...to be different then the herd mentality?

Is that necessarily a bad thing? If a number of players keep bringing differing and interesting lists that still do well, hopefully that will help diversify the meta - which can only be good for the game.

I only made mention of the mentality itself and didn't give any indication of it was something good or bad.

To be fair they played for fun. They were not friends, I'm sure you'd do the same if you were 13th going into round 6, and found out an ID would give you and your opponent a really solid chance at top 16

Not to be a jerk but the situation sounds extremely unsporting. I'd be very unimpressed if I were an attendee at this tourney. Two friends just conspired to use the rules to secure themselves a spot that one of them clearly didn't deserve. They even played the game to prove it. The Imp player should have played the match and taken his win.

I think you are mixing up two different players. I am not Mageshadow.

Josh is a friend of mine. He took an ID last round, risking his spot to possible secure a spot in top 16. Paid off.

I believe he didn't face a single u-boat or crack swarm build all day, and his only loss came from me (jax, wamp, OL and palp shuttle)

He did well, but got somewhat lucky with matchups throughout the day

Edit: I actually think 3 of his matches where palp aces or some mixture of that... which is all we practiced before the regional (its all I fly) so he had really good experience vs palp aces

But....that's impossible.....

will have to read this thread later. I've been of the opinion that the T-65 was in a lot better shape than people had been giving it credit for. Really glad to see this.

Sorry, not trying to call anyone out. I speak in general terms here. I'm sure it didn't seem unfair to the two players involved at the time, but in retrospect? It kinda seems like they should have played the match, regardless of whether or not that would have secured their spots. The point of a competition is to win based on the terms of the actual competition, not through cunning manipulation of the event schedule.

And not trying to downplay the X-Wing players skill either, but I think this shows more than anything the real effect of the Intentional Draw rule in that not one but two players were able to secure spots in a top ranking without having to play all their matches. How many more of the IDs went unreported to the community and how is it affecting the tournament scene? I saw an ID at my last tournament I hosted and by the gods how I wanted to tell those two to play their match! But, can't really countermand the rules or else they become meaningless right?

So, I'm sorry to be the Debbie Downer, but the real story here (for me anyways) is how Intentional Draws affect the tourney scene. I had to really wonder when they came out with that rule, what they were thinking. We thought the ID was supposed to be for people who had to leave because of an emergency or otherwise did not wish to continue playing, though we never really looked into it. When it happened at my event it was because both players realized they had no chance of making the cut and so they chose to ID and go get burgers. Still kinda silly, but hey, they paid the money so if they want to split on a meaningless game and get some lunch, then okay. In fact, no, now that I remember, if those two players had played their match one of them would have gotten the 8th spot and I wouldn't have had to form a bye! So ID screwed my event up too! Lol!

No, kudos to the X-Wing guy for taking an old man list and making it so far. Un-kudos to FFG for implementing a silly rule.

Having skimmed the lists for this event, I think that the most positive thing to take away is the sheer variety of lists that made the top tables. Really good to see!

Having skimmed the lists for this event, I think that the most positive thing to take away is the sheer variety of lists that made the top tables. Really good to see!

Most ships have a viable pilot at least now, the game meta is in a decent place I would say Even more so when Veterans is out.

Wave 1 all the way for me!

Do you think that's due to the high cost involved in buying into three U-boat list? Or do you think it's honestly a list that people are shying away from due to the stigma behind it and the inherent drive of some gamers to be different then the herd mentality?

If this was a store championship? Yes. Regionals? No, not really.

Sorry, not trying to call anyone out. I speak in general terms here. I'm sure it didn't seem unfair to the two players involved at the time, but in retrospect? It kinda seems like they should have played the match, regardless of whether or not that would have secured their spots. The point of a competition is to win based on the terms of the actual competition, not through cunning manipulation of the event schedule.

And not trying to downplay the X-Wing players skill either, but I think this shows more than anything the real effect of the Intentional Draw rule in that not one but two players were able to secure spots in a top ranking without having to play all their matches. How many more of the IDs went unreported to the community and how is it affecting the tournament scene? I saw an ID at my last tournament I hosted and by the gods how I wanted to tell those two to play their match! But, can't really countermand the rules or else they become meaningless right?

So, I'm sorry to be the Debbie Downer, but the real story here (for me anyways) is how Intentional Draws affect the tourney scene. I had to really wonder when they came out with that rule, what they were thinking. We thought the ID was supposed to be for people who had to leave because of an emergency or otherwise did not wish to continue playing, though we never really looked into it. When it happened at my event it was because both players realized they had no chance of making the cut and so they chose to ID and go get burgers. Still kinda silly, but hey, they paid the money so if they want to split on a meaningless game and get some lunch, then okay. In fact, no, now that I remember, if those two players had played their match one of them would have gotten the 8th spot and I wouldn't have had to form a bye! So ID screwed my event up too! Lol!

No, kudos to the X-Wing guy for taking an old man list and making it so far. Un-kudos to FFG for implementing a silly rule.

You must have been on vacation recently? The real story was two weeks ago and all this has been discussed ad nauseam, which is why people aren't really engaging in this aspect of the discussion.

Two relevant points: 1) Since then, FFG pretty much said that the ID probably doesn't work well with X-Wing and that we're going to likely see a significant change to the scoring system to make it so they aren't needed and 2) Until that time, they are legal and the intent was for them to be used this way.

Sorry, not trying to call anyone out. I speak in general terms here. I'm sure it didn't seem unfair to the two players involved at the time, but in retrospect? It kinda seems like they should have played the match, regardless of whether or not that would have secured their spots. The point of a competition is to win based on the terms of the actual competition, not through cunning manipulation of the event schedule.

Hey look, we're back on the topic of ID's.

Regardless of what you think - their legal, people can and do use them. They'll be gone by August. Let's not get into this conversation again.

With regard to the OP, it's commendable to make it so far and then go deep into the cut.

However, I tend to agree with the folks that one result like this doesn't mean much until we see it more consistently because sometimes things can just "go right" for a player in terms of matchups, dice, the way the standings fall, and -- in this case-- get some help from the ID. It's especially interesting since we know the result of the match and we wouldn't be talking about it all if it weren't for that rule I don't think.

Last year, a single regional was won with a Z95 missile swarm and a lot of people used it as an example of why ordnance wasn't broken, but we didn't see another ordnance heavy build win one, nor did we see them place at World's.

Still, though, kudos to the player for bringing it and doing so well with it.

One list, at one event, once.

Yep, case closed!

If you can fly, you can fly. If you can't, you go on the 'net and piss and moan about how things are broken and need fixing.

Not to be a jerk but the situation sounds extremely unsporting. I'd be very unimpressed if I were an attendee at this tourney. Two friends just conspired to use the rules to secure themselves a spot that one of them clearly didn't deserve. They even played the game to prove it. The Imp player should have played the match and taken his win.

I was there and frankly no one cared. The entire controversy regarding ID's is a bunch of whiny nonsense. You want to guarantee that it doesn't screw you over? Try winning more games...

Not to be a jerk but the situation sounds extremely unsporting. I'd be very unimpressed if I were an attendee at this tourney. Two friends just conspired to use the rules to secure themselves a spot that one of them clearly didn't deserve. They even played the game to prove it. The Imp player should have played the match and taken his win.

I was there and frankly no one cared. The entire controversy regarding ID's is a bunch of whiny nonsense. You want to guarantee that it doesn't screw you over? Try winning more games...

Oh look, it's the "durr hurr win moar" argument.

So you're saying you should be rewarded for winning less?

Brundon was one of the most popular baby names of 1984.

I got all excited thinking that this was a thread about the T-65 and I've never heard the name Brundon before.

Cheers

Baaa

I am Josh Breden and I would like to thank everyone who has contributed to this post. It brings me great joy to hear my list has created such conversation. To clear things up I did only make the top 16 but I believe I could have pulled another win I just made a flight error early in my first round of 16 that I never really recovered from. I went 4-1-1 in Swiss with no modified wins. My one loss was to my friend I traveled to Chicago with. He has never defeated my list in the games we played at home. He made a few good maneuvers that I was not expecting and beat me 100 to 14.... My friend and I started playing X-Wing this January so by the end of the day my adrenalin was pumping.

After having played five of the most intense games of X-Wing of my life I was offered an ID by my opponent. At this point I was making mistakes already and knowing the odds of me getting top 16 with the draw I spent time thinking it through and just as the round started I shook on it. There were several people behind me in ranking at the time that could have won games and passed me and landed me at 17 or lower. However I took the risk and thankfully it payed off.

The following day I faced Zachery and the first 30 minutes of the game no hits were landed with only one shot being taken. His list managed to get one of my ships and then he picked me off slowly. He beat me with a full health list (thanks Poe) I started to make mistakes and they all compounded and the pressure of wanting to do better to prove myself didn't help.

I love how many people at the tournament and on this forum have enjoyed seeing the XXXXZ list make it to the top 16 and it encourages me to think so many people think it took great flying to get me were I was.

Not to be a jerk but the situation sounds extremely unsporting. I'd be very unimpressed if I were an attendee at this tourney. Two friends just conspired to use the rules to secure themselves a spot that one of them clearly didn't deserve. They even played the game to prove it. The Imp player should have played the match and taken his win.

I was there and frankly no one cared. The entire controversy regarding ID's is a bunch of whiny nonsense. You want to guarantee that it doesn't screw you over? Try winning more games...

Oh look, it's the "durr hurr win moar" argument.

Yes. Yes. It is, foul Internet denizen. See I went to the event, how many regionals have you gone to? How many are you planning to attend? Did you go to adepticon? How about plain old store championships? Do you ever place high enough that this could ever affect anything other than your sense of honor? If so, then don't do it. But I'm guessing probably not.

As for the top 8 finish, he did an amazing job. And I think maybe if everyone's cool with it we can go back to talking about that.

It's super cool that someone made Top 8 with 4XZ, but that doesn't necessarily mean that it's a great list (in the current meta, at least). I mean . . . suppose that the X-Wing is half a point overcosted for what it does (just pulling that number out of my ass, mind you). That means that this player made Top 8 with essentially a two-point penalty in his 100-point list. To me, this says a bit more about player skill than list viability. Two points is hardly an insurmountable obstacle, and player skill is going to beat it out most of the time. However, once you get down to matchups with even player skill, those two points become REALLY important -- which might be why he made Top 8, instead of Top 4 or Top 2.

So basically . . . great job, well done. I like the X-Wing, and I think it's competitively viable, but not particularly well-suited to the current meta. Nice to see this list in Top 8, but I'm not calling it a winning ship until I see it win.

bump

I wonder how insufferable the 'T-65 is fine because my Canadian Girlfriend who works at Nintendo once came 8th in a tournament with it' crowd are going to be when Rebel Veterans is announced.

Next Challenge, win a tournament with 2 or more scyks

I am Josh Breden and I would like to thank everyone who has contributed to this post. It brings me great joy to hear my list has created such conversation. To clear things up I did only make the top 16 but I believe I could have pulled another win I just made a flight error early in my first round of 16 that I never really recovered from. I went 4-1-1 in Swiss with no modified wins. My one loss was to my friend I traveled to Chicago with. He has never defeated my list in the games we played at home. He made a few good maneuvers that I was not expecting and beat me 100 to 14.... My friend and I started playing X-Wing this January so by the end of the day my adrenalin was pumping.

After having played five of the most intense games of X-Wing of my life I was offered an ID by my opponent. At this point I was making mistakes already and knowing the odds of me getting top 16 with the draw I spent time thinking it through and just as the round started I shook on it. There were several people behind me in ranking at the time that could have won games and passed me and landed me at 17 or lower. However I took the risk and thankfully it payed off.

The following day I faced Zachery and the first 30 minutes of the game no hits were landed with only one shot being taken. His list managed to get one of my ships and then he picked me off slowly. He beat me with a full health list (thanks Poe) I started to make mistakes and they all compounded and the pressure of wanting to do better to prove myself didn't help.

I love how many people at the tournament and on this forum have enjoyed seeing the XXXXZ list make it to the top 16 and it encourages me to think so many people think it took great flying to get me were I was.

As a lover of all things X, congrats on a well played list. If you don't mind sharing, what did you have the most trouble with? How much use did the Z see (if say someone wanted to throw in some ord)?