and tuition is free or almost free depending on your income. Then I went to a low tier university in UK and I was astonished at the abysmal quality. the courses were way too easy and the powerpoint slides (something new to me, as I was brought up on the blackboard) had several errors. Then I went to Cambridge and the quality there is outstanding.
I think one of the reasons for the wide gap in quality between universities is financial. In Italy all universities are government institutions and do not depend for funding from private donations or tuitions, so it's easier to maintain a level quality for all universities. Of course, some are considered a bit better than others, but in my experience there is no such wide gap as I witnessed in USA and UK.
in my experience, one flaw with the american colleges is the excessive reliance on continuous tests. in italy, I would not take a single test during classes, then at the end of the course we would take a written exam, and an oral exam. Oral exams were tough. things like "demonstrate theorem X". you pick up the chalk and write on the blackboard for half an hour.
I remember 2 years ago this guy prepared a midterm test for a physics course in an american college. one of the questions was whether metals were ionic or covalent. well, they are neither. O2 is covalent, NaCl is ionic, but, generally speaking, metals have delocalized electrons in hybridized bands. I pointed this out to him but he did not tell his students, he just marked them down even though it was impossible to get the right answer. This is just such basic knowledge it is appalling to see an instructor getting it wrong. In italy, over the course of 5 years I noticed only 3-4 mistakes made by a professor, and each time someone corrected them they acknowledged their mistake and moved on immediately. In the low tier university in UK the same thing happened, correcting a professor was a drama (even if later some of them acknowledged their mistake quietly).
Inconsistent quality is a big problem.
Edited by XBear@Mikael, I agree income inequality in USA is getting worse, but I don't think you're right when you say it's getting better in China. I mean I did not spend half an hour researching, I just did a quick googling, but it seems at least one study from the University of Michigan says income inequality in China is getting worse: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-04-30/chinas-income-inequality-gap-widens-beyond-u-dot-s-dot-levels
There are usually big asterisks behind Chinese statistics. However, for years now the GINI coefficient has been coming down, while the US GINI has been rising. Now, maybe Univ. of Michigan (an excellent institution) is right, while the Chinese stats are smoke and mirrors, it's hard to say. Still, the Michigan numbers do highlight the recent turnaround in the numbers, which this graph can show have come down considerably since 2005.
Also, this roughly the same level that the United States has, which had the GINI at ~0.46 in 2014 according to the American Community Survey. So, my point is related to the direction of the trend.
[...]
Inconsistent quality is a big problem.
This is true - which also touches on both of our anecdotal evidence. There are also a lot of differences between individual professors. Furthermore, we're looking at moving targets. The way I teach is different from the way I was taught. The way I teach is also very different from how the guy next door to me in the faculty building teaches. Much also depends on the discipline in question. International Studies (which I teach) is a very different thing from Physics. I'm sure European schools are changing too.
No thanks. What's so proud about stuff getting manufactured in one place and not the other?
As long as the quality is matching the price, it's all good.
If anything, I'd love to be able to purchase unpainted, unassembled kits for the minis. Should be dirt cheap in bulk and the game is about buying cardboard anyway, so it's not like FFG sales would get hit.
No thanks. What's so proud about stuff getting manufactured in one place and not the other?
As long as the quality is matching the price, it's all good.
If anything, I'd love to be able to purchase unpainted, unassembled kits for the minis. Should be dirt cheap in bulk and the game is about buying cardboard anyway, so it's not like FFG sales would get hit.
I agree with you there's nothing to be proud. I just think that if american companies benefit from taxpayers money (tax breaks, bail-outs, infrastructure built with tax money), then they should reinvest that money in USA by hiring americans. it's not that trading with other countries is bad, by all means I think it can be good. but if american companies outsource jobs to china to a significant degree, then they should go ask china when they need tax breaks, zero-interest loans from tax payers, and bail outs.
I agree with you there's nothing to be proud. I just think that if american companies benefit from taxpayers money (tax breaks, bail-outs, infrastructure built with tax money), then they should reinvest that money in USA by hiring americans. it's not that trading with other countries is bad, by all means I think it can be good. but if american companies outsource jobs to china to a significant degree, then they should go ask china when they need tax breaks, zero-interest loans from tax payers, and bail outs.No thanks. What's so proud about stuff getting manufactured in one place and not the other?
As long as the quality is matching the price, it's all good.
If anything, I'd love to be able to purchase unpainted, unassembled kits for the minis. Should be dirt cheap in bulk and the game is about buying cardboard anyway, so it's not like FFG sales would get hit.
@Mikael, I agree income inequality in USA is getting worse, but I don't think you're right when you say it's getting better in China. I mean I did not spend half an hour researching, I just did a quick googling, but it seems at least one study from the University of Michigan says income inequality in China is getting worse: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-04-30/chinas-income-inequality-gap-widens-beyond-u-dot-s-dot-levels
There are usually big asterisks behind Chinese statistics. However, for years now the GINI coefficient has been coming down, while the US GINI has been rising. Now, maybe Univ. of Michigan (an excellent institution) is right, while the Chinese stats are smoke and mirrors, it's hard to say. Still, the Michigan numbers do highlight the recent turnaround in the numbers, which this graph can show have come down considerably since 2005.
Also, this roughly the same level that the United States has, which had the GINI at ~0.46 in 2014 according to the American Community Survey. So, my point is related to the direction of the trend.
[...]
Inconsistent quality is a big problem.
This is true - which also touches on both of our anecdotal evidence. There are also a lot of differences between individual professors. Furthermore, we're looking at moving targets. The way I teach is different from the way I was taught. The way I teach is also very different from how the guy next door to me in the faculty building teaches. Much also depends on the discipline in question. International Studies (which I teach) is a very different thing from Physics. I'm sure European schools are changing too.
I don't have much to add but a small point which is important to me 
, I consider my experiences data points, not anecdotes 
No thanks. What's so proud about stuff getting manufactured in one place and not the other?
As long as the quality is matching the price, it's all good.
If anything, I'd love to be able to purchase unpainted, unassembled kits for the minis. Should be dirt cheap in bulk and the game is about buying cardboard anyway, so it's not like FFG sales would get hit.
I agree with you there's nothing to be proud. I just think that if american companies benefit from taxpayers money (tax breaks, bail-outs, infrastructure built with tax money), then they should reinvest that money in USA by hiring americans. it's not that trading with other countries is bad, by all means I think it can be good. but if american companies outsource jobs to china to a significant degree, then they should go ask china when they need tax breaks, zero-interest loans from tax payers, and bail outs.
Well, they largely do get those benefits in China. It seems to me that that's essentially the point of the Free Trade Zones (at least on the tax breaks in the form of minimal import/export duties, available infrastructure, and artificially weak currency).
Given that FFG is now (by ownership) a French company, perhaps we should be happy that they've been so good as to outsource their product design and development to the United States. 
I agree with the OP. I personally would be willing to pay more for the game to be manufactured in a country that is not grossly, horribly evil.
No thanks. What's so proud about stuff getting manufactured in one place and not the other?
As long as the quality is matching the price, it's all good.
If anything, I'd love to be able to purchase unpainted, unassembled kits for the minis. Should be dirt cheap in bulk and the game is about buying cardboard anyway, so it's not like FFG sales would get hit.
I agree with you there's nothing to be proud. I just think that if american companies benefit from taxpayers money (tax breaks, bail-outs, infrastructure built with tax money), then they should reinvest that money in USA by hiring americans. it's not that trading with other countries is bad, by all means I think it can be good. but if american companies outsource jobs to china to a significant degree, then they should go ask china when they need tax breaks, zero-interest loans from tax payers, and bail outs.
Well, they largely do get those benefits in China. It seems to me that that's essentially the point of the Free Trade Zones (at least on the tax breaks in the form of minimal import/export duties, available infrastructure, and artificially weak currency).
Given that FFG is now (by ownership) a French company, perhaps we should be happy that they've been so good as to outsource their product design and development to the United States.
sorry for the outlandish off topic, but this made me think of the french fries freedom fries debacle. I imagined a modern day version where playing X-wing was somehow anti patriotic in USA, which would be hilarious in a sad way
I agree with the OP. I personally would be willing to pay more for the game to be manufactured in a country that is not grossly, horribly evil.
Well, that will leave you with very few options.
sorry for the outlandish off topic, but this made me think of the french fries freedom fries debacle. I imagined a modern day version where playing X-wing was somehow anti patriotic in USA, which would be hilarious in a sad way
French fries are named incorrect. They are named as such as American soliders in WW2 were in the French-speaking part of Belgium and thought to be in France!
I agree with the OP. I personally would be willing to pay more for the game to be manufactured in a country that is not grossly, horribly evil.Well, that will leave you with very few options.
sorry for the outlandish off topic, but this made me think of the french fries freedom fries debacle. I imagined a modern day version where playing X-wing was somehow anti patriotic in USA, which would be hilarious in a sad way
French fries are named incorrect. They are named as such as American soliders in WW2 were in the French-speaking part of Belgium and thought to be in France!
Yeah that was ol George dubya bush at his "best".
Dutch courage (gin) might be named corectly. (Altoug Belgium does produce some kick-ass jenever if may say so.)
I agree with the OP. I personally would be willing to pay more for the game to be manufactured in a country that is not grossly, horribly evil.
Doesn't that include America given its viewed as the number one threat to world peace.
