Everyone is pretty quiet.

It clarifies almost nothing?

Well I did get some strange text error. So there's my complaint, but it has nothing to do with ruling.

I'm sorry, but were we meant to complain?

I'll break the streak: I don't like the Rudor ruling. Making it contingent on having init is just plain odd, as it wildly changes his usefulness based on if one has init or not in ways that I think are thus-far unprecedented (I'm not counting PS ties here).

I'll break the streak: I don't like the Rudor ruling. Making it contingent on having init is just plain odd, as it wildly changes his usefulness based on if one has init or not in ways that I think are thus-far unprecedented (I'm not counting PS ties here).

Yeah that ruling makes him quite dead to us competitively.

Never been much for init bidding in non-Phantom lists either.

I'll break the streak: I don't like the Rudor ruling. Making it contingent on having init is just plain odd, as it wildly changes his usefulness based on if one has init or not in ways that I think are thus-far unprecedented (I'm not counting PS ties here).

It's a consequence of the change to how perform-this-attack-twice weapons work. How do you feel about that change?

Okay, I'll complain:

It doesn't clarify Fett's interaction with Extra Munitions
It doesn't clarify whether the VCX-100's special arc triggers "in arc" abilities from the rear when you don't have the ghost title
The Valen Ruder clarification is overly complicated, and it's going to lead to people playing him incorrectly

Okay, I'll complain:

It doesn't clarify Fett's interaction with Extra Munitions

It doesn't clarify whether the VCX-100's special arc triggers "in arc" abilities from the rear when you don't have the ghost title

The Valen Ruder clarification is overly complicated, and it's going to lead to people playing him incorrectly

Fett and Extra Munitions is absolutely clear as written. Fett instructs you to discard. Extra munitions says that when instructed to discard, you may discard the token. (in other words, go after deadeye or the droid instead)

An arc is an arc. The special arc still works for torpedoes without the title so no reason to assume it stops being an arc.

I've been to lazy to read it yet. Still dreaming about defenders.

Okay, I'll complain:

It doesn't clarify Fett's interaction with Extra Munitions

It doesn't clarify whether the VCX-100's special arc triggers "in arc" abilities from the rear when you don't have the ghost title

The Valen Ruder clarification is overly complicated, and it's going to lead to people playing him incorrectly

Fett and Extra Munitions is absolutely clear as written. Fett instructs you to discard. Extra munitions says that when instructed to discard, you may discard the token. (in other words, go after deadeye or the droid instead)

An arc is an arc. The special arc still works for torpedoes without the title so no reason to assume it stops being an arc.

The debate on Fett is that it instructs Fett's player to discard the card, it doesn't instruct the opposing player to discard it, which some think gets around the EM text.

I'll break the streak: I don't like the Rudor ruling. Making it contingent on having init is just plain odd, as it wildly changes his usefulness based on if one has init or not in ways that I think are thus-far unprecedented (I'm not counting PS ties here).

It's a consequence of the change to how perform-this-attack-twice weapons work. How do you feel about that change?

I think the change is foolish. TLT isn't a "smart system w/ Agency (like Gunner)," it's just a SPRAY and PRAY. 2nd attack isn't an option (like Gunner). It's just a SPRAY and PRAY.

Pre-FAQ, Rudor could see the SPRAY and get out of the WAY.

Post-FAQ, Fantasty Flight Games is making strange bubbling noises.

Rudor text change:

'After defending' changed to 'after an attack that targeted you'.

Would this fix the timing issue?

And why did Rudor need a nerf? It's so rude.

Extra munitions gets a token as well. Someone in another thread pointed that out. I guess that might matter on the ships with torps and missiles, but for toilet seats you go for the torp.

And Fett clearly states the attacker discards the opponent's card, so EM doesn't seem to have the proper trigger of that ship's player being instructed to discard. Unless there's some rule about players only discarding their own cards Fett can kill ordnance with EM tokens still on them.

Never really planned on playing Rudor anyway, certainly no reason to now. The Fett vs Extra Munitions could definitely use a clarification, though.

They also don't clarify if Fett takes a shield upgrade. Does he take the extra shield with him? Hull upgrade? Does he do an extra hull damage?

We know that things that get added to the ship stay even if the card is removed (VI, R2-D6) but we also know that the card was developed to destroy engine upgrades. Engine upgrade says you add the action to your bar.

So does killing an engine upgrade kill the action or not?

Not quite sure why initiative matters with Rudor. So if he doesn't have initiative he can't get out of arc? I'm assuming that my initiative would make me perform the second attack before he gets his action. It sounds dumb to make that based on initiative.

Rudor text change:

'After defending' changed to 'after an attack that targeted you'.

Would this fix the timing issue?

It's the exact same timing trigger (after defending vs after attacking) so it wouldn't change anything. Personally I have no issue with the change on rudor's end, initiative is how his ability should have always been triggered for simultaneous effects just like everything else. The two attacks thing could be questionable though...

An arc is an arc. The special arc still works for torpedoes without the title so no reason to assume it stops being an arc.

I agree, but at a couple of the tournaments I've been (including one at the FFG Game Center in Minnesota) to it's been ruled the other way.

These are not just corner cases; the Ghost and Boba Fett Crew are very popular in the meta right now. They need a clarification in the FAQ.

Rudor text change:

'After defending' changed to 'after an attack that targeted you'.

Would this fix the timing issue?

It's the exact same timing trigger (after defending vs after attacking) so it wouldn't change anything. Personally I have no issue with the change on rudor's end, initiative is how his ability should have always been triggered for simultaneous effects just like everything else. The two attacks thing could be questionable though...

The problem now is that TLT is counted as one big attack when that player has initiative, and two separate attacks with no initiative. BTL with TLT will now attack three times before Rudor or any other ship that acts after an attack gets their special ability to activate, which I'm sure is counter to original intent of those abilities. Now any Rudor list will have to bid 97 or 96 points just to be able to function, which pretty much throws this guy on the same pile as Fel's Wrath. Good luck releases any future pilots that react to being attacked.

Oh and the phrasing suggestion I proposed was merely to clarify the situation for any ships with similar abilities, because we really didn't need half of the cards saying (after attacking) and (after defending) and having the players guess that it's the same timing.

Really, Rudor's ability should have triggered as soon as he was declared a target and given him the chance to have an action before he first attack even resolves. Now THAT would be a great ability worthy of the Lil Baron.

They also don't clarify if Fett takes a shield upgrade. Does he take the extra shield with him? Hull upgrade? Does he do an extra hull damage?

We know that things that get added to the ship stay even if the card is removed (VI, R2-D6) but we also know that the card was developed to destroy engine upgrades. Engine upgrade says you add the action to your bar.

So does killing an engine upgrade kill the action or not?

Shield and Hull Upgrades each increase the appropriate value. If Fett deals a face-up card while the target still has a shield tokens it does not remove a token as it is possible to have shield tokens in excess of shield value. However, it does lower the maximum number of shields that an effect like R2-D2 or Miranda is able to regen. Losing a Hull Upgrade on the other hand does reduce the number of cards it takes to destroy a ship by one. Ditching Engine Upgrade would mean that the Boost Icon is no longer on the action bar.

Unless FFG indicates something that says otherwise, I don't think that there's anything special about those cards that makes them continue granting their effect after they leave play. The EPT droid or one of the titles that grants addition slots are a different case. You only need upgrade slots to equip upgrades. Once play has started losing the slot doesn't matter.

I think it was brought up in another post but the "after attacking" "after defending" ruling seems to be very interesting thinking of Whisper and Dengar.

Whisper with FCS, ACD and her ability has 3 "after performing an attack" triggers. So given the possibility that Dengar has initiative does this mean that Dengar could use his pilot ability and shoot back before Whisper gets to cloak, Targetlock and, if her attack has hit, a focus?

The Valen Rudor change brings him in line with the overriding rule of initiative determining the order of triggered effects. He was incorrectly ruled in his original FAQ entry.

I think it was brought up in another post but the "after attacking" "after defending" ruling seems to be very interesting thinking of Whisper and Dengar.

Whisper with FCS, ACD and her ability has 3 "after performing an attack" triggers. So given the possibility that Dengar has initiative does this mean that Dengar could use his pilot ability and shoot back before Whisper gets to cloak, Targetlock and, if her attack has hit, a focus?

Looks like double phantom with 86 point bid is gonna make a comeback

The wording for the TLT/Phantom interaction is awful, as now a bunch of people think it means the TLT has to be on the Phantom, not the Ghost.

And still no 'can Dengar shoot/R5-P8 when when destroyed' clarification.

The language on Valen Rudor is not grammatical and muddles his ability's timing even further:

ಠ_ಠ